Um, wow, thanks for the rundown, but I'm married allready, sorry.
7sm
Um, wow, thanks for the rundown, but I'm married allready, sorry.
7sm
Yeah it was a little jokey joke there, but thats cool
J
JDenz
Guest
I think that people are underestimating the MMa fighters. I don't think any MMA stylests say traditional arts are crap. I think that is a great thing about MMA. They have to take things from every art to be succesful it is JKD really. It is slanted a little towards grappling, but I think the slant is going back to the stand up arts right now. Everything has weaknesses. If it didn't Bruce Lee would not have been cool, Everyone would still be doing Judo and Kung Fu would never have become the flavor of the decade late 60's- mid seventies.
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
I don't. I think MMA people over estimate and believe themselves to be on the same level as the UFC & PRIDE fighters.........which most are not.
Really? From the Forums I have seen that's ALL they seem to say.
I disagree. People have weaknesses...........arts do not. If someone can't make and art work that is their fault not the arts.
Example: Itosu went against an armed swordsman and won. Being unarmed is only a disadvantage if you think it is.........keeping your wits about you and finding their weakness is what it's about. People that say this art or that art has a weakness are just making excuses for their own lack of skill. Anyone that has seriously studied Sun Tzu's "Art of War" (required reading at all of the Military Academies....so I am told) will know what I am talking about.
"To know one thing well is to know ten thousand"
Miyamoto Musashi
If you have ever read any of the personal accounts by Lee's friends they all say pretty much the same thing.......Lee was a "winner". He worked his *** off on everyhing he set his mind to. True he did study other arts but the only place he used those arts was on the screen. He was even asked if it came down to a real fight would he use the stuff he does in his movies and he said "No".
ace
Master of Arts
I belive What Bruce said was
When it Comes to fighting
Baby U beter Use your whole body
Also he set The fight seens in Game of Deth to show his way.
He stoped working on it
When he got the ofer to do Enter the dragon.
Lee even got into a fight on the side lines
Guess What
He choked the guy out
Go Bruce.
When it Comes to fighting
Baby U beter Use your whole body
Also he set The fight seens in Game of Deth to show his way.
He stoped working on it
When he got the ofer to do Enter the dragon.
Lee even got into a fight on the side lines
Guess What
He choked the guy out
Go Bruce.
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
Which time was this?
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
From the accounts I read one of the stuntmen got "upitty" with Bruce and Bruce "punched" him out....(not choked).......and if I recall it was with a single punch.
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
Dont bother......it doesn't make any difference to me.
J
JDenz
Guest
Lol only matters when the facts help you lol. I am saying that MMA's are underestimited most come from strong backgrounds in TKD, Karate, and a few Kung Fu guys.
Bruce was into everything. If you think he only used KF you are mistaken. He trained with every, boxers, judo jean, Chuck Norris. Read his books sometime if you are seriously interested, read Linda's writtings about Bruce. He took what worked from everything and made it fit him. Tradition is good but things are alot diffrent then they were back in the day. Styles developed because of the conditions around them and that is what I think MMA comes from. I mean at no other time in the world's history could you find video lessons on everyone's art? Found out information on a style, patterns kata's in less then a 5 mintues with a good conection.
Bruce was into everything. If you think he only used KF you are mistaken. He trained with every, boxers, judo jean, Chuck Norris. Read his books sometime if you are seriously interested, read Linda's writtings about Bruce. He took what worked from everything and made it fit him. Tradition is good but things are alot diffrent then they were back in the day. Styles developed because of the conditions around them and that is what I think MMA comes from. I mean at no other time in the world's history could you find video lessons on everyone's art? Found out information on a style, patterns kata's in less then a 5 mintues with a good conection.
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
Help me in what way?
I asked which instance he was talking about, since I have heard of several, and I merely related that I had heard a different story.
K
Kirk
Guest
Bruce didn't even bother to wait till he mastered his wing chun
training. He put himself in top physical condition, that was a
huge goal of his, so again, he trained hard, which could be
the reason for his win/loss record.
R
RyuShiKan
Guest
OK, here is a hypothetical question for ya..........
