So...Who's Teaching The Correct System?

[Carol]

Interesting Question ... I study with Mr. Hogan, who has been a direct student of Mr. Planas for about twenty years or so. Over on KenpoTalk, Jason just said he recognized Mr. Planas' influence on one of my comments, so I take that as a good thing. It means I am learning the material in the way my instructor's instructor teaches it.

I will say this, though. In 2003, Ms Cogliandro hosted the Kenpo internationals in Boston. I attended the Sunday workshops, and got to work with four senior Kenpo people. Each of the four instructors touched on 'Thundering Hammers' in their session. This was not by design or plan. But, it seemed that each of the instructors did something different. Some of which was so 'different' as to be outside of what I understood to be Kenpo at that time.

One of the instructors had us 'floating' on one foot at a time, rather than 'establishing a base', (Rule #1 according to Mr. Planas). It was so far out of what I understood to be Kenpo, I just worked as the 'dummy' for others during that session.

So, I don't know if what Mr. Planas teaches is 'The Correct System'. But, for the moment, he is my instructor's instructor. I have the privilege of taking private lessons with him when he comes to town. I hope I am learning his system correctly. Hopefully, that he served as Mr. Parker's Executive Vice President of the IKKA means that his system, is the system of 'American Kenpo'. But, regardless, if I can only connect it to 'Huk Planas', that's a strong enough connection for me.

As for others, and what they teach, well, maybe in the future, when I have internalized enough from Mr. Hogan and Mr. Planas, I will be able to properly evaluate what and why the others teach and train.

Not only that, Mike, but you do one helluva good job of explaining and interpreting the instructions to me. Not only do you understand, you can conceptualize it to someone you don't usually train with, someone that may (or may not) have different strengths, weaknesses, and learning patterns than the good folks that you are around all the time. :asian:

 

[Goldendragon7]

Reading some threads recently on KT and KN, I see debates regarding changing the material, improving things or keeping it the way it is, SL4, motion, commercial, how this person does a technique and why its right/wrong, etc. I even saw one post that was a reply to another member, stating that he was NOT doing American Kenpo!

So, my question is, with all of the various instructors out there, who is teaching the true way?

Is Mr. Conatser teaching an effective method of Kenpo?

So, how about some clarification...who's teaching the right way?

Mike

Well, this is a no brainer............ We are of course!
%-}

 

[Doc]

It appears a couple of the comments could be attributed to me, or my lineage, so let me address a couple of the questions/statements.

As far as I can tell, the “American Kenpo” comment comes from me. I know of no one who actually does “American Kenpo” as Mr. Parker envisioned it, however that is a semantical disagreement based on my knowledge of what Mr. Parker did at the time, what he was going to do, and what he meant.

Briefly when he left the Chinese Kenpo interpretation, he began his quest to create his own version of “Chinese Kenpo,” and he termed it “American Kenpo.” Personal issues interrupted him almost immediately and he scrapped his public pursuit of “American Kenpo” in favor of the commercial produced and designed “Kenpo-Karate.”

Some have chosen to refer to Kenpo Karate as “EPAK” on the internet, even though Mr. Parker himself never used the term. He was very careful about how, and what he attached his name. He wanted “American Kenpo” to be embraced by all martial artist for its American Values and perspectives, and therefore carefully avoided ‘Branding’ it with his name.

“Kenpo Karate” was what he ended up promoting for personal reasons, and for this he did add his name to promote his schools and the then “NEW” method of teaching to the general public. This method was unique for its conceptual approach and actually had no hard basics, nor did Parker teach any. “Kenpo Karate” and “American kenpo” are completely different entities.

American kenpo was Parker’s rigid basics driven system that was a work-in-progress. You can check the progress of this system by examining footage of Mr. Parker over the years. Clearly, he changed in his persona approach, methodology, and execution. The later material in the eighties he performed was light years from what he had done earlier, and includes many of the mechanisms I speak of like BAM's and PAM's clearly there.

However in contrast, if you examine the commercial motion material he performed in the sixties, there is no significant difference in what is being taught today. There may be a few more moves or a change in angle, but it is essentially UNCHANGED from the sixties.

