Scumbag Tries To Apologize

[Buka]

It's a difficult topic to discuss. It's difficult because we tend to look at it as a topic more than a reality. If it happens to you it has an effect, a bad effect. It is a horror. If it happens to your spouse, to your daughter, to your mother, to your sister or to your dear friend, it has an effect, almost as bad. It is all at the hands of the enemy. If you are the first cops on the scene, it has an effect. One that comes home with you. It comes home with you every single time. If you are the nurse or doctor, it has an effect, or if you are the therapist, or anyone involved with trying to put the pieces back together. It is all at the hands of the enemy. And he has done it before. Many times. Each time touching so many lives in so many ways.

And he will do it again. And again. And again.
If it were a a lower life form, we'd shoot it. We wouldn't care if it was wired wrong, or if those that birthed it mistreated it, or if the other animals had picked on it, or if it had eaten fermented berries and was feeling all screwed up. Nope, we'd deal with it good and proper because we have to protect the children, and the family, and for God's sake, ourselves. Even PETA wouldn't bi**h. (much)

But if it's a thinking, cunning, planner, one that can walk among us during the day without raising even the slightest of eyebrows.....well, that's another story. After all, crazed serial rapists are people, too. We are a civilized society. Apparently, it feels good to let them out, because that's what we've decided to do as a society.

I think society needs less work on correctness and more work on tactics.

 

[Jenna]

Thanks Jenna, I do find rape an atrocious act. I was taught long ago by my father that if a girl/woman says "no" in any way or even by actions then leave her alone. I find it ironic that I'm sometimes labeled a misogynic when I'm nothing of the sort. It's a terrible personal crime that does nothing more than show a man's weakness, which is another thing I despise.

I'm not sure exactly how to label the type of therapy that was given to these men. It was intensive and they didn't let them get away with nothing, with individual or group sessions. The very moment that they tried to put even the tiniest of blame on their victims the hammer came down and they were grilled until they realized their mistake. I learned a lot from the sessions. One of the biggest things I learned was that with all of our (inner) problems, all of them, the answer lies within us. When the therapist is asked: "Why did I do this (whatever)? The answer was "why do you think you did it?" In essence forcing the knowledge out in the open that lay locked deep down inside. We all know why we do this or that just have to admit it to ourselves and to another. I liken it to opening the shutters in the darkened rooms of our hearts (and minds) and letting in the light to see exactly what is there, the shutters can only be opened from the inside.
These men when made to realize that their thoughts, actions were entirely their responsibility, that the woman, child they harmed had done absolutely nothing to warrant their "attention" then they (for the most part) accept the accountability that is theirs alone. They are made to write out every thing; thoughts, feelings, actions and place them in a circle to show a cycle of their abuse. They're shown how being depressed, feeling lonely, powerless made them go find someone they could control, via rationalization, motivation and justification (in their minds) and thus end up feeling better about themselves but later guilt comes in, dragging them back down and feeling depressed, lonely, powerless and it starts all over again. Granted a lot of them were victims of abuse themselves in one form or another, so they learned from their abusers seeing them afterwards how much better the abuser felt and rationalized that is what they too must do to feel better about themselves. Others have other motivations, rejections, fear of rejection, stress (home/work/family), whatever. The feeling of excitement when they're in control of another and the false sense of instant gratification. The key was to find out what was that was driving them to commit those atrocious acts against their fellow human beings. Once that is established then the path to avoidance becomes clearer.
Once all that has been done then they're given tools to help them recognize their triggers, to recognize that they're down and that hole they're feeling inside needs to be filled, that they're taught to find other (satisfying) ways to fill that emptiness. They learn the discipline that is needed to stay one step ahead of themselves and to seek help when it becomes too overwhelming. To find a trusted individual (family, friend) who understands, cares and is willing to do whatever to help thwart the thought process that would eventually lead them to offend. This goes with any destructive addiction really, food, sex, drugs, alcohol, gambling, whatever! The jury is still out on Martial Arts! (just kidding) :wink2:

All that is a (too) simple way of explaining it but I hope it suffices. If you want more PM me.

While my internship did help me better understand these men, never did have a woman offender during my tenure, but the therapists have counseled women before and instructed me that the physical sex of the offender (and their victims) is the only difference. The thoughts, feelings and everything else was exactly the same pattern.
However; I still found myself still thinking of them as animals, (still do). I told them all that too, on my last day. Yet, I did tell them that for those who are earnestly trying, that I have hope of their regaining their human status somewhere along their journey.
For those who don't want to or refuse to maintain the necessary discipline ... to the dungeon they go.

