Strating your own System, That is the Question???????

[tshadowchaser]

A rank in a system deminstrates determination and instruction from a qualified instructor.

not absolutly true. there are many instructors who almost give out to promote themsleves and their systems.
I have seen a couple of 7th degree shotokan people (at 35 years of age) whom I can't belive would have had that rank 20 years ago at that age. Also I have seen 10 year old 2nd degree black belts, Personaly I don't belive in that ) so these kids may make 5th degree befor they are 20. Bothof these examples in no way says the instructor is qualified or that the student is determined it only means that rank has been given.
Aside from that I know of a few people localy whom promote each other in their given organisations if the same rank is given to them in the other guys organisation. This is the "old boys club" doing it's McDojo ranking at it's upmost level of impress with rank theroy.

 

[D.Cobb]

I know an instructor, that trained for less than 3 full months with a self promoted GM(go figure :idunno: ) , and was promoted to 5th Dan in the GMs style. That was way back in the 1980s, but not a one of his students has managed to get past 4th Dan. How does that work?
I suppose I should point out that he was dan graded, 1st or 2nd in another style before this happened.

--Dave

 

[VSanhodo]

When I began this thread, I had no idea there would be such a response. I wanted to take a moment and thank everyone for taking the time to leave posts. I truly appreicate it.

Thanks again

San

 

[VSanhodo]

Lastnight I got a phone call from a former student of mine who now has his own school. Now first of all let me say, This guy trained with me for less than a yea. During that time he never was a regular. He would come once this week, skip two or three weeeks come twice etc. For some reason he thought I would be more than happy to help him by sitting on a judging panel. Seems he now runs his own school and now is a 5th Dan and the senior instructor of a system he calls BrazilianKempoJitsu. It seems this system is a combination of Kempo and JuJitsu and it is his little brain child.
Now whats even more pathetic to me is that he has 145 studnets he wants to test at the end of May. Now get this, He is going to test 145 students starting at 10 am and he said testing should end around 2pm. HOW??????????????
How in the hell do you test 145 ppl in 4 hours???? You dont. Ive said it beofre and I will say it again, Belts do 3 things.
1: they give the student a sense of accomplishment
2: they hold up your pants
3: they generate revenuse for the school.

Most but clearly not all ppl today are not interested in good martial arts they like fancy and flash but with no substance.
One examply I like to givewhich I think relates to quality of quanity.
Martial arts is like a birthday cake, most ppl really enjoy and seek out the prettiest most fancy, colorful birthday cake they can buy. Everyone likes the outside, the frosting. Its the prettiest and sweetest.
Now if you learn how to bake a cake you can literally bake thousands of different cakes. Once you have the foundation the rest is easier. Kinda like teaching a man to fish.
Thanks again folks, as always I look forward to yur posts.

San

 

[RRouuselot]

Lastnight I got a phone call from a former student of mine who now has his own school. Now first of all let me say, This guy trained with me for less than a yea. During that time he never was a regular. He would come once this week, skip two or three weeeks come twice etc. For some reason he thought I would be more than happy to help him by sitting on a judging panel. Seems he now runs his own school and now is a 5th Dan and the senior instructor of a system he calls BrazilianKempoJitsu. It seems this system is a combination of Kempo and JuJitsu and it is his little brain child.
Now whats even more pathetic to me is that he has 145 studnets he wants to test at the end of May. Now get this, He is going to test 145 students starting at 10 am and he said testing should end around 2pm. HOW??????????????
How in the hell do you test 145 ppl in 4 hours???? You dont. Ive said it beofre and I will say it again, Belts do 3 things.
1: they give the student a sense of accomplishment
2: they hold up your pants
3: they generate revenuse for the school.

That's just messed up........
Why don't you take him up on his invite and ask him to do a demo on you but knock HIM on his butt instead.
Maybe his 145 students will re-think their training.

 

[ninhito]

it sounds like hes rushing them through so he can just get his money and run...that's what gives martial arts its badd name right there...

 

[Goldendragon7]

I got a phone call from a former student of mine who now has his own school. This guy trained with me for less than a year, he never was a regular, would come once one week, skip two or three weeks come twice etc. he now is a 5th Dan and the senior instructor of what he calls BrazilianKempoJitsu (his little brain child).

