On Physical Challenges

[elder999]

I don't think I said anything about the law.

In the end, for someone like me, that's all there is to it: am I going to "get away" with this, or are they going to put me in jail

Nope. Nothing in there about the law. But from what you've said, the law agrees with me. There is no physical response to words. A physical response is justified only when there is reason to believe that the person is going to do something other than talk.

So what is it, exactly, that you're disagreeing with? I'm pretty sure you're not saying that you think it's ok to smack someone for words alone, when you have no reason to think they're going to do anything other than talk.

I think it's ok to smack someone for words alone, provided that one has perceived an actual and credible threat in those words, and that a "reasonable person" (that's the legal term) would recognize and respond to that threat in that way.

I have no other measure for when it's okay, but under those circumstances, it's ok.

 

[elder999]

Regardless of what I think, though, the "no physical challenges" rule is there for very real legal reasons: our hosts would be liable if seen as facilitating such behavior. That being said, it might not be any different than a seminar invitation, or someone saying they're going to go somewhