The Destroyer Style

[Chris Parker]

Hi Xue Sheng,

Just a note here, and when I found this out it came as a surprise to me as well, but there are Southern Chinese Martial Arts styles that trained to use a bench as a weapon since that was what would be readily available to them in a house, restaurant, bar, tea house of the time

Yeah, I've come across that idea as well. In Japanese arts Japan never really cottoned onto the concept of chairs, so there are a number of schools that give actions and movements from a position seated on the ground, and I have used these patterns to develop techniques for when seated in a chair.

But this is different to fighting "with" a table. I'm all for using the environment (aiming people at walls can be fun!), but deliberately thinking through ways of using a table or chair is more the realm of the Pro Wrestler, not the martial artist. The martial artist has internalised the principles of his art, and can adapt those principles to changing environments, they don't get caught up in "what if?" scenario-running, as that is inherrantly negative in terms of their development.

As to training weapons, I agree with what Chris is saying here since the same pretty much goes for Chinese weapons as well, we’re just not as formal about it as the Japanese stylists (You guys are WAAAAY to serious ). But even in CMA styles such as Xingyiquan levels are important and you need to fully understand one before you go on to the next if you ever hope to actually understand it and use it properly. And this stuff takes time…. A lot of time and if ones goal is to help others than one would, I believe, take that time to do it right

Too serious? TOO SERIOUS!?!?!? I'LL SHOW YOU SERIOUS!!!!!!!!

I mean, uh, yeah! What you said!

But alternative weapons are a good thing to think about later. Keys can be a weapon and tightly rolled up magazine can be a weapon and for that matter so can a hot cup of coffee.

We have a program we call "Travel With Confidence", and it involves use of a magazine in confined environments. Essentially it came from various plane flights, and is designed around an inflight magazine... that was a fun program. Love improvised weapons. But you are absolutely correct, that comes after you have trained in weaponry in the first place.

Another note based on CMA. A hammer fist if you are coming up against a properly trained Shaolinquan of Changquan person is devastating and you might want to take a defense against it a bit more seriously if you are going to demonstrate it. Also note if they are attacking with a hammer fist it is generally followed by many more hammer fists much the same as a 3 section staff with the body as the stationary staff and the arms as the ones coming at your head.

Oh yeah, I have been hit hard by hammer fists, and hit others hard with hammer fists myself, so I have no doubt as to what can be done with them. In fact one of our most commonly used tools in ground defence (particularly when in a top-position) is a hammer fist. You can generate an extreme amount of force with those things, and have far less risk of injuring your hand than with a straight fist.

My point was more that the particular example given was not a good choice, nor was it particularly well performed. But yeah, those things can hurt!

 

[MJS]

Cody,

I'm not even going to go through the last few pages, but I do want to say this. As I've said, you sound like your heart is in the right place. My suggestions, if you really want to give someone the most out of your efforst, would be the following:

1) People need a solid foundation. In other words, dont start them with techs. right off the bat. Stances, proper footwork, movement, proper technique with punching, kicking, etc.

2) Work at getting good with empty hand stuff first, then worry about weapons. Why? If someones basics suck empty handed, they're not gonna be any better with a weapon.

3) Much like empty hand, you need to know what you're doing with a weapon. That'll include movement, targets, etc.

4) Its always best to have some solid training in whatever it is that you're teaching. In other words...while it may seem pretty easy to say you'd just pick up a knife or any weapon and use it, fact is, if you're not using it properly, no sense in picking it up in the first place.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Hello Chris

But this is different to fighting "with" a table. I'm all for using the environment (aiming people at walls can be fun!), but deliberately thinking through ways of using a table or chair is more the realm of the Pro Wrestler, not the martial artist. The martial artist has internalised the principles of his art, and can adapt those principles to changing environments, they don't get caught up in "what if?" scenario-running, as that is inherrantly negative in terms of their development.