How can you tell which is which? Easy. Mr. Parker actually demonstrated all of the techniques on film personally in the late sixties specifically to be used as reference material in regions of the country where he didn’t get very often. Others and I have that material. (Many have visited me have seen it)

I also have the original film he made with Chuck Sullivan archived on film reels from the fifties. To support my position, Parker re-shot the entire commercial system again in the seventies on video for the same reasons of “standardization” with Jim Mitchell and asked me, (and others) to archive the commercial reference material. However, none of this material is Mr. Parker’s intended American Kenpo.

Then Mr. Parker created his “Advanced American kenpo Concepts video Series” that featured my students Tommy Chavies, and Curtis Faust, along with Ernie George, and briefly even a slimmer me. I was the announcer as well on the two vids. Here Mr. Parker began to give a hint of his American Kenpo as he moved toward codifying basics for the first time. These tapes were to create a ‘bridge’ between the commercial, and his true American Kenpo, and contain elements of both.

Although now, I doubt most will understand, or even care about semantical misunderstandings of a man most didn’t even know. Nevertheless, as my friend, I know this meant a lot to him and it needed to be said regardless.

I’ve often seen many attribute this “secret kenpo” lie to me personally. (Not suggesting anyone here did). I have never said this, but it seems to be repeated often that only I was given the true kenpo. Crap. Others have suggested they were that last final 3, 4, 12 or whatever to study with Mr. Parker, therefore they know the ‘real’ material. While this group actually existed, the number and material is nebulous at best.

The commercial system was being STANDARDIZED to rectify the many inconsistencies that had appeared over the years in this motion system, and to take advantage of the publicity anticipated from Jeff Speakman’s debut in the “Perfect Weapon.” Nothing new, only STANDARDIZED

I always find it interesting that Dennis Conatser’s name is never mentioned, and I don’t know anyone who knows or understands this material better than he. Once he came onto the scene, I ran into Dennis at the house more than anyone, yet he’s never included in any of “the groups.” Rich Hale was also there even before Dennis, and he and I consistently ‘bumped’ into each other. Parker even stated he wanted him to be my training partner, yet he’s never mentioned in any of the “groups.” The reason is Mr. Parker was standardizing material with many people, and not everyone knew whom else he was teaching, and not everyone was learning the same thing as Parker worked on various aspects of his arts with many people for reasons of his own.

I introduced my student Pat Silantri, and set up his lessons with Mr. Parker. Barbara Hale, Jeff Speakman, and Brian Hawkins all were the “three” in their own group with Mr. Parker in this process, but they were also students of Larry Tatum. Something many conveniently forget. So was Frank Trejo who was teaching Paul Mills. My Student Tommy Chavies was also in a separate group apart from my own study. The Flores Brothers has a group as well, along with many others. You get the idea. To suggest that Mr. Parker at some point only taught three or 4 people the ‘good stuff’ before he passed is ludicrous. He was indeed trying to standardize the business aspect of kenpo with many.

I have stated my training and study with Mr. Parker was different from my perspective, but I never suggest I knew everyone he taught or what he taught them. I only claim responsibility for my own lessons, which clearly were different from most. If others don’t understand what I teach, than I guess they had different lessons than I.

So, who’s teaching the true Kenpo? All of us, but that don’t mean they are all equal in depth, content, or effectiveness.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

It appears a couple of the comments could be attributed to me, or my lineage, so let me address a couple of the questions/statements.

As far as I can tell, the “American Kenpo” comment comes from me. I know of no one who actually does “American Kenpo” as Mr. Parker envisioned it, however that is a semantical disagreement based on my knowledge of what Mr. Parker did at the time, what he was going to do, and what he meant.

Briefly when he left the Chinese Kenpo interpretation, he began his quest to create his own version of “Chinese Kenpo,” and he termed it “American Kenpo.” Personal issues interrupted him almost immediately and he scrapped his public pursuit of “American Kenpo” in favor of the commercial produced and designed “Kenpo-Karate.”

Some have chosen to refer to Kenpo Karate as “EPAK” on the internet, even though Mr. Parker himself never used the term. He was very careful about how, and what he attached his name. He wanted “American Kenpo” to be embraced by all martial artist for its American Values and perspectives, and therefore carefully avoided ‘Branding’ it with his name.

