Self defense against a knife

[Cyriacus]

As our Arnis class is moving into knife defence, I would like to beg everyones indulgence and try to reopen the dialog. I would like to hear about specific approaches in teaching this material that are "reality based", simple, and oriented towards maximizing one's survival. I also think it would be helpful to hear about real life situations and how they evolved. I'm hoping to find ways of increasing situational awareness as well as realistic defense techniques.

You can find lots of people doing that out there to get information from. Most of them all say the same thing: Your chances of survival are low, youre working to increase them as best you can. I cant remember if theyre very good, but Nick Drossos (google him) basically orients all his stuff around knife defense.

 

[grumpywolfman]

Distance

 

[verbatim]

I feel like, assuming you aren't able to diffuse the situation in a nonviolent way, the best way to proceed would be to focus on temporarily disabling the knife to give room for a takedown (or stomach punch/groin shot and run, I don't see myself doing a full takedown and keeping an eye on where he has the knife). Grabbing the knife hand is dangerous for obvious reasons, but what about blocking the knife itself. I feel like a bundled up hoodie could possibly take a thrust and give you enough time to get inside his range. Thoughts?

 

[K-man]

I feel like, assuming you aren't able to diffuse the situation in a nonviolent way, the best way to proceed would be to focus on temporarily disabling the knife to give room for a takedown (or stomach punch/groin shot and run, I don't see myself doing a full takedown and keeping an eye on where he has the knife). Grabbing the knife hand is dangerous for obvious reasons, but what about blocking the knife itself. I feel like a bundled up hoodie could possibly take a thrust and give you enough time to get inside his range. Thoughts?

Years ago we did teach that you took off your cost and wrapped it round your arm. Hardly anyone wears coats these days so we no longer train it. But anything you can grab to wrap the arm could be beneficial if you can't get a chair or table or some other item to act as a barrier. :asian:

 

[Cyriacus]

Years ago we did teach that you took off your cost and wrapped it round your arm. Hardly anyone wears coats these days so we no longer train it. But anything you can grab to wrap the arm could be beneficial if you can't get a chair or table or some other item to act as a barrier. :asian:

Why not just throw it in their face, and run like crazy? Id count on that more than wrapping their arm up

 

[K-man]

Why not just throw it in their face, and run like crazy? Id count on that more than wrapping their arm up

Assuming you can't escape! If you are far enough away to throw the coat you may as well take it with you, and still run like crazy. Mind you, I'm not likely to be running like crazy anytime soon.

 

[Cyriacus]

Assuming you can't escape! If you are far enough away to throw the coat you may as well take it with you, and still run like crazy. Mind you, I'm not likely to be running like crazy anytime soon.

If you cant escape, id rather they cant see me for a second, then take my chances with trying to wrap something around their arm. I mean, cant they just punch me in the head with their non-stabby arm when they get annoyed with me?

Also;

Then:

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Where people get into trouble with edged weapon defensive training is that the typically overestimate their own competence in the area and underestimate what an edged weapon can do!
When dealing with a blade weather a box cutter, folding knife, fixed blade or into the longer areas such as short swords/machetes or long swords you need to first and foremost understand what you are up against, what it can do, and how to control the distance so that you have a shot at defending against it. Typically the best way in my opinion is to study a system that puts tools at the forefront of their training. You need to not only have training against it but you also need to know how to utilize these edge weapons. Now having said that can you survive a knife attack? Sure! It has been done in the past and will be done in the future. However, if you have an understanding of the tool then you will realize just how much at a disadvantage you are at and you will probably do everything in your power if possible to find a tool to equalize the situation!

 

[Langenschwert]

Where people get into trouble with edged weapon defensive training is that the typically overestimate their own competence in the area and underestimate what an edged weapon can do!

I tell my students that a guy with a knife is like fighting a person with a superpower... would you box a guy whose jab would likely kill you? Neither would I. So train accordingly.

-Mark

 

[James Kovacich]

i am a reality self defense instructor and teach knife disarming techniques, although if i were faced with a non-life threatening situation (eg mugging/ hold-up) and all i needed to do was hand over a wallet to avoid an altercation with someone armed with a knife then that is what i would do. i wouldn't want to take on anyone armed with a knife unless i was fighting for my life or for that of a loved one. A knife is an amazing leveller which is why they are the weapon of choice for cowards who would be vulnerable without one and an untrained individual can kill the most highly trained expert with one.

many people that have learned self defense against a knife in my experience have a dangerously over-inflated opinion of their abilities to disarm an opponent. thoughts?

If someone is truly serious about understanding the blade I would recommend training in a system thats focus is the blade. Most non-blade systems are to comprehensive to have give the kind of dedication. Even 1 night a week in a decent FMA school would should be enough to see and train in a fashion where 1 comes to respect and understand the blade.

I don't agree that cowards carry knives. Those that train in bladed systems regularly carry blades Many have collections of blades and I can attest after training with a blade, I feel naked without it.

 

[szorn]

You are 100% right in saying that you must not fixate on the weapon, but you can't ignore it either. You must at least try to control the arm with the weapon while you are hitting. A lot of knife defence is taught at range where you can move out of the way but in reality, once the attacker commits to the attack you will be inside grappling range. In close it's knees and elbows, you won't get a clean strike. Sure it's going to be simple (gross motor), but it's not safe and it's not easy. If the knife arm is not controlled at that point you are in real trouble.

I agree completely with you here. Weapon control and neutralization of the threat is important. So, is understanding the range we are most likely to encounter during such an attack. I generally tell my students there are two ranges when dealing with the knife - long range / outside range at least 21 feet away and possibly further (running away) and the close range. If we can't escape and we can't create space by using environmental weapons or barriers, then move to close quarter, control the weapon-bearing limb and neutralize the threat.

Steve

 

[chinto]

the biggest problem i see with most of the posts is they assume that you will know a knife is involved. Most LEO's and others will tell you its not a knife fight, its an AMBUSH! So the first thing you know about a knife being in the fight is often when you are cut or stabbed! Personally on the street I would assume all attackers are armed! with a knife or gun, and so go for broke if I can not talk my way out or run.