HEY!!!! Jackie Chan fights with tables, chairs, ladders, refrigerators, sacks-o-concrete and just about anything else…… um…err…. well…so what if it is for movie

It is good to be aware of ones environment, that is, IMO, one of the best ways to avoid a fight all together and the possibility of using what is around you is always there and that tends to start appearing after a few years of training anyway, and I would agree that one is approaching the WWE when it comes to fighting with tables and chairs (using as weapons not actually fighting a table and/or chair... but trees, well that's different ) But many years ago I started to think that later in ones training it might be a good thing to start to think about “what if” I was attacked right here and right now, how best to respond, admittedly I never even considered this until I read something from Bruce Lee that talked about this type of thinking. But a few years after that I began to think that using a what/if approach to training locked you into a response that is not necessarily what is needed for the situation at hand so I stopped and then just focused on training and trusting in what I had trained. But regardless early on one needs basics, basics and more basics and also, IMO, obsessing about the “What if” scenario will in the long run get you or someone else hurt or worse.

And to be honest if one is attempting to develop an MA for the Handicapped then I would think that using a table or chair for anything other than a barrier to place between you and the attacker would be entirely out of the question.

Too serious? TOO SERIOUS!?!?!? I'LL SHOW YOU SERIOUS!!!!!!!!

I mean, uh, yeah! What you said!

You see, you Japanese MA guys just need to lighten up a bit, us CMA guys are just happy go lucky all the time :EG:

Oh yeah, I have been hit hard by hammer fists, and hit others hard with hammer fists myself, so I have no doubt as to what can be done with them. In fact one of our most commonly used tools in ground defence (particularly when in a top-position) is a hammer fist. You can generate an extreme amount of force with those things, and have far less risk of injuring your hand than with a straight fist.

My point was more that the particular example given was not a good choice, nor was it particularly well performed. But yeah, those things can hurt!

Actually after I posted that I realized the pattern I was thinking about was more like hammer right fist, back right fist, hammer left fist, back left fist, hammer right fist, back right fist, etc. But there is a windmill type hammer fist attack as well.

I agree it was not a good choice and it was not done well either and my post, although admittedly far from clear, was directed more to Cody and not to you, But since I was being lazy and not separating posts well, or at all actually, I see I had your response in there as well, sorry about that

 

[jks9199]

The point of the videos is to show things that people could do, not have to do. No I do not watch wrestling I never could get past the bad acting. I am not saying that I have made it to any kind of level, or that I am an instructor. I show people defences that ask me for help.

Then you are instructing. Any you have the responsibility to know what you're doing if you're going to do it. Right now, you don't. You're interpreting how to help them based on poor understanding of real violence. (Can you name any good sources of information on real violence? I'm talking statistical analysis, or work by people who have really been there and done that. Yeah -- I have several sources in mind.) And your solutions are based on incomplete understanding of the martial sciences involved.

Keep in mind that an elbow can be used in many different ways. I do agree that somone could grab a person in a wheel chair, but unless they did it from behind they could just hit them in the groin.

I dare say I probably know more ways to use an elbow as an offensive or defensive weapon than you. It would be difficult for a person with limited mobility and muscle control to develop more than one or two effective elbow strikes because they will have to rely on their arm strength almost exclusively.

I will try to take more time to answer these question btw so you its easier to read. You can say I'm not an author or anything else, I don't really care. I will point out that if I am surrounded I am not going to worry about going to jail, so I would pick something up. I do tell people that its considered a weapon and they may get into trouble for it. However if they would rather get beat to death or die is up to them.
I don't really recomend killing anyone if you don't have to. I just recommend protecting yourself to the best of your abilities. If you are surrounded then you have to stop one person before you can move to the next. I base my strategies in life or death situations because I would rather be prepared for it. I hope you don't I'm saying if someone spits on you or something to go stomp him in the throat. Laugh it off and walk away as long as he doesn't attack you.

You really need to learn what you're talking about. Use of force law is complex, and takes effort to learn. And I personally would very much prefer not to go to jail... Maybe it's just me, but I'd rather know what is permissible or justifiable so that I have the best chance to avoid going to jail.

 

[MJS]

It would be difficult for a person with limited mobility and muscle control to develop more than one or two effective elbow strikes because they will have to rely on their arm strength almost exclusively.