For some reason he thought I would be more than happy to help him by sitting on a judging panel to test 145 students. "He's Pathetic"!!!
San

Interesting isn't it! I had a similar situation 20 or so years ago.. except that my guy only came to a bout 6 or so classes! A year or so later I get wind that he has opened a "realistic combat school" complete with hard core training with baseball catchers shins to be able to attack the legs etc.

He as well, had attracted quite a few students and what's more is he was charging double what I was and giving by far LESS!

One of my old students (a junior brown belt a couple of years prior) that was now studying with him dropped in and wanted to join our sparring class, I said ok but told a couple of my upper ranks to keep an eye on him ....... he sparred a few rounds (very respectfully) with a couple of students then Ipersonally matched up with him. We exchanged a bit..... and I told him that I don't see any difference in the skills that he left with from the "new" influence that he now is experiencing. He smirked, and then I really layed on some heavy combinations in which he was totally helpless and acquired a small cut above one of his eyes (quite by accident), I was really upset because we had to stop. I had no intention of any injury to him but just to "spar heavily" and I now was not able to continue to "spank" him...... really bugged me. LOL. So we went and butterflied his eye and talked a bit and he agreed that he had not advanced as he thought he had.

Just another example or story like many I have heard from Mr. Parker, Steve LaBounty, Tom Kelly, Frank Trejo, Bob White, and many others. This type of person will always be around.

Some say they are worthless.... I say not. We can always use them as bad examples!!

 

[DeLamar.J]

I think a persons credibillity is the #1 issue. If you hold a 1stdan, thats enough to catch the public eye and show that you have some martial knowledge. The main issue is your credibillity.
1.Can you kick some ***?
I know that sounds bad, but you better be able to walk the walk in front of your students.
2.Can you provide the right atmosphere people require?
Dragons on the wall, a little fountain, music, inscence, swords on the wall. All those things draw people in and make it more fun. It makes your school memorable. Even if its not that great of a school, you will have all of the toothless tigers in the martial arts paying you a monthly fee, and there are many of them.
3.Can you provide depth in your style to keep high ranking students?

These are just things off the top of my head.

 

[VSanhodo]

That's just messed up........
Why don't you take him up on his invite and ask him to do a demo on you but knock HIM on his butt instead.
Maybe his 145 students will re-think their training.

Hi Robert:
I know even Taika has had a few bad eggs, but until it happens to you. I have to say I am a little more than ticked. When he was my student he was fair at best and now he a 5th Dan. To his students he is amazing but in truth this guy is horrible. Someone recently said ppl like this fellow are what gives the Martial Arts a bad name. Hmmmmmm maybe I should go home and introduce him to my little friend (PAIN).

Take care and by the way thanks for your help.

San

 

[James Kovacich]

Again some one tell me how the language or the customs of the the parent country will make you a better martial artist? How long do we have to adopt another culture before we make the arts our own?? How long did Japan wait before making Te in Karate-How long did Korean wait before making Karate Tae Kwon Do??

I have to agree with this guys quote on another thread because it speaks the TRUTH.

I think Asia should STAY OUT of America's buisness. Our systems are no longer theirs. The Gracies PROVED just how weak all systems REALLY were and at that time Japan PROVED themselves to be weak. They didn't get better until years later after they CROSSTRAINED.

Watch the early Pride fights and the others that sprang up. There was almost no rules. NO EXCUSES! :uhyeah:

 

[arnisador]

Wow, 145 students in 4 hours...it's like a Rev. Moon wedding!

 

[arnisador]

Knowing the culture can help understand the reasoning behind the techniques in some cases but for the most part I agree. Still, for those who like the "art" in their martial arts, it can be fun to learn!

 

[rmcrobertson]

Good to know that, a) only getting into a ring matters; b) every good martial artist in Asia tried cage fighting.

 

[RRouuselot]

I have to agree with this guys quote on another thread because it speaks the TRUTH.

I think Asia should STAY OUT of America's buisness. Our systems are no longer theirs. The Gracies PROVED just how weak all systems REALLY were and at that time Japan PROVED themselves to be weak. They didn't get better until years later after they CROSSTRAINED.

