dvcochran
Grandmaster
Yes, but I can think of a few late nights where the guy that was saying "I don't want to fight" just trying to get me to drop my guard. They already knew the fight was on in their mind.
We don't throw straight rights in street fights.
- Thread starter drop bear
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I'll keep distance away from strangers. If a stranger steps in, I'll step back. To prevent a problem from happening is much easier than to let a problem to happen and then deal with it.
When I was young, there were some local gang members who approached me and I moved back. later on I knew them well and they asked me, "Why did you keep moving back when we tried to be friend with you?" I told them, "I didn't know you guys that well."
Is that self-defense lesson number 1 - remain safe distance?
Even in punching range, if you lean back and kick your leg out, your opponent's fist still cannot reach to your face.
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There are more than 3 ranges.
Nobody can reach range.
Plus the three you talk about, but doubled, because that range is not the same for both people, unless they're the same size. You should train for what to do when your opponent can reach you, but you can't reach them.
Right that’s why you’re suppose to be prepared and with your hands out not in a fist.
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skribs
Grandmaster
Not sure whether to check "funny" or "agree".
skribs
Grandmaster
So...were you trying to pick the fight?
skribs
Grandmaster
I'll keep distance away from strangers. If a stranger steps in, I'll step back. To prevent a problem from happening is much easier than to let a problem to happen and then deal with it.
When I was young, there were some local gang members who approached me and I moved back. later on I knew them well and they asked me, "Why did you keep moving back when we tried to be friend with you?" I told them, "I didn't know you guys that well."
Is that self-defense lesson number 1 - remain safe distance?
Even in punching range, if you lean back and kick your leg out, your opponent's fist still cannot reach to your face.
So it's impossible to be snuck up on, or for someone to come in when you've got a wall next to you?
To be clear - I don't think anyone has a problem with the idea that a kick is longer range, or that you should maintain distance if you can. Last time someone tried to pick a fight with me over right-of-way on a one-lane road, I stayed in my car with the door locked and only cracked the window so there was a barrier between us.
The problem is this idea that you seem to be presenting that you can always stay at kicking range, which isn't true.
I can roll with that, though it's not the only usage I've seen.
In all the fights I had as a teen, I never got kicked. Hasn't happened in the few altercations I've had since, either. If they're good at kicking/sweeping, there's a threat from kicks and sweeps. If they're not, the threat is limited.To assume that you can enter the kicking range without being kicked or swept is not realistic.
Just adding a different perspective. For me I generally let this pass because most of the time it's stated within context. I don't know how he defines "clean punches" for me a clean punch is simply a punch that comes in without any resistance. So for me, you want to get in clean punches because those are going land without restriction. Usually when someone gets knocked out, it's because a punch came in clean without resistance.
Clean punches to him could mean "perfect form" punches. it just depends on how he spars because that's the context in which he's using the phrase "clean punches." People tend to use fighting related phrases based on how they train. Being someone who spars to learn. There's a ton of stuff that I do in sparring that I wouldn't attempt in a real fight. But there's also some things I've got down pat that I do in sparring that I would do in a real fight. This is the downside to one sided communications such as videos. Had He been in front of you, you could have asked him for clarification about. "I could do it like I am sparring and throw clean punches...."
Sometimes I think we have knee jerk reactions on certain things we see others explain.
I agree with this. There conflict where the other person wants to get the last word and look tough. For those type situations i would keep my hands open. Then there are cases where that person in front of you is determined to hit you and they don't care if your hands are open or not. I've seen it go both ways in my life and on video with others. There have been cases where me getting into a fighting position actually de-escalated the situation because the guy saw that hitting me wasn't going to be as easy as he saw it in his mind. So he backed off, and I opened my hands and backed down as well.
There have been cases where I got into a fighting position and a fight happened. There have been times when I turned my back and walked away the person tried to sucker punch me. When I teach self-defense I teach people to try to be able to recognize a person's intent. Do they really want to hit you are do they just want to talk big. If they want to talk big then keep hand opened. If they actually look like that want to hit you and they are sizing you up during the conversation. Create distance and get ready for an attack or initiate attack. (Keep in mind there's much more that goes on with and that I'm not being specific on all that goes on through this process.)
The hands up like you don't want to fight doesn't mean squat to me. As we saw in the OP's video. I'm more likely not to fight if the person back ups and creates distance. I'm more likely to think sucker punch attempt if the person puts their hands up and says "I don't want to fight." Once I hear this I immediately start watching out for a sucker punch. If the person really didn't want to fight they would disengage and create distance.
So yeah. If someone has the singular goal of hitting you then, it's coming. Just like this lady was attacked regardless of where her hands were.
Just depends on the distance you are at when the attack occurs.
Martial D
Senior Master
Sure. Real fights are all just kicking matches. The arms are just there to hold the camera
OP
OP
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Yeah but that is the same as not throwing straight punches because street fighting isn't done that way.
I'm not sure what that has to do with what I said, DB. What did I miss?
skribs
Grandmaster
That's what a go pro is for.
OP
OP
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
"In all the fights I had as a teen, I never got kicked. Hasn't happened in the few altercations I've had since, either. If they're good at kicking/sweeping, there's a threat from kicks and sweeps. If they're not, the threat is limited."
"I could do it like I am sparring and throw clean punches but ultimately that's not how street fights work."
Kicking is not what happens in a street fight. Straight punching is not what happens in a street fight.
Now admittedly I have seen both. But even if I hadn't I would not discount the mechanic if it can be shown to work.
Otherwise yes if they are good at kicking be more concerned about kicks than if they are not good at kicking.
isshinryuronin
Senior Master
I never meant that de-escalation efforts should not be undertaken, or cannot be successful. Most karate masters adhere to the concept of using force only as a last resort. But if an aggressor cannot be persuaded to de-escalate and is just wanting to punch somebody - he most likely will not be dissuaded by one's stance. (although there is the old story of the tea master who faced down a Samurai swordsman.) I have not been in hundreds of confrontations, but from the few I've been in or witnessed, most have involved pig-headed aggressors who really wanted to fight.
skribs
Grandmaster
I guarantee you that the several times people wanted to fight me and didn't, had I brought up my hands into a guard there would have been blows traded every time.
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