Ya know, I was wondering the same thing myself. I for one, am looking forward to some video clips while seated, so we can have more to go off of.

 

[jks9199]

Ya know, I was wondering the same thing myself. I for one, am looking forward to some video clips while seated, so we can have more to go off of.

There are ways to throw elbows with great power from a seated position or the ground -- but to get any real power requires utilization of muscles that often aren't available or fully functional in a person who is confined to a wheelchair. Just sitting and leaning/twisting as a fully-able person, it's easy to miss how much work your lower body is doing to support your movements...

Years back, the TV show Hill Street Blues had a story arc where a detective had to go undercover in a wheelchair. At first, he was coached by a guy who was truly confined to the chair -- and the guy tore into the detective as the cop got out of the chair to lift it up over a curb... The point I'm trying to make with this story is that we can't simply "think" ourselves into a wheel chair or hold our arm still for a person with an impaired arm... You have to work with the person extensively to figure out what they can do. I had a classmate who had lost a lot of function in one arm because of a car crash. To help him, we would all sometimes simply hold our arm still -- but it wasn't quite the same, and we often had to resort to "give this a try" and then tweak as he worked with the technique. (Incidentally, he did earn his black belt as one of the first under the ABA's revised testing which includes a very demanding physical fitness test...)

 

[The Destroyer Style]

There are ways to throw elbows with great power from a seated position or the ground -- but to get any real power requires utilization of muscles that often aren't available or fully functional in a person who is confined to a wheelchair. Just sitting and leaning/twisting as a fully-able person, it's easy to miss how much work your lower body is doing to support your movements...

Years back, the TV show Hill Street Blues had a story arc where a detective had to go undercover in a wheelchair. At first, he was coached by a guy who was truly confined to the chair -- and the guy tore into the detective as the cop got out of the chair to lift it up over a curb... The point I'm trying to make with this story is that we can't simply "think" ourselves into a wheel chair or hold our arm still for a person with an impaired arm... You have to work with the person extensively to figure out what they can do. I had a classmate who had lost a lot of function in one arm because of a car crash. To help him, we would all sometimes simply hold our arm still -- but it wasn't quite the same, and we often had to resort to "give this a try" and then tweak as he worked with the technique. (Incidentally, he did earn his black belt as one of the first under the ABA's revised testing which includes a very demanding physical fitness test...)

This is a very good commen since point that I have been waiting for someone besides me to say. I have received alot of questions asking what if someone has a different disability then what I am use to. The only way to really know what I could help that person with, would be to meet them and see what they are capable of. If a person only has one arm its going to be a whole different set up for them, then someone in a wheelchair. You are also right about the lower body being activated when you move from sitting position. I myself move seat and all when performing certain actions. For someone who can't twist at the hips I would have to make another way for the technique to be affective. My goal is not to tell someone ( Hey you can't do that because of your handicap lets try something else.) its to help them find a way to do it anyway.

 

[The Destroyer Style]

Well arguments aside, I think your remit is laudable in trying to reconcile techniques from disparate arts that are relevant to people with a disability. So I say a genuine well done for what you are attempting!! Also I am glad you are facing your critics here without any aggression and with a degree of openness - and most people here are responding to your openness with constructive criticism, so long as you keep your art's claims to a modest level No new art can claim anything until it is tested and proven, yet that does not preclude it from EVENTUALLY upholding the claims it initially wants to make Patience and restraint I think

I would just like to suggest a few things maybe if that is ok? And you do not have to answer me, I have no argument to make only I want you maybe to have some things clear in your own head OK so if I were attending a new style specifically designed for say women, I might reasonably expect the oringinator of the style to be a woman also, no? To understand what I as a woman need from an MA I mean.. You know you have been asked for credentials for the various arts you have proficiency in.. To me, that would show itself one way or the other in your exposition of your new art.. I would rather know, without wanting to be overfamiliar.. if you yourself suffer or have suffered any incapacity that might qualify and temper your knowledge and your application and tuition of this new style? No, of course that is not a requisite and but I think it is relevant, no?

