On Iran

[Bill Mattocks]

Since it hasn't been proven that Iran is developing a nuclear bomb (and Washington's wishful thinking doesn't constitute proof), those inbred children in that malarial swamp of a city have a long way to go to be convincing.

Remember, these are the same knuckle-children that claimed that Iraq was buying Nigerian yellowcake despite their man on the ground, Joe Wilson, saying they were full of ****.

Let's say that the entire war in Iraq was based on a false premise, just to get that out of the way. I'm not saying I believe it was, but just to say OK, fine, Iraq was based on false accusations. Now, let's move on to Iran.

With regard to Iran, there is no proof that Iran is developing a nuclear bomb. And they have repeatedly stated that they are not. They want nuclear energy for power. Think about that one for a second. Nuclear power plants in the Mideast. Where the oil comes from. But hey, let's say they are planning ahead, for the day when the oil finally runs out. In the case of other nations that want nuclear power plants, they have made deals with the IAEA and other groups to procure the necessary fissile materials to produce energy. They types they get leave no capability to further enrich or create weapons-grade plutonium or highly-enriched uranium. The USA was actually on the hook to build such a plant for Iran during the days of the Shah, and Israel was OK with it. But Iran will have none of that now. They want to produce their own uranium and enrich it themselves (which they are now doing), which means if they can enrich to the point of making it fuel-worthy, they can enrich to the point of making it weapons-grade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_program_of_Iran

After public allegations about Iran's previously undeclared nuclear activities, the IAEA launched an investigation that concluded in November 2003 that Iran had systematically failed to meet its obligations under its NPT safeguards agreement to report those activities to the IAEA, although it also reported no evidence of links to a nuclear weapons program. The IAEA Board of Governors delayed a formal finding of non-compliance until September 2005, and reported that non-compliance to the UN Security Council in February 2006. After the IAEA Board of Governors reported Iran's noncompliance with its safeguards agreement to the United Nations Security Council, the Council demanded that Iran suspend its enrichment programs. The Council imposed sanctions after Iran refused to do so. A May 2009 U.S. Congressional Report suggested "the United States, and later the Europeans, argued that Iran's deception meant it should forfeit its right to enrich, a position likely to be up for negotiation in talks with Iran."[16]

In exchange for suspending its enrichment program, Iran has been offered "a long-term comprehensive arrangement which would allow for the development of relations and cooperation with Iran based on mutual respect and the establishment of international confidence in the exclusively peaceful nature of Iran's nuclear program."[17] However, Iran has consistently refused to give up its enrichment program, arguing that the program is necessary for its energy security, that such "long term arrangements" are inherently unreliable, and would deprive it of its inalienable right to peaceful nuclear technology. Currently, thirteen states possess operational enrichment or reprocessing facilities,[18] and several others have expressed an interest in developing indigenous enrichment programs.[19] Iran's position was endorsed by the Non-Aligned Movement, which expressed concern about the potential monopolization of nuclear fuel production.[20]

Now, in November, the IAEA produced a report that says that Iran has indeed been engaging in nuclear weapons research:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_program_of_Iran

In November 2011, the IAEA Board of Governors rebuked Iran following an IAEA report detailing how Iran had undertaken research and experiments geared to developing a nuclear weapons capability.[5] For the first time, the IAEA report outlines, in depth, the country’s detonator development, the multiple-point initiation of high explosives, and experiments involving nuclear payload integration into a missile delivery vehicle.[6] Iran rejected the details of the report and accused the IAEA of pro-Western bias[7] and threatened to reduce its cooperation with the IAEA.[8]

Iran has denounced that report as Western-influenced and so have several people in this thread. Is the report bogus? I suppose that depends on what you want to believe. I can't say I believe it fully or disbelieve it. However, I am not sure it makes much difference. A man with a gun pointed at me may know in his heart he is not going to shoot me, but I don't know that and cannot take that chance.

So....