Let's say Bruce is here today in his prime he enters a UFC or Pride or K-1 fight against let's say one of the following ......Bob Sapp, Peter Aerts, Sakuraba, Gracie..............
I for one think Bruce would get the crap kicked out of him.
Let's say Bruce is here today in his prime he enters a UFC or Pride or K-1 fight against let's say one of the following ......Bob Sapp, Peter Aerts, Sakuraba, Gracie..............
I for one think Bruce would get the crap kicked out of him.
OP
OP
LeeKrol
Guest
My personal opinion is that Bruce went to Brazil back in his day and threw down with the best guys over there he would have had some trouble.
As for today, I believe that is a somewhat impossible question to answer. Bruce would have learned all he could have about the ground, all he could have about Muay Thai, and wrestling. The competitors nowadays train in everything. The amount of information that can be acquired in today's world is far greater than the amount back in Bruce's heyday. You didn't see nearly the full cross-training of styles that we see today, you didn't have nearly the knowledge of human physiology and dietary supplements that we have today. I'm not saying that every competitor is scientifically engineered by Muscle-Tech but their training regimes are far more advanced. If Bruce had the all of these tools available to him, I can bet he would have been training with the Brazilian Top Team, or Chute Boxe, or Hammer House. To just pull him out of his time and throw him into the ring with today's best would result in a slaughter in my humble opinion.
But honestly, if he was in his prime with the tools that today's athletes have, I bet he would be effective. Just my opinion.
As for today, I believe that is a somewhat impossible question to answer. Bruce would have learned all he could have about the ground, all he could have about Muay Thai, and wrestling. The competitors nowadays train in everything. The amount of information that can be acquired in today's world is far greater than the amount back in Bruce's heyday. You didn't see nearly the full cross-training of styles that we see today, you didn't have nearly the knowledge of human physiology and dietary supplements that we have today. I'm not saying that every competitor is scientifically engineered by Muscle-Tech but their training regimes are far more advanced. If Bruce had the all of these tools available to him, I can bet he would have been training with the Brazilian Top Team, or Chute Boxe, or Hammer House. To just pull him out of his time and throw him into the ring with today's best would result in a slaughter in my humble opinion.
But honestly, if he was in his prime with the tools that today's athletes have, I bet he would be effective. Just my opinion.
OP
OP
LeeKrol
Guest
I think everyone here should agree that crosstraining is critical. Let's face it, all of the professional fighters crosstrain. They have to.
Every martial artist understands that styles have inheret weaknesses. A pure grappler could be in a lot of trouble against a really good striker. A pure striker could be in a would of trouble against a good grappler. Even the purest, most traditional martial artists have to concede that you must train for all situations, or you are not complete.
What if a striker got tackled from behind or the side and was on the ground before he got a chance to strike? What if a grappler (and his friends) are outnumbered? It would be silly for two or three grapplers to try and take down three or four guys, so they must know some striking to protect themselves. It would be difficult for a striker to escape even a freshman collegiate wrestler on the ground, so they must know some groundwork to at least get back to their feet.
Do grapplers and MMA guys think they are better than everyone else? I don't believe so, I believe that they feel they are more complete for real situations that more traditional styles. And they believe they prove it in the UFC, Pride, KOTC, etc.. To be honest, I think they do prove it. People say that the UFC, Pride, etc. are not street fights and that is true, but they're probably as close as you can come without pitfighting. I don't think anyone really believes that if you saw Vitor Belfort walking down the street that he would be vulnerable because he's "out of his element". Think that's crazy? That's the argument I hear though. "They need the cage to win", "They have rules in the ring so it isn't the same...". Whatever. They train to fight, and their arena is the televised competition.
Bottom line : Crosstrain. Crosstrain. Crosstrain. Don't sell yourself short by thinking you're never going to get taken down. Don't sell your students short by telling them if they train hard in their art no one will take them down and out of their element. Don't sell yourself short by thinking you're never going to have to throw hands, or you're never going to run into a guy you can't take down. Grapplers don't like to get punched in the face, so they train their stand-up game. Strikers don't like to be choked and armlocked, so they should train their ground game. Anyone who doesn't believe in crosstraining will fall victim to someone who does.