Also, I have some experience of mentoring people with disabilities and though they are as likely to want to take up a martial art as anyone, there are a great deal of concomitant difficulties for them that would translate into difficulties for you.. I just wonder do you have experience of teaching the people you are pitching your art at? And finally that would lead me to ask would you discriminate against the type of disability you can cope with? The nature of disability is a very widely encompassing term.. Not all fit the image you have painted of a wheelchair user with sound upper body mobility..

Again I seek no argument only I wish you good luck because I have not encountered anything so specific in this way, and but I think what you propose has merit if you get everything straight and have a willingness and commitment to follow through. So yes, good luck

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

I will try to answer your questions in order I'm sorry for not responding right away. I wanted to think on what you wrote before I answered. First I would like to say I feel it would be pointless to have aggression twoards anyone here. I think most of them are more concerned that I lack a certain knowledge and in more then some areas I do. I think we all do though, I am no better or worse then anyone. My reason for posting was hoping I could find some ideas or help to make what I am doing better and maybe help someone else. I will say that I feel the only way to prove what I am trying is to help someone with these problems over come them.

I would like for what I do to be helpful to all people not just target handicaps. I feel that the only real way to help someone is to help them make something their own. Alot of people can throw a punch, but not everyone throws it the same. What does not work for me could work for someone else. I have had alot of times in my life where I was unable to use my legs efficiently (walk/stand). This gave me alot of time to focus on how to approach things differently.

I did alot of physical therapy with my Grandma who was bedridden for over a year. She was a difficult person like me, so it was an argument the whole time . She eventually got strong enough to pick herself up and put herself in her wheelchair. She never fully recovered, but I think going from unable to turn over in bed to standing on a walker and picking your own weight up is a victory in itself. I also have multiple friends with handicaps and have helped them get stronger. Some of them I do teach techniques to, some just wanted help getting stronger. I have a very good friend named Will who is certified in personal training that has helped me with alot of questions. I do plan to become certified as a physical therapist.

If I don't know the answer to something I always try to find it for the person that asked me. If I knew someone who had problems with their legs as I did and still sometimes do. I would not expect them to be the same as me. I beleive in working at your own pace. I will try to give them a drive to want more, but will not tell them they have to be legendary in what they are doing. If what they learn can improve their lives and gives them just a little more confadence from day to day I think thats more important then anything. I will say that the only way I could really know how I might help someone would be to meet them in person. If I failed to help them I would do everything I could to find someone that can.

Thank you for you kindness

Cody

 

[The Destroyer Style]

To comment about the fighting with random objects. There are many different types of tables and chairs. I think you under estimate someone who has a wheelchair handicap. If they can physicaly hold up their own body weight picking up a folding chair, lawn chair, end table ect. Is well withing their physical abilities. You spoke about my maturity Chris and concerned about the violence I would teach someone. Wrestling teaches more violence in one hour then I could in a year. Not to mention the demoralization it causes in alot of kids.

I'm glad however that you are familiar with a folding chair. It can be used to keep an attacker back. When folded the it becomes a weapon with a good reach. That is important if you can't stand up. No, I don't mean swing it wild. Hold it by the legs in folded position and aim for knees like a knee kick. Aim for wrists if they have a weapon. Do you own a machedy? Weird question maybe haha. I do own one and guess what a folded up chair is longer. If I can out reach a machedy then definately a knife. That deffinatly will safe someone in a wheel chair. Also you think tables only come in one size? In many doctor offices, libraries, schools, ect. There are many different sized tables, chairs, books, even trash cans. It might be a joke to some of you, but it doesn't take alot of strength to pick these things up and use them.

If you are out on the street thing such as trash cans, pop cans, even sticks or (limbs from trees) lol can also be picked up . If you idea of using a random object in a fight is to just ram someone into it you think intirely to much inside the box. I also highly doubt running someone into a wall is fun for them, nor hitting them with hammer fists just for the record. You attacked my maturity and called my techniques flawed. I can be immature, and all techniques have flaws in one way or the other. I do however like to practice what I preach. Your bragging does indicate to me that you think very highly of yourself. I don't know all the ways to help someone, but I don't make a joke of others trying to help them. In the future if you can't be serious about trying to help, please just don't comment. There are alot of people that are giving good advice and I don't want to waste time talking to someone who is negative. If you can help someone help if not why waste time putting them down?

