Saddam Hussein sentance to death

[Bob Hubbard]

It would seem to me, that with death threats against the prosecutors, with death threats against the judges, with actual kidnappings and executions among those participating in the trial, and their families, as well as changing trial officials throughout the trail, that there are many reasons to believe that justice was not blind.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/03/AR2006110301779.html



Here's another article that raises the question ... from a year ago.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/1019/p01s02-woiq.html

You missed my sarcasm Michael.

I won't argue that he doesn't deserve to dance on air a bit. But. As an overthrown legally elected head of state, traditionally, no matter how much of a SOB one is, one is normally allowed exile.

Saddam Sentenced To Hang
A visibly shaken Saddam Hussein was found guilty of crimes against humanity on Sunday and sentenced to hang by the U.S.-sponsored court that has been trying him in Baghdad for the past year.Two other senior aides, including his half-brother Barzan al-Tikriti, will also hang if automatic appeals fail in the coming months. His vice-president was jailed for life and three minor officials of his B

More...

Considering that a guilty verdict was guaranteed, and the obvious bias of the current US government head against Hussein, I think doubts of fairness and impartiality are justified.

 

[chris_มวยไทย]

Well, the first trial of Saddam has finished, ending in a guilty verdict and a sentance of death. Looks like its automatically going to be retried. This is going to stretch out for years it looks like...



Thoughts? Opinions?

good , and binladens next

i cant believe a judge atualy said saddam accidentaly killed all those poeple , WTF! , that judge was put in prison i think

 

[arnisador]

Couldn't happen to a better guy!

Mega-dittos, Rush!

 

[michaeledward]

You missed my sarcasm Michael.

Yes, I did. Which is why I asked.

I think a trial of this magnitude probably shouldn't have been held in a justice system that is still attempting to find its footing. The Iraqi criminal justice system is too new for such an important trial.

I can't figure out why those posting here are so riled up to see him swing. There's quite a bit of bloodlust in evidence.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Ditto.



For info on hanging, which is also still legal in the US, see here: http://deathpenaltyinfo.msu.edu/c/about/methods/hanging.htm

 

[mrhnau]

I won't argue that he doesn't deserve to dance on air a bit. But. As an overthrown legally elected head of state, traditionally, no matter how much of a SOB one is, one is normally allowed exile.

Considering that a guilty verdict was guaranteed, and the obvious bias of the current US government head against Hussein, I think doubts of fairness and impartiality are justified.

Take quick read about this gu, Ceausescu. Alot of similarities. Read the section about "The end of Ceausescu". He was overthrown, yet still executed. It happens...


The guilty verdict was guaranteed I think, but I think that has little to do with the US's opinion on guilt. Take a look at the old body dumps we have uncovered, listen to the stories of genocide and evidence uncovered. Its hard to produce an innocent verdict in the face of such glaring evidence.

I guess everyone will have their theory...

 

[arnisador]

I think a trial of this magnitude probably shouldn't have been held in a justice system that is still attempting to find its footing. The Iraqi criminal justice system is too new for such an important trial.

But...that's where the crimes were committed. The international court would have been reasonable too.

I can't figure out why those posting here are so riled up to see him swing. There's quite a bit of bloodlust in evidence.

He's had his trial and received his sentence. I feel it's well-deserved. This isn't a matter of rushing to judgment or asking for cruel and unusual punishment...just the death penalty for murder, same as here in the U.S. (for federal crimes, as the vast majority of these would have been).

If one doesn't oppose the death penalty...this is the system functioning as intended. While one can criticize the Iraqi courts, will we now try foreigners in U.S. courts for foreign crimes?

 

[Don Roley]

If one doesn't oppose the death penalty...this is the system functioning as intended. While one can criticize the Iraqi courts, will we now try foreigners in U.S. courts for foreign crimes?

There is always the case that if the trial was not held by Iraq, then they would always be held up as a case of the western nations trying to subjugate the middle eastern people. And if we waited until everyone was satisfied with the status of their judicial system, then he probably would have died in prison a few decades from now.