Every martial artist understands that styles have inheret weaknesses. A pure grappler could be in a lot of trouble against a really good striker. A pure striker could be in a would of trouble against a good grappler. Even the purest, most traditional martial artists have to concede that you must train for all situations, or you are not complete.
What if a striker got tackled from behind or the side and was on the ground before he got a chance to strike? What if a grappler (and his friends) are outnumbered? It would be silly for two or three grapplers to try and take down three or four guys, so they must know some striking to protect themselves. It would be difficult for a striker to escape even a freshman collegiate wrestler on the ground, so they must know some groundwork to at least get back to their feet.
Do grapplers and MMA guys think they are better than everyone else? I don't believe so, I believe that they feel they are more complete for real situations that more traditional styles. And they believe they prove it in the UFC, Pride, KOTC, etc.. To be honest, I think they do prove it. People say that the UFC, Pride, etc. are not street fights and that is true, but they're probably as close as you can come without pitfighting. I don't think anyone really believes that if you saw Vitor Belfort walking down the street that he would be vulnerable because he's "out of his element". Think that's crazy? That's the argument I hear though. "They need the cage to win", "They have rules in the ring so it isn't the same...". Whatever. They train to fight, and their arena is the televised competition.
Bottom line : Crosstrain. Crosstrain. Crosstrain. Don't sell yourself short by thinking you're never going to get taken down. Don't sell your students short by telling them if they train hard in their art no one will take them down and out of their element. Don't sell yourself short by thinking you're never going to have to throw hands, or you're never going to run into a guy you can't take down. Grapplers don't like to get punched in the face, so they train their stand-up game. Strikers don't like to be choked and armlocked, so they should train their ground game. Anyone who doesn't believe in crosstraining will fall victim to someone who does.
M
Master of Blades
Guest
I disagree. Professionals Cross train because they need to win and they fight against many diverce styles for money. they need to be aware to win. Most normal people just need to learn one style and once you get good in that you should be able to deal with an attacker anyway. Just my thoughts...:asian:
K
Kirk
Guest
UFC rules, as approved by the
Nevada State Athletic Commission
Weight classes:
1. Lightweight - over 145 lbs. to 155 lbs.
2. Welterweight - over 155 lbs. to 170 lbs.
3. Middleweight - over 170 lbs. to 185 lbs.
4. Light Heavyweight - over 185 lbs. to 205 lbs.
5. Heavyweight - over 205 lbs. to 265 lbs.
Bout duration:
1. All non-championship bouts shall be three rounds.
2. All championship bouts shall be five rounds.
3. Rounds will be five minutes in duration, with a one minute.
4. A one-minute rest period will occur between each round.
Fouls:
1. Butting with the head.
2. Eye gouging of any kind.
3. Biting.
4. Hair pulling.
5. Fish hooking.
6. Groin attacks of any kind.
7. Putting a finger into any orifice or into any
cut or laceration on an opponent.
8. Small joint manipulation.
9. Striking to the spine or the back of the head.
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow.
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
12. Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh.
13. Grabbing the clavicle.
14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck.
19. Throwing an opponent out of the ring or fenced area.
20. Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent.
21. Spitting at an opponent.
22. Engaging in an unsportsmanlike conduct that causes an injury to an opponent.
23. Holding the ropes or the fence.
24. Using abusive language in the ring or fenced area.
25. Attacking an opponent on or during the break.
26. Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee.
27. Attacking an opponent after the bell has sounded the end of the period of unarmed combat.
28. Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee.
29. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
30. Interference by the corner.
31. Throwing in the towel during competition.
Ways To Win:
Submission by:
1. Physical tap out.
2. Verbal tap out.
3. Technical knockout by the referee stopping the contest.
4. Decision via the scorecards, including:
- Unanimous decision.
- Split decision.
- Majority decision.
Draw, including:
- Unanimous draw.
- Majority draw.
- Split draw.
5. Technical decision.
6. Technical draw.
7. Disqualification.
8. Forfeit.
9. No contest.
Referee may Restart the round:
If the fighters reach a stalemate and do not work
to improve position or finish.
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