“Kenpo Karate” was what he ended up promoting for personal reasons, and for this he did add his name to promote his schools and the then “NEW” method of teaching to the general public. This method was unique for its conceptual approach and actually had no hard basics, nor did Parker teach any. “Kenpo Karate” and “American kenpo” are completely different entities.

American kenpo was Parker’s rigid basics driven system that was a work-in-progress. You can check the progress of this system by examining footage of Mr. Parker over the years. Clearly, he changed in his persona approach, methodology, and execution. The later material in the eighties he performed was light years from what he had done earlier, and includes many of the mechanisms I speak of like BAM's and PAM's clearly there.

However in contrast, if you examine the commercial motion material he performed in the sixties, there is no significant difference in what is being taught today. There may be a few more moves or a change in angle, but it is essentially UNCHANGED from the sixties.

How can you tell which is which? Easy. Mr. Parker actually demonstrated all of the techniques on film personally in the late sixties specifically to be used as reference material in regions of the country where he didn’t get very often. Others and I have that material. (Many have visited me have seen it)

I also have the original film he made with Chuck Sullivan archived on film reels from the fifties. To support my position, Parker re-shot the entire commercial system again in the seventies on video for the same reasons of “standardization” with Jim Mitchell and asked me, (and others) to archive the commercial reference material. However, none of this material is Mr. Parker’s intended American Kenpo.

Then Mr. Parker created his “Advanced American kenpo Concepts video Series” that featured my students Tommy Chavies, and Curtis Faust, along with Ernie George, and briefly even a slimmer me. I was the announcer as well on the two vids. Here Mr. Parker began to give a hint of his American Kenpo as he moved toward codifying basics for the first time. These tapes were to create a ‘bridge’ between the commercial, and his true American Kenpo, and contain elements of both.

Although now, I doubt most will understand, or even care about semantical misunderstandings of a man most didn’t even know. Nevertheless, as my friend, I know this meant a lot to him and it needed to be said regardless.

I’ve often seen many attribute this “secret kenpo” lie to me personally. (Not suggesting anyone here did). I have never said this, but it seems to be repeated often that only I was given the true kenpo. Crap. Others have suggested they were that last final 3, 4, 12 or whatever to study with Mr. Parker, therefore they know the ‘real’ material. While this group actually existed, the number and material is nebulous at best.

The commercial system was being STANDARDIZED to rectify the many inconsistencies that had appeared over the years in this motion system, and to take advantage of the publicity anticipated from Jeff Speakman’s debut in the “Perfect Weapon.” Nothing new, only STANDARDIZED

I always find it interesting that Dennis Conatser’s name is never mentioned, and I don’t know anyone who knows or understands this material better than he. Once he came onto the scene, I ran into Dennis at the house more than anyone, yet he’s never included in any of “the groups.” Rich Hale was also there even before Dennis, and he and I consistently ‘bumped’ into each other. Parker even stated he wanted him to be my training partner, yet he’s never mentioned in any of the “groups.” The reason is Mr. Parker was standardizing material with many people, and not everyone knew whom else he was teaching, and not everyone was learning the same thing as Parker worked on various aspects of his arts with many people for reasons of his own.

I introduced my student Pat Silantri, and set up his lessons with Mr. Parker. Barbara Hale, Jeff Speakman, and Brian Hawkins all were the “three” in their own group with Mr. Parker in this process, but they were also students of Larry Tatum. Something many conveniently forget. So was Frank Trejo who was teaching Paul Mills. My Student Tommy Chavies was also in a separate group apart from my own study. The Flores Brothers has a group as well, along with many others. You get the idea. To suggest that Mr. Parker at some point only taught three or 4 people the ‘good stuff’ before he passed is ludicrous. He was indeed trying to standardize the business aspect of kenpo with many.

I have stated my training and study with Mr. Parker was different from my perspective, but I never suggest I knew everyone he taught or what he taught them. I only claim responsibility for my own lessons, which clearly were different from most. If others don’t understand what I teach, than I guess they had different lessons than I.

So, who’s teaching the true Kenpo? All of us, but that don’t mean they are all equal in depth, content, or effectiveness.

