Self Defense VS Combative Art?

[Hawke]

Is there a difference between a self defense art versus a combative art?

If so what are the differences?

Some might say the differences are in the intention. Self defense focuses on escape while a combative art focuses on fighting.

Can they be used both for self defense and combat? Can a self defense art be a combative art? Can a combative art be an effective self defense art or will it become a liability because of the legal system?

 

[Doc_Jude]

Is there a difference between a self defense art versus a combative art?

If so what are the differences?

Some might say the differences are in the intention. Self defense focuses on escape while a combative art focuses on fighting.

Can they be used both for self defense and combat? Can a self defense art be a combative art? Can a combative art be an effective self defense art or will it become a liability because of the legal system?

I don't think that any art is a purely "self defense art". Sorry, I just don't think that they exist. Now, some arts are wound down to resemble something that could conceivably be called a self-defense art, such as aikido, jujutsu, or any other art marketed as such, but even such an art as Jujutsu, often thought of as strictly a grappling art, traditionally contained plenty of striking(punching & kicking) and offensive set-ups. Many arts have practitioners that believe that their arts are strictly for defense, & they may be taught such, but it isn't the case.

Nevertheless, IMO, an art that is practiced as a "combat art" can be applied in a less-than-lethal manner, while a "defensive art" is a bit more difficult to apply lethally.

 

[D Dempsey]

The biggest difference is intent and mindset, the techniques are probably exactly same.

 

[searcher]

The biggest difference is intent and mindset, the techniques are probably exactly same.

I concur.

IMO, SD is about defending. It may end up with death for the attacker, but most likely, it will not. Getting away from an attacker.

Combative would be more on the mindset of killing, as it relates to the battlefield. Neutalizing enemy combatants and the like.

This is just how I see it in an oversimplified manor.


Mindset IS the key, as D Dempsey stated.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Combat art or Self-defense art!?!? What is the difference?

An art defined as a combat art is also a self defense and an art called a self-defense art can be used for Combat. ANd some of the so called self defense arts of today were originally combat arts; "Jitsu" became "Do" or things like Xingyiquan

Military Sanda is a combat art but it is trained to defend yourself against someone who is trying to kill you, and make it so they will never do it again. But it can also be used on the street in any city to defend yourself against a mugger. However it cares little for the guy you are fighting or the laws of the land you are fighting in.

Aikido could also be used in Combat if need be but it cares a bit more for the guy you are fighting.

I guess the only difference I see is the view of the other guy.

 

[Sanchin-J]

Any art can be self defense as long as the person who uses the techniques they have learned responsibly, we had a huge conversation in another section of the forums about this subject hehe.

 

[still learning]

Hello, JUST wording......most martial arts teaches you to use what needs to be use....(some like to think there art is more aggressive?

the escaping methods, control methods , and the destroy methods...each part is connected....it is up to the user to determine the outcome. Each can be consider "self-defense" or "combat"

Hence...self-defend against attacter ...verbal diffusions...escape if grab..control the attacker...if need? ...than the last outcome "destroy" or to end the confrontations!

Some people refer to as "self-defense" others like to use the words "combat" . NO such things as a self-defence "Punch"? or combat Punch...both can be the same thing! Same with kicking and other techniques....strike to groin! is a self-defense technique or a combat attack!

Martial arts has many names......Run-a-tei, the art of moving away...quickly (kata is 3 miles long)

Aloha

 

[Kacey]

The biggest difference is intent and mindset, the techniques are probably exactly same.

I agree completely - it depends on your intent and mindset. Any technique can be turned to either offense or defense. Like fire, which can heat a home or destroy it, any technique can be used offensively or defensively - and often which one it ultimately turns out to be will depend on the response of the other person as much as the technique itself.

 

[chinto]

ok, here is my two cents worth....
a martial art is by its nature combative, but some are more self defense and life and death oriented then others. the ones that are basically combative but not self defense and survival oriented tend to be sport centered more so then the first.
BJJ for instance, would in my mind be combative, but not so survival and self defense oriented as say some of the traditional older samurai styles of jujitsu. some of the Karate styles are again more sport oriented then others, and the same can be said for just about any type or style of martial art.