Thank you for explaining this to me. It sounds like a mixture of therapies.. Removing their justification for attributing their actions to others (transferrance) I think is a staple of psychodynamic therapy and the recognition of triggers is cognitive behavioural and which seeks to cause a person to acknowledge their triggers and reframe their behaviour. It is interesting for me to hear how this works in the (horrible in this case) reality. I am used so far to dealing with people that have suffered trauma and not so much the perpetrators. Do you think at the core of it, there is some good in these people? I am not one to defend these things as I have been on the sharp end of it and but I wonder do we condemn them often by the actions of their abusers? I am reluctant to attempt to empathise or identify with these people and nor do I want to be soft. We all have freedom of decision in how to conduct ourselves and most of us go out of our way not to ever intentionally harm someone else. I only want some objectivity as for a long time I would have been utterly blinded by a demand for vengeance. I do not know, it is complicated (in my mind) what to do with these people. Especially if in many cases our best efforts to rehabilitate and reintegrate them does not work. I appreciate that you are doing your bit. What is your personal reward in your field of work can I ask? Thank you again.

 

[oftheherd1]

Is this sarcasm? I don't know nor do I care. If it is not intended as such then fine, thank you.

...

MA-Caver - What I said was in no way meant to be sarcasm. I'm sorry my choice of words left that in doubt. You mentioned working with sex offenders, so I thought you might have some statistics or empirical data that you could share. In fact you did so and seem to support what Bill posted in his links.

Thanks. It is surprising to me since that is not the popular belief. But I accept it. Thanks again.

 

[MA-Caver]

MA-Caver - What I said was in no way meant to be sarcasm. I'm sorry my choice of words left that in doubt. You mentioned working with sex offenders, so I thought you might have some statistics or empirical data that you could share. In fact you did so and seem to support what Bill posted in his links.

Thanks. It is surprising to me since that is not the popular belief. But I accept it. Thanks again.

And thanks to you back. Which is why I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you did not intend it as such. :asian:

Thank you for explaining this to me. It sounds like a mixture of therapies.. Removing their justification for attributing their actions to others (transference) I think is a staple of psycho dynamic therapy and the recognition of triggers is cognitive behavioral and which seeks to cause a person to acknowledge their triggers and reframe their behavior. It is interesting for me to hear how this works in the (horrible in this case) reality. I am used so far to dealing with people that have suffered trauma and not so much the perpetrators. Do you think at the core of it, there is some good in these people? I am not one to defend these things as I have been on the sharp end of it and but I wonder do we condemn them often by the actions of their abusers? I am reluctant to attempt to empathize or identify with these people and nor do I want to be soft. We all have freedom of decision in how to conduct ourselves and most of us go out of our way not to ever intentionally harm someone else. I only want some objectivity as for a long time I would have been utterly blinded by a demand for vengeance. I do not know, it is complicated (in my mind) what to do with these people. Especially if in many cases our best efforts to rehabilitate and reintegrate them does not work. I appreciate that you are doing your bit. What is your personal reward in your field of work can I ask? Thank you again.

Thanks for helping remind me of the terminology, which I've not used in a long time. I never completed the education nece$$ary for me to do that type of work as a career. Life kept getting in the way of such plans. Right now I'd be lucky to find something that pays *smirks* minimum wage. Either way, I think working with victims is far more important as they're the ones suffering most. Also as Buka pointed out, the crime(s) affects a number of others. But I do suggest working with perps for a while. If anything it'll provide insight (other side of the coin or story as it were) and may provide an answer when working with a victim undergoing long term therapy, that may be still searching for the "why?" of what happened to them. Understanding is not forgiveness, but it does alleviate some of the lingering pain. Working with the perps would also be a change of pace and broaden your views... which is always, a good thing to do no matter what.

 

[john2054]

I want to speak up a little bit for the other side here. And this is at a probable risk of being reprimanded again, like has happened so many times before. And of course my experience with this situation might differ a lot from the typical sexual assault/rape/attempted rape senario, but a couple of years ago I found myself treading on dangerous territory along those grounds, and without breaking the forum rules I will say that I 'got away with it', whatever it was supposed to be. And that is not withstanding a two year hospital section, with a continuing section now that I am out in the community. And studying. But then I think that it is important to remember that not all of these crimes are premeditated, some are on the spur of the moment. And equally sometimes it is just bad luck, the turn of circumstances that result in that result. But equally as my 'crime' was not as formidable as it could be mistaken to be, so equally I think we have to be careful in always painting these times as guilty of castrationable effects, to be a mistake. Talk about playing the devils advocate ;-)

 

[Josh Oakley]

John... I am going to gently say that it might be better for you to not post on the topic...

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