Thanks for the insight as always. Though you always have many detractors their 'stories' are never as coherent as yours which makes you wonder. Take care sir.

Hawkman

 

[hongkongfooey]

I don't know who has the "true Kenpo", but I can say that I like what I am doing now. I train at a Parker/ Planas lineage school. There are differences in some of the techniques that I am learning now compared to some of the techniques that I learned when I went to a school that taught the model listed in Infinite Insights. Things seem to work better for me this time around.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

1. As far as I can tell, the “American Kenpo” comment comes from me. I know of no one who actually does “American Kenpo” as Mr. Parker envisioned it

2. Some have chosen to refer to Kenpo Karate as “EPAK” on the internet, even though Mr. Parker himself never used the term.

3. “Kenpo Karate” was what he ended up promoting for personal reasons, and for this he did add his name to promote his schools and the then “NEW” method of teaching to the general public. This method was unique for its conceptual approach and actually had no hard basics, nor did Parker teach any. “Kenpo Karate” and “American kenpo” are completely different entities.

4. The later material in the eighties he performed was light years from what he had done earlier, and includes many of the mechanisms I speak of like BAM's and PAM's clearly there.

5. I also have the original film he made with Chuck Sullivan archived on film reels from the fifties. To support my position, Parker re-shot the entire commercial system again in the seventies on video for the same reasons of “standardization” with Jim Mitchell and asked me, (and others) to archive the commercial reference material. However, none of this material is Mr. Parker’s intended American Kenpo.

6. Then Mr. Parker created his “Advanced American kenpo Concepts video Series” that featured my students Tommy Chavies, and Curtis Faust, along with Ernie George, and briefly even a slimmer me. I was the announcer as well on the two vids. Here Mr. Parker began to give a hint of his American Kenpo as he moved toward codifying basics for the first time. These tapes were to create a ‘bridge’ between the commercial, and his true American Kenpo, and contain elements of both.

7. Although now, I doubt most will understand, or even care about semantical misunderstandings of a man most didn’t even know. Nevertheless, as my friend, I know this meant a lot to him and it needed to be said regardless.

8. I’ve often seen many attribute this “secret kenpo” lie to me personally. (Not suggesting anyone here did). I have never said this, but it seems to be repeated often that only I was given the true kenpo. Crap.

9. I always find it interesting that Dennis Conatser’s name is never mentioned, and I don’t know anyone who knows or understands this material better than he. Once he came onto the scene, I ran into Dennis at the house more than anyone, yet he’s never included in any of “the groups.” Rich Hale was also there even before Dennis, and he and I consistently ‘bumped’ into each other. Parker even stated he wanted him to be my training partner, yet he’s never mentioned in any of the “groups.”

10. The reason is Mr. Parker was standardizing material with many people, and not everyone knew whom else he was teaching, and not everyone was learning the same thing as Parker worked on various aspects of his arts with many people for reasons of his own.

11. To suggest that Mr. Parker at some point only taught three or 4 people the ‘good stuff’ before he passed is ludicrous. He was indeed trying to standardize the business aspect of kenpo with many.

12. I have stated my training and study with Mr. Parker was different from my perspective, but I never suggest I knew everyone he taught or what he taught them. I only claim responsibility for my own lessons, which clearly were different from most. If others don’t understand what I teach, than I guess they had different lessons than I.

13. So, who’s teaching the true Kenpo? All of us...

1. Interesting. He didn't say "no one but I", he said "no one". I wonder how long it will be before this gets turned into a "Chapel sez he da only one" accusation.

2. You know, Doc...you're going to ruffle a lot of feathers with observations such as these, and have to contend with legions of angry EPAKkers.(???)

3. See #2

4. In my brief exposure, these were definitely present. They had not yet been codified, but were in his performance of kenpo. I expect, yet again, that simple act of noticing a difference, then accentuating it in your SL4 will be the cause of much criticism by the kenpo masses. Personally, I am glad that somebody caught these, and that their inclusion in the kenpo body of knowledge did not slip.

5. Again, see #2.

6. Not having been viewed by the masses, more will undoubtedly protect their investments by denying either the validity of these having been made, or argue that there was nothing new/worth knowing/different from the mainstreamed models. See #2.