This does also depend on the instructor and the student and very much on the intent of the student as far as how he or she trains and what emphasis the instructor and student put on that arts techniques and all.
so you can have say a shotokan dojo that is very very much oriented towards life and death combat in self defense of themselves and others, or you my have a dojo in the same style that teaches basically nothing but point sparring and tournament techniques. the same could be said about jujitsu of several styles and even about Judo that was invented with sport in mind, but a good kodokan judoka who has been training with self defense in mind might really surprise some people as to how dangerous some of their techniques really are. I know that many of the Okinawan Karate styles taught traditionally and properly are very very efficient and effective in self defense of the practitioner and others, also quite lethal if need be. I know that to be true of many of the older styles of jujitsu and any of the older traditional arts. Please remember that they were developed at great cost in time and even lives in actual combat .. the survivors taught what they had learned and built upon what had come before from other lands and their own ...

so almost any art is both depending on intent and the use.

 

[crushing]

To add to the other sentiments, I think the words 'Combat' or 'Combative' can also be a marketing term to help make the product sound more impressive or appealing to potential consumers/practitioners of a system or art.

Please don't misunderstand that as necessarily being a bad thing, or that good marketing must automatically be indicative of an ineffective self-defense system.

 

[Mark Lynn]

Is there a difference between a self defense art versus a combative art?

If so what are the differences?

Sitting home sick with the super flu so I'll take a stab at this.

I do believe there can be differences between the two. A combative art could be something that is like what the military teaches in their programs. I think the Marine Corps have developed a Combative Military Art program for their soldiers that is focused on tactics used for dealing with enemy soldiers.

The importance here is it in the stated objective goals of the instruction, the method of instruction chosen, the techniques that are chosen to support the overall objectives of the system, then the instructors are trained to support the overall goals and they begin teaching the troops. The troops are then trained in a limited number of techniques that can be learned in a short time and drilled and drilled and they do this in different enviroments with different types of gear etc. etc. and everything is rolled up to (including rifle and hand gun training) into them being able to defend themselves and their fellow soldiers. But on top of just defending themselves these skills are also possibly used in meeting the military's objective of taking that country, protecting our country, securing that hill, taking that street or clearing that house. But the hand to hand training, weapon to hand training etc. etc. is designed to support the military's objectives. Any military system is like this to some degree.

Then you have military based programs that were altered for civilians. Say Krav Maga, these are systems that take out the stuff that wouldn't be right for civilians (say sentry killing techniques) and teach more self defense type training. But again the objective has changed more to personal self defense instead of hold that site at all costs (hit them and run away instead of stay here and fight at all costs even death).

Pure self defense related systems don't care about, sparing, dueling, historical techniques, historical styles, masters, grandmasters, ranks, etc. etc. or anyone else but self preservation first and foremost. They don't care about getting in top physical shape (per say) but rather getting their objective met which is not getting assaulted, attacked, threatened, etc. etc. in the first place. So in a sense self defense/protection takes on a different mentality involving not only the mental and physical aspects (in regards to the purely physical reponses of defense against assaults) but also the minimazation of threat exposure before the assualt as well.

Some might say the differences are in the intention. Self defense focuses on escape while a combative art focuses on fighting.

Can they be used both for self defense and combat? Can a self defense art be a combative art? Can a combative art be an effective self defense art or will it become a liability because of the legal system?

I think the differences are instead of intention (if you mean the amount of force or how it is applied) it is rather the objective. In the one it is the person's survival, in the other it is the unit's, military's, goal being met with the person's secondary.

But can the techniques contained within both systems be used, are the techniques similar or the same? For the vast majority (95%+) I would think yes. A very small percentage of the military or the Combative systems, probably not.

 

[Guardian]

Is there a difference between a self defense art versus a combative art?

If so what are the differences?

Some might say the differences are in the intention. Self defense focuses on escape while a combative art focuses on fighting.

Can they be used both for self defense and combat? Can a self defense art be a combative art? Can a combative art be an effective self defense art or will it become a liability because of the legal system?

I perfer to think of them as interchangeable. While they may differ in their respective names, they can be the same, depends on what you take and how you apply it. I have to agree that their is no pure self-defense art, every art has a strike, kick or hold or whatever that makes it combative in nature itself.

Self defense by it's very nature is combative to some extent for in order to escape in some circumstances means taking action (Combative) to escape.