 

[Chris Parker]

Hi Cody,

To comment about the fighting with random objects. There are many different types of tables and chairs. I think you under estimate someone who has a wheelchair handicap. If they can physicaly hold up their own body weight picking up a folding chair, lawn chair, end table ect. Is well withing their physical abilities.

Fighting with random objects is possible after you have developed the base skills. You haven't spent anywhere near enough time in any school to have those base skills developed. As JKS said, there are various reasons people could be in wheelchairs, ranging from paraplegia, to quadraplegia, to debilitating syndromes such as cerebral palsy (which, as I said, one of our instructors in Sydney encountered in a student, and I have a cousin who has a form. My cousin is not confined to a wheelchair, although he was when he was younger, but the Sydney student was), so I do have a little experience in the restrictions that disabilities can give. However, I am not in a position where I would be confident creating a generic program for people with disabilities, and that is after more years training than you have been alive, my friend.

You spoke about my maturity Chris and concerned about the violence I would teach someone. Wrestling teaches more violence in one hour then I could in a year. Not to mention the demoralization it causes in alot of kids.

Demoralization? Actually, the WWE is considered quite a philanthropic organisation, with frequent visits to both hospitals to visit ailing children (through organisations such as Make-A-Wish), as well as a very close association with the US Military. They are considered a positive organisation, and use archetypal characterisations to instill concepts such as moral action through the use of Heels (the bad guys you boo on screen) and Baby Faces (the heroes, or good guys. The ones you cheer for).

It is also openly admitted to being pre-determined, hence their labeling themselves as "Sports Entertainment", yet still generate the ideals of fair play. If someone "wins" by cheating, or a short cut, it is made very clear to the audience that they have done so, and you then get to witness the results of such actions (retribution within their ilk). So you may be only looking at the surface there...

I'm glad however that you are familiar with a folding chair. It can be used to keep an attacker back. When folded the it becomes a weapon with a good reach. That is important if you can't stand up. No, I don't mean swing it wild. Hold it by the legs in folded position and aim for knees like a knee kick. Aim for wrists if they have a weapon.

Yeah, but not a good weapon. You are too open if you do swing it, and it is rather ineffective even as a barrier if you don't. And unless you are at a sporting event, they really just aren't that common. And there are too many "what if's" here, it really isn't an argument at all.

Do you own a machedy?

Do you mean a machette? If so, then no, I don't own one. Handled a fair few, though, and I'm more than familiar with them.

Weird question maybe haha. I do own one and guess what a folded up chair is longer. If I can out reach a machedy then definately a knife. That deffinatly will safe someone in a wheel chair.

No it won't. If you think it does keep someone with limited mobility safe when they are not swinging it around against someone with a knife or machette, then you have sadly misjudged your weapons.

To explain, if you are not swinging the chair, it becomes a dead object, and is doing nothing but occupying your hands. It can easily be grabbed (there is no edge to stop that happening), or simply knocked out of the way, leaving a wide opening for the knifeman, which can be taken in an instant. If it is being swung, then all the knifeman needs to do is judge his timing well, and you have the same thing. But even if it is being swung at me, I'm probably still going to knock it away with the (frankly) better weighted and better balanced machette, leaving the poor guy in the chair rather vulnerable.

But this is all "what if's", and I'm not fond of that game. It indicates a lack of understanding and confidence in your abilities to use your art. The very question "what if" implies that you need a specific answer to each and every situation, and that is not possible. If you truly understand your system, and have confidence in your ability to use and apply it, then the answer to any "what if" becomes "I use my art". And that is all there is to it.

Also you think tables only come in one size? In many doctor offices, libraries, schools, ect. There are many different sized tables, chairs, books, even trash cans. It might be a joke to some of you, but it doesn't take alot of strength to pick these things up and use them.