7. Many could call him a teacher, a few could call him a mentor. Fewer still could call him friend. I, for one, appreciate your willingness to keep your commitment to your friend.

8. From the horses mouth. But that will, undoubtedly, be forgotten for convenience.

9. There are a lot of good guys, more "in the know" than most, who stay under the radar. By many accounts, Mr. Conatser would be at the house before the final 4 got there, and after they left. Maybe he was only drinking tea with Mr. P, and issues of kenpo never came up? Mr. Hale certainly never had access to Mr. Parkers insights or ideas. (sarcasm, people...)

10. Truer truth never told. But again, see #2. There is no benefit for the legions to believe in anything other than thier own interpretation of the bible. Pardon me...kenpo.

11. See #2. And 10. And...aw hell..what's the point (see last part of 10).

12. This is far too rational an assessment to be, well, rational. See #2.

13. Corpus Edmundi? Any set of ideas can only live on in the minds of those who entertain them. Again...too much sense.

Glad to hear from ya, Doc. Send food from the BBQ.

Regards,

David W. Crouch, proud semi-student of the mad professor (if I could be there more, I surely would).

 

[hongkongfooey]

Doc,

Any chance of converting those tapes to DVD?

 

[Bode]

Doc,

Any chance of converting those tapes to DVD?

Damn, now you've gone and done it. He's already waiting for oh, about a dozen, other DVD's for me to convert. (Have to by a new burner... Mac). Burning is simply a pain in the a*&. It works on all my DVD players, but not on Doc's.... frustrating.

 

[Doc]

Doc,

Any chance of converting those tapes to DVD?

I know Conatser has them as well, so you might try him. My plates a bit full right now and my students resources are stretched for more important things for us. And to be honest if I gave it some thought, I'm not sure I wouldn't have some reservations about making DVD's and distributing them. They are not for sell.

When I get our new site up and running however, I'm considering putting bits and pieces as examples in a section on commercial/motion Kenpo. The tapes I have include everything. All the forms through 5, and sets 1, 2, and 3 that existed at the time, along with the extensions. All supervised by Mr. Parker whose voice can be heard calling the different techniques and sets in the background, although at no time does he appear on camera.

 

[Kenpojujitsu3]

When I get our new site up and running however, I'm considering putting bits and pieces as examples in a section on commercial/motion Kenpo.

Careful Doc! You might offend someone with articles like that, LOL!

 

[hongkongfooey]

I know Conatser has them as well, so you might try him. My plates a bit full right now and my students resources are stretched for more important things for us. And to be honest if I gave it some thought, I'm not sure I wouldn't have some reservations about making DVD's and distributing them. They are not for sell.

When I get our new site up and running however, I'm considering putting bits and pieces as examples in a section on commercial/motion Kenpo. The tapes I have include everything. All the forms through 5, and sets 1, 2, and 3 that existed at the time, along with the extensions. All supervised by Mr. Parker whose voice can be heard calling the different techniques and sets in the background, although at no time does he appear on camera.

Doc,
Sometime, I'm gonna have to pick you brain about the good old days.
I would love to hear some of your stories.

Dave

 

[Doc]

Doc,
Sometime, I'm gonna have to pick you brain about the good old days.
I would love to hear some of your stories.

Dave

They were indeed interesting and different times sir. A lot of the guys have some great stories. Some, like Dennis Conatser or Frank Trejo, are great story tellers.

 

[Doc]

Careful Doc! You might offend someone with articles like that, LOL!

Yeah you're right. I stay up nights worried I might offend somebody who started commercial kenpo in the early eighties after I had been a black belt over two decades.

 

[Goldendragon7]

Yeah you're right. I stay up nights worried I might offend somebody who started commercial kenpo in the early eighties after I had been a black belt over two decades.

Ah Haaaaaaa !!!!!!!!!:idea:

Now I know why you're starting to forget things....... dementia is starting to set in at your ripe ole' age...... hmmm early eightys, black belt for 2 dedades, then the 90's now 2006..... HOLY Cow Batman you are ancient!