Watch the early Pride fights and the others that sprang up. There was almost no rules. NO EXCUSES! :uhyeah:

This exact same post is # 146 and can be found at:
http://martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23373&page=3&pp=50

 

[47MartialMan]

not absolutly true. there are many instructors who almost give out to promote themsleves and their systems.
I have seen a couple of 7th degree shotokan people (at 35 years of age) whom I can't belive would have had that rank 20 years ago at that age. Also I have seen 10 year old 2nd degree black belts, Personaly I don't belive in that ) so these kids may make 5th degree befor they are 20. Bothof these examples in no way says the instructor is qualified or that the student is determined it only means that rank has been given.
Aside from that I know of a few people localy whom promote each other in their given organisations if the same rank is given to them in the other guys organisation. This is the "old boys club" doing it's McDojo ranking at it's upmost level of impress with rank theroy.

I was being sarcastic

 

[rmcrobertson]

Oh, my goodness gosh, there was a lot of boldface print on that thread!

And while I know very little about sokeships, and only somewhat more about the fantasy of becoming O-Sensei, I absolutely loved the comment of Don Roley's about breaking those chains of Asian tradition and disdaining Asian masters so that it became possible to:

"....put on chains made in America and start bowing to American masters."

That's what's really at stake, of course. Forcing everything that's important about martial arts into a choice between autocracy that comes out of a feudal world that's disappearing, and the new autocracy that comes out of modern capitalism. Forcing everything into a little tiny box that can be sold on Pay-Per-View. Or into "Extreme Martial Arts:" you know; little aluminum propeller blades for ESPN2. Oh, great--no wonder titles are for sale. What's that comment of Kensho Furuya's? About students today walking in the door expecting to buy knowledge, so no wonder so many martial arts teachers behave like shopkeepers?

"What parent in their right mind would turn their daughter into an outboard motor?"---Kurt Vonnegut
"Don't follow leaders, watch your parking meters."---Bob Dylan
"Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."---Pete Townshend

 

[47MartialMan]

That's what's really at stake, of course. Forcing everything that's important about martial arts into a choice between autocracy that comes out of a feudal world that's disappearing, and the new autocracy that comes out of modern capitalism. Forcing everything into a little tiny box that can be sold on Pay-Per-View. Or into "Extreme Martial Arts:" you know; little aluminum propeller blades for ESPN2. Oh, great--no wonder titles are for sale. What's that comment of Kensho Furuya's? About students today walking in the door expecting to buy knowledge, so no wonder so many martial arts teachers behave like shopkeepers?

:asian:



Yeah, how much is that doggy in the window? The one with "papers" is a better dog.

A dilema:
Gypt Mi Lee is a 5th Degree Black Belt with a school.
Bruce Dough is a 10th Degree Black Belt with a school a block away.

Does Johnny Public go to Gypt Mi Lee 'cause sterotyping "Asians" teach better?
Or-does Johnny Public go to Bruce Dough 'cause govern by math, a 10th degree has "double knowledge" than a 5th Degree?

 

[RRouuselot]

Watch the early Pride fights and the others that sprang up. There was almost no rules. NO EXCUSES! :uhyeah:

Hey I just watched PRIDE live on the T & V and Vito Belfour just got a good ol' fashoin *** whoopin' by a Muay Thai guy....isn't Muay Thai an "asian" art.....like you said NO EXCUSES!:321:

 

[RRouuselot]

:asian:



Yeah, how much is that doggy in the window? The one with "papers" is a better dog.

A dilema:
Gypt Mi Lee is a 5th Degree Black Belt with a school.
Bruce Dough is a 10th Degree Black Belt with a school a block away.

Does Johnny Public go to Gypt Mi Lee 'cause sterotyping "Asians" teach better?
Or-does Johnny Public go to Bruce Dough 'cause govern by math, a 10th degree has "double knowledge" than a 5th Degree?

Well you are the expert on getting ripped off.....twice was it? Whay don't you tell us.

 

[James Kovacich]

Hey I just watched PRIDE live on the T & V and Vito Belfour just got a good ol' fashoin *** whoopin' by a Muay Thai guy....isn't Muay Thai an "asian" art.....like you said NO EXCUSES!:321:

Like I said NO EXCUSES.

You left out the important part.
"The Gracies PROVED just how weak all systems REALLY were and at that time Japan PROVED themselves to be weak. They didn't get better until years later after they CROSSTRAINED."

Of course the rest of the world has caught up but that is only because they have accepted reality and have crosstrained ever since.

Your post is irrelevant. I clearly stated the EARLY and you referred to a current event.