Well, depending on the table, it can take a fair amount of arm strength, especially if you have no use of your lower body to support it. Even the smaller coffee tables and end tables. Same goes with some chairs. As for trash cans, if we continue with the idea that the person is in a wheelchair, then the person will need to be close enough to reach it (and that will need to be pretty damn close), and be far enough from their attacker to reach over and get it before getting hit. Not easy. Oh, and you are getting into fights in the doctors office? Really?

If you are out on the street thing such as trash cans, pop cans, even sticks or (limbs from trees) lol can also be picked up .

From a wheelchair with no or limited lower bdy mobility, you may find a number of the things you listed may often be out of reach.

If you idea of using a random object in a fight is to just ram someone into it you think intirely to much inside the box.

Ha, no, that was merely one example. I can get quite creative...

I also highly doubt running someone into a wall is fun for them, nor hitting them with hammer fists just for the record.

Nope, not fun for them... but if they attack me... (DISCLAIMER: and if it's warranted based on the attack intensity, and other surrounding factors)

You attacked my maturity and called my techniques flawed. I can be immature, and all techniques have flaws in one way or the other.

Actually I haven't attacked you at all. I could, if you'd like...

What I have said, however, is that you lack the maturity in terms of martial arts. You are inexperienced, have some very limited ideas, have some techniques that do not perform the way you think they do, and do not yet have the knowledge to be able to differentiate that for yourself.

I could start to talk about the way you are not addressing such things as the rhythms that exist in a fight, the way you are not breaking or using that rhythm, the different mindset an attacker has to your training partner, and much more. But the best way for you to understand that is to get a lot more experience, and that will mean putting aside the idea of being a teacher, as you still have a lot left to learn, and are not allowing yourself to do that.

I do however like to practice what I preach. Your bragging does indicate to me that you think very highly of yourself. I don't know all the ways to help someone, but I don't make a joke of others trying to help them.

Again, believe me when I say that I am far from bragging here. I have instead been positively modest...

You, on the other hand, have decided that after very minimilist training you know better than all other martial arts and martial art instructors out the (without really knowing much about any of them at all), decide that because you haven't come across what you think things should be like it doesn't exist (without realising that exactly what you are looking for cannot exist, as it has far too many variables attached), and put yourself in the position of instructor/creator of a system, and still refuse to acknowledge that you have jumped in way too early in your development as a martial artist. Despite your claims to the contrary, that is one giant ego you're feeding there.

As for practicing what you preach, I have said nothing here that I don't back up. You have made some claims, and those claims have been shown to be lacking. The only thing I can see that you practice as well as preach is that you are genuinely trying to come up with this system for whatever reason. If your reasons are as you claim, then I have said from the beginning that I appreciate where you are coming from, but if you are genuinely interested in helping people in this way, get the education first. If you are not interested in getting the education, then I can only surmise that your reasons are not what you claim, and this is all about you wanting to feed your ego. You wouldn't be the first we have had here, you know.

In the future if you can't be serious about trying to help, please just don't comment. There are alot of people that are giving good advice and I don't want to waste time talking to someone who is negative. If you can help someone help if not why waste time putting them down?

I'm sorry, what do you think I've been trying to do? As I said in my first post on this topic, this is all meant to be taken positively, and is meant to help you. I'll boil it down though, because it seems that you want my help to be something different.

You want to help people. That is commendable, and I fully support the idea.

However, you have insufficient knowledge and experience to do what you intend.

Therefore, get more knowledge and experience in order to help people as you want to.

If you want my help to be just patting you on the back when you are giving yourself and others false senses of security, safety, and reality, then you really have come to the wrong place.

I suggest you go back and re-read my posts to you, but this time without trying to "read into" them. Just read them, and see what I have been saying all along. It's really been very sweetness and light...

 

[Omar B]

There's no talking to someone who's got a false sense of their own capabilities. That's why universities (and dojos) hand out certificates. So there's physical proof of experience held and rightly earned.