(couldn't resist) hee hee

:asian:

 

[Doc]

Ah Haaaaaaa !!!!!!!!!:idea:

Now I know why you're starting to forget things....... dementia is starting to set in at your ripe ole' age...... hmmm early eightys, black belt for 2 dedades, then the 90's now 2006..... HOLY Cow Batman you are ancient!

(couldn't resist) hee hee

:asian:

Speak of the devil .....

That's what I get for mentioning his name.

 

[Rich_Hale]

It's always interesting to read what Doc has to say about Mr. Parker and the good old days.

I do remember Dennis being a serious student of Mr. Parkers back then, but as for me I was just there to rummage around in Mr. Parkers basement for old Elvis Presley memorabilia.

And yes, Mr. Parker did suggest that Doc and I be partners, but I thought he meant Ron was going to help me go through the basement and set up the Ebay account.

I really got to start paying closer attention to details!

 

[MJS]

No you're not because no one on KN likes your Thundering Hammers. LOL.

In all seriousness there is no one right way. There are several ways. Some valid some not so valid. But I have yet to the see the one true method.

Train, practice, study, repeat.

Good point. That being said, if its working for you, if its something that you're enjoying, then that is IMO what should matter most. Afterall, its that individual person doing the training.

Mike

 

[MJS]

Mike,
If I were you, I'd listen to Huk. To everyone that says there is more than one way to do a technique, I say you only know 1/3 of what you think you do. Now, before anyone cries foul, read on. If you come from an Iron Worker lineage, there are three ways to do a technique, (yellow excluded) the base way, the extension, and then the equation variations. The problem comes in when people take the base technique they really don't understand, I've touched on levels of knowing before, decide it is flawed and change it. This shows an incredible shallowness of knowledge. I don't care who you are, if your Delayed Sword looks like crap, then I'll tell you, it looks like crap. It doesn't matter if you alter the timing, or regulate the power, crap is crap. That is what far too many people today are doing, crap. They crap on the techniques, they crap on their instructors, and then they crap on their students. So what's the point of my little tirade? If you have not been taught the base technique correctly, then the rest of it is crap and you need to get a refund.

Good points. But considering that we can have 5 people all doing the technique differently, whats going to determine who is doing the base technique correctly or not? I'm not saying that we should totally disregard the basics, due to the fact that is what gives the foundation for the rest of the material. Maybe I'm misreading but are you referring more to a slight adjustment or totally altering the technique in favor of something else?

Mike

 

[MJS]

Well that is the reason I have not posted over there since. I have a lot of respect for many of the people on that forum but have a hard time with some of the things that were said.

Well, this was one of the reasons why I started this thread...to have some discussion and get some things out in the open. There are so many people out there teaching, I think its good to see what's out there, and decide for yourself what suits you best.

Mike

 

[MJS]

It appears a couple of the comments could be attributed to me, or my lineage, so let me address a couple of the questions/statements.

As far as I can tell, the “American Kenpo” comment comes from me. I know of no one who actually does “American Kenpo” as Mr. Parker envisioned it, however that is a semantical disagreement based on my knowledge of what Mr. Parker did at the time, what he was going to do, and what he meant.

Briefly when he left the Chinese Kenpo interpretation, he began his quest to create his own version of “Chinese Kenpo,” and he termed it “American Kenpo.” Personal issues interrupted him almost immediately and he scrapped his public pursuit of “American Kenpo” in favor of the commercial produced and designed “Kenpo-Karate.”

Some have chosen to refer to Kenpo Karate as “EPAK” on the internet, even though Mr. Parker himself never used the term. He was very careful about how, and what he attached his name. He wanted “American Kenpo” to be embraced by all martial artist for its American Values and perspectives, and therefore carefully avoided ‘Branding’ it with his name.

“Kenpo Karate” was what he ended up promoting for personal reasons, and for this he did add his name to promote his schools and the then “NEW” method of teaching to the general public. This method was unique for its conceptual approach and actually had no hard basics, nor did Parker teach any. “Kenpo Karate” and “American kenpo” are completely different entities.

American kenpo was Parker’s rigid basics driven system that was a work-in-progress. You can check the progress of this system by examining footage of Mr. Parker over the years. Clearly, he changed in his persona approach, methodology, and execution. The later material in the eighties he performed was light years from what he had done earlier, and includes many of the mechanisms I speak of like BAM's and PAM's clearly there.