Fact: Iran is enriching uranium and has stated categorically that it will not stop doing so.
Fact: Iran is under UN sanction for doing so, and has been in violation of IAEA requirements for something near a decade now.
Fact: The US and other Western powers have offered to support verifiable peaceful nuclear power for Iran, but Iran has rejected it.
Fact: Iran has, at various times, stated outright or implied that Israel has no right to exist, that it will be "wiped off the face of the earth," and that the Holocaust never happened. They have also claimed they didn't mean it. Hahaha.
Fact: Iran has placed warships in the Strait of Hormuz and warned US warships not to enter or it will fire on them.
Fact: If the Strait of Hormuz is blockaded, much of the oil that comes from the Mideast will not be able to make it to market.
Fact: Iran has warned fellow OPEC members with 'dire consequences' if they step up oil production to meet any shortfall if Iran's oil is stopped from being sold on the open market via sanctions.
Fact: Iran is the number one supporter, with cash and military weapons, of Hamas. Hamas uses Iranian weapons and money to kill Israelis. I hope this is clear to you. Israel uses Hamas to kill Jews for them.
Fact: Iran was the number one supporter of the insurgents in Iraq, with cash, training (in Iran) and weapons such as explosives and firearms. US military personnel were being killed in Iraq using Iranian money, weapons, and training. Regardless of support for or against the war in Iraq, Iran was killing Americans there by proxy and intentionally.
Conjecture: With the US now gone from Iraq, Iran is asserting control through the Iraqi government. Iraq will shortly be an Iranian province.

Given all this, when Iran says they do not want a nuclear weapon, I am inclined not to believe them. I think waiting to see if they actually produce a bomb or not is foolish in the extreme. As stated by another, we'll know about such a bomb when it gets set off in Israel or the US.

Perhaps they don't want a bomb. I do not think we can afford to take that chance.

 

[Big Don]

Perhaps they don't want a bomb. I do not think we can afford to take that chance.

Maybe that weird guy in the van really does have the best candy...

 

[elder999]

In the matter of Saddam "seeking yellowcake uranium from Niger," many of us in the industry were immediately suspicious-Niger's uranium ore is mined, milled, and strictly controlled by the French consortium, Cogema. Additionally, Saddam already had 500 tons of yellowcake in his possession-though it was secured by the U.N. at the time in question. We know he wanted to resume pursruit of a nuclear weapon program, but......he didn't have one at all, and wasn't looking to get special nuclear material.

As far as Iran goes-I won't say much. They truly do have valid and real reasons for seeking nuclear power-their oil is finite, and pretty much committed to Russia, France, England, Italy, Spain, Greece, Germany and the UK. It's their revenue.

If that's what they want, though, they're going about it the wrong way-the hard way-cascading centrifugal enrichment is a *****, done molecules at a time-really-and isn't at all necessary for power production-especially when everyone is offering to supply you with fuel elements for your reactors.

Ditto putting your enrichment facilities in hardened sub-mountainous facilities.

In multiple locations.

With impressive anti-aircraft defenses.......

They want a bomb-been arguing since '96 about whether they'll get there-especially with the Stuxnet virus and assassinations, and all-but concluded well before 9/11 that their scientists are definitely smart enough to get there....of course, they don't have to be that smart, these days-but those Persian fellas are........pretty ****in' smart.

And that's almost all I have to say, except that Israel can't bomb Iran's nuclear program out of existence, the way they did to Syria and Iraq. They can't even come close.

 

[ballen0351]

To an extent, I agree.

However, the accusations can mean retalliations.

And for some of us, that hits home. During the first Gulf War, I dreaded the long distance ring from my phone. When I hear of suicide bombings In Israel, the first thing I look for in the story is location. I have many fiends, and a some extended family over there.

I understand that but no matter who we say did it wont change the view iran has of Israel. Even if we proved that iran killed its own scientists they would spin it in a way in that country to look like he was a spy for the US or Israel and you would still have problems with the attacks.

I think it was Voltaire who said " as longs as people believe absurdities they will continue to commit atrocities." Or something to that effect. People will believe whatever makes there way of thinking true even if you prove there belief wrong. Its just easier to hate someone because you were taught that from a child even if the reality is you have no reason to hate them.