 

[Jenna]

I will try to answer your questions in order I'm sorry for not responding right away. I wanted to think on what you wrote before I answered. First I would like to say I feel it would be pointless to have aggression twoards anyone here. I think most of them are more concerned that I lack a certain knowledge and in more then some areas I do. I think we all do though, I am no better or worse then anyone. My reason for posting was hoping I could find some ideas or help to make what I am doing better and maybe help someone else. I will say that I feel the only way to prove what I am trying is to help someone with these problems over come them.

I would like for what I do to be helpful to all people not just target handicaps. I feel that the only real way to help someone is to help them make something their own. Alot of people can throw a punch, but not everyone throws it the same. What does not work for me could work for someone else. I have had alot of times in my life where I was unable to use my legs efficiently (walk/stand). This gave me alot of time to focus on how to approach things differently.

I did alot of physical therapy with my Grandma who was bedridden for over a year. She was a difficult person like me, so it was an argument the whole time . She eventually got strong enough to pick herself up and put herself in her wheelchair. She never fully recovered, but I think going from unable to turn over in bed to standing on a walker and picking your own weight up is a victory in itself. I also have multiple friends with handicaps and have helped them get stronger. Some of them I do teach techniques to, some just wanted help getting stronger. I have a very good friend named Will who is certified in personal training that has helped me with alot of questions. I do plan to become certified as a physical therapist.

If I don't know the answer to something I always try to find it for the person that asked me. If I knew someone who had problems with their legs as I did and still sometimes do. I would not expect them to be the same as me. I beleive in working at your own pace. I will try to give them a drive to want more, but will not tell them they have to be legendary in what they are doing. If what they learn can improve their lives and gives them just a little more confadence from day to day I think thats more important then anything. I will say that the only way I could really know how I might help someone would be to meet them in person. If I failed to help them I would do everything I could to find someone that can.

Thank you for you kindness

Cody

Dear Cody thank you for your reply.. I am not qualified to comment on your abilities, having not trained with you and but you are right.. I would imagine that there are people on forums who either come over as more proficient, or explicitly claim that they are more proficient in their arts than they doubtless are in reality. That you, on the other hand, are willing to admit your shortcomings and know that you can work on reinforcing your skill and expertise is a very sensible approach. I think you have the basis for a sound idea provided you are happy the workings of that idea are matched by your level of skill

I am sorry I do not have specific advice.. well I would suggest being picky about which advice you take.. I think there are some here who are genuinely trying to offer help, though I think there might be others keener only to pontificate.. you can smell it in the air haha..

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

 

[Tez3]

Jenna good post!
Destroyer Style should be congratulated on his calm posts whether one agrees with them or not, he has explained himself well and without resorting to insults etc. Stick around, it's nice to have you here!

On the subject of using whatever is around to defend yourself, Krav Maga makes a point of this and so does Bas Rutten if you look up his videos!

 

[Bruno@MT]

On the subject of using whatever is around to defend yourself, Krav Maga makes a point of this and so does Bas Rutten if you look up his videos!

I actually trained once in the same Gym as Bas's sparring partner Leon Van Dijk (hope I wrote that right). I can honestly say that I've never been so afraid of another fighter as of him. He could've broken my spine with those kicks...

I digress. Bas has indeed some very effective SD type stuff, but he has built it on a MA career that none of us here can match. He is a certified trainer in a couple of Martial arts. He has the experience to trim an art to specific conditions, such as gender, disability or whatever.

I would not expect someone without any accreditation, any long term training or same breadth of experience to be able to do the same.

 

[The Destroyer Style]

Krav Maga also seems really easy to do, I like that. It doesn't give you around about solution, it just gives you a straight to the point answer.

 

[The Destroyer Style]

Hi Cody,

I do appreciate your help. I just felt you took it as a joke when I spoke about using something as a table or chair to fight with. I will try to post a video with some of my chair ideas, so you can tell me what you think. I am seeking a new school btw, so don't think I'm not listening to you. People are just asking about what I have come with so far, that why I am sharing it. I did say in another post that I would have to meet a person to know what they are strong enough to do.
The techniques would change from person to person. I do agree also that someone with lack of arm strength may have trouble lifting a chair. I do beleive that if they have the ability to lift their own body weight, they can use a chair effectively. Not just by swinging it though, actually adding technique to it. It is hard to invision without seeing it. Soon as I get a third person to record I will put a video up.