However in contrast, if you examine the commercial motion material he performed in the sixties, there is no significant difference in what is being taught today. There may be a few more moves or a change in angle, but it is essentially UNCHANGED from the sixties.

How can you tell which is which? Easy. Mr. Parker actually demonstrated all of the techniques on film personally in the late sixties specifically to be used as reference material in regions of the country where he didn’t get very often. Others and I have that material. (Many have visited me have seen it)

I also have the original film he made with Chuck Sullivan archived on film reels from the fifties. To support my position, Parker re-shot the entire commercial system again in the seventies on video for the same reasons of “standardization” with Jim Mitchell and asked me, (and others) to archive the commercial reference material. However, none of this material is Mr. Parker’s intended American Kenpo.

Then Mr. Parker created his “Advanced American kenpo Concepts video Series” that featured my students Tommy Chavies, and Curtis Faust, along with Ernie George, and briefly even a slimmer me. I was the announcer as well on the two vids. Here Mr. Parker began to give a hint of his American Kenpo as he moved toward codifying basics for the first time. These tapes were to create a ‘bridge’ between the commercial, and his true American Kenpo, and contain elements of both.

Although now, I doubt most will understand, or even care about semantical misunderstandings of a man most didn’t even know. Nevertheless, as my friend, I know this meant a lot to him and it needed to be said regardless.

I’ve often seen many attribute this “secret kenpo” lie to me personally. (Not suggesting anyone here did). I have never said this, but it seems to be repeated often that only I was given the true kenpo. Crap. Others have suggested they were that last final 3, 4, 12 or whatever to study with Mr. Parker, therefore they know the ‘real’ material. While this group actually existed, the number and material is nebulous at best.

The commercial system was being STANDARDIZED to rectify the many inconsistencies that had appeared over the years in this motion system, and to take advantage of the publicity anticipated from Jeff Speakman’s debut in the “Perfect Weapon.” Nothing new, only STANDARDIZED

I always find it interesting that Dennis Conatser’s name is never mentioned, and I don’t know anyone who knows or understands this material better than he. Once he came onto the scene, I ran into Dennis at the house more than anyone, yet he’s never included in any of “the groups.” Rich Hale was also there even before Dennis, and he and I consistently ‘bumped’ into each other. Parker even stated he wanted him to be my training partner, yet he’s never mentioned in any of the “groups.” The reason is Mr. Parker was standardizing material with many people, and not everyone knew whom else he was teaching, and not everyone was learning the same thing as Parker worked on various aspects of his arts with many people for reasons of his own.

I introduced my student Pat Silantri, and set up his lessons with Mr. Parker. Barbara Hale, Jeff Speakman, and Brian Hawkins all were the “three” in their own group with Mr. Parker in this process, but they were also students of Larry Tatum. Something many conveniently forget. So was Frank Trejo who was teaching Paul Mills. My Student Tommy Chavies was also in a separate group apart from my own study. The Flores Brothers has a group as well, along with many others. You get the idea. To suggest that Mr. Parker at some point only taught three or 4 people the ‘good stuff’ before he passed is ludicrous. He was indeed trying to standardize the business aspect of kenpo with many.

I have stated my training and study with Mr. Parker was different from my perspective, but I never suggest I knew everyone he taught or what he taught them. I only claim responsibility for my own lessons, which clearly were different from most. If others don’t understand what I teach, than I guess they had different lessons than I.

So, who’s teaching the true Kenpo? All of us, but that don’t mean they are all equal in depth, content, or effectiveness.

Doc, thanks for the well thought out reply. I'd have to say that much of the confusion comes into play during the discussion of a technique. Now, I'm not sure if the differences are your own changes or if your version of a technique is the way that Mr. Parker had originally intended the technique to be. The Raining Claw thread on KT, the video clip of the SL4 version of Delayed Sword would be two apparent differences in the way the material is applied. I personally, have not heard any mention of anyone else doing the things you're doing, so I can see how that would lead one to think that you had some 'secret' teachings.

Thanks again to everyone for all of the great posts! I look forward to continuing this discussion.

Mike