After he dies, he will be a symbol. Not much of one, but still a symbol. Alive he is a danger in that his is a symbol and a possible danger as people try to gain his release by violent means.

So I hope he gets taken out quick and becomes about as irrelevant as Milosovic, Ceacesue and other dictators who have died.

 

[Hand Sword]

Is this really a surprise to anyone....

To me it was. I thought the punishment in that region was to be beheaded in a public setting.

 

[michaeledward]

The Iraqi Court System under which President Hussein was tried was not in effect during the time when the crimes were committed. At the time of the 'crimes', the laws were not yet written.

Would it be like writing a ticket against Abraham Lincoln for speeding? Sure, he had no highways, or automobiles, but now he could speed?

I am not suggesting the trial should be at the hands of the United States, or the United States military, although that may be a discussion worth having.

And though you point to the death penalty as being also a sentence in this country - although it is not allowed in many other countries - you mention nothing about the standards of evidence, nor the degree of guilt required in Iraqi courts. In our country, the standard is 'beyond a reasonable doubt' for a criminal case. The Iraqi court system has a much lower standard of evidence. The judges are allowed to have quite a bit of doubt, and still impose a guilty verdict.

We have posters here volunteering to be the executioner. There is a difference between thinking a verdict is justified and wanting to administer punishment.

 

[arnisador]

The Iraqi Court System under which President Hussein was tried was not in effect during the time when the crimes were committed. At the time of the 'crimes', the laws were not yet written.

This defense was rejected at Nuremberg (along with the better-known "I was just following orders" defense); it is the second (and third) Nuremberg principle. At this point, dictators must be aware that "But I was head of a sovereign nation and declared my own acts to be legal" is not an accepted defense. It's a crime under international law, which is what I understand the Iraqi courts to be enforcing here (he was tried for crimes against humanity).

No one should be seeking to be his executioner (or torturer). But, I don't recognize the defense you cite, which would hav also absolved many other dictators through the years who had sovereign immunity within their own states.

 

[michaeledward]

I do not offer the premise as a defense tactic for Hussein.

I offer to question the judgement in selecting the venue. It would seem far more reasonable to hold a trial in which one of the charges includes "crimes against humanity", in front of a Internation Criminal Court or some other world body; as opposed to a legal system that is not yet three years old.

One problem with that, at a very minimum, is that these international bodies do not have a death penalty.

It is important for the proceedings of this magnitude, not only convey an appearance of fairness, but actual fairness. When the judges, prosecutors, and criminal defense attorneys have to be sheltered in the 'Green Zone', it appears to me that the general fairness of the trial may be influenced by the geographic restrictions on those in court.

 

[Makalakumu]

How about we try and hang those who put Saddam in power, those who provided material support for his atrocities, and those who looked the other way when he did what he did?

I think people would be surprise to see who would be on that Butcher's Bill...

 

[matt.m]

Even though I am not suprised at the verdict I saw they should put him in a cell and leave him there. If he dies from execution then some will view him as dying a martyr's death. Feed the idea it would.

No, I say shove him under ground and let people forget about him. That is a punishment worse than death to him.

 

[Andrew Green]

2 days before a US election the decission is made... I got a hard time believing there wasn't some planning there...

 

[mrhnau]

2 days before a US election the decission is made... I got a hard time believing there wasn't some planning there...

The timing is suspicious, but I would hope a judge would not be subject himself to bullying to rush or slow down justice... then again...

 

[michaeledward]

It has widely been reported that the verdict was expected in mid-October. That the announcement was delayed in a manner to benefit the Bush administration should hardly be surprising.

But, something I just now learned, is that the actual verdict had not yet been released.

Say what ? ? ?

Well, apparently, the 'Supreme Iraqi Criminal Tribunal' have released only the sentencing. The 'full verdict' won't be released until November 9.

Hmmm???

http://mediamatters.org/items/200611060010