Thanks Cody

 

[The Destroyer Style]

Ya know, I was wondering the same thing myself. I for one, am looking forward to some video clips while seated, so we can have more to go off of.

I have put up some techniques from sitting position with use of elbows. Keep in mind that this is somone who can turn their hips. On more then one occation I think you will see the twisting of my hips rocking the chair back and forth. I use a plastic chair because it would flip easier then a wheelchair. Soon as I can I will get a wheelchair that will strap my legs down and try these again. These are only a few ideas, I didn't have alot of time to put into it so it is also edited kind of sloppy also.
It is threw the same link as before. If you would please give me some ideas I would appreciate it.


Cody

 

[Xue Sheng]

Krav Maga also seems really easy to do, I like that. It doesn't give you around about solution, it just gives you a straight to the point answer.

You may want to also look at Systema as well

 

[MJS]

To comment about the fighting with random objects. There are many different types of tables and chairs. I think you under estimate someone who has a wheelchair handicap. If they can physicaly hold up their own body weight picking up a folding chair, lawn chair, end table ect. Is well withing their physical abilities. You spoke about my maturity Chris and concerned about the violence I would teach someone. Wrestling teaches more violence in one hour then I could in a year. Not to mention the demoralization it causes in alot of kids.

I'm glad however that you are familiar with a folding chair. It can be used to keep an attacker back. When folded the it becomes a weapon with a good reach. That is important if you can't stand up. No, I don't mean swing it wild. Hold it by the legs in folded position and aim for knees like a knee kick. Aim for wrists if they have a weapon. Do you own a machedy? Weird question maybe haha. I do own one and guess what a folded up chair is longer. If I can out reach a machedy then definately a knife. That deffinatly will safe someone in a wheel chair. Also you think tables only come in one size? In many doctor offices, libraries, schools, ect. There are many different sized tables, chairs, books, even trash cans. It might be a joke to some of you, but it doesn't take alot of strength to pick these things up and use them.

If you are out on the street thing such as trash cans, pop cans, even sticks or (limbs from trees) lol can also be picked up . If you idea of using a random object in a fight is to just ram someone into it you think intirely to much inside the box. I also highly doubt running someone into a wall is fun for them, nor hitting them with hammer fists just for the record. You attacked my maturity and called my techniques flawed. I can be immature, and all techniques have flaws in one way or the other. I do however like to practice what I preach. Your bragging does indicate to me that you think very highly of yourself. I don't know all the ways to help someone, but I don't make a joke of others trying to help them. In the future if you can't be serious about trying to help, please just don't comment. There are alot of people that are giving good advice and I don't want to waste time talking to someone who is negative. If you can help someone help if not why waste time putting them down?

Cody,

I'm not going to go into too much detail with my reply, as Chris already did a great job. Just a few things....

Again, I think you're missing a few things that we're all trying to say here. There is so much more than just saying, "I'll pick something up and use it." On the surface, yes, it seems pretty easy, but as its already been pointed out, a) we need to take into consideration exactly what the person in the wheelchair can/can't do, due to their limited mobility and b) environment will also dictate what we can/can't use as a weapon.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Cody,

I'm not going to go into too much detail with my reply, as Chris already did a great job. Just a few things....

Again, I think you're missing a few things that we're all trying to say here. There is so much more than just saying, "I'll pick something up and use it." On the surface, yes, it seems pretty easy, but as its already been pointed out, a) we need to take into consideration exactly what the person in the wheelchair can/can't do, due to their limited mobility and b) environment will also dictate what we can/can't use as a weapon.

HEY!!!! I said that Way back here

learn about different types of handicaps and the physical limitations and advantages of those

It is a very important point when developing an MA that is specifically geared towards the Handicapped. Just because a person that has no handicap and is in good physical condition can sit in a wheelchair and do something does not necessarily mean that a person confined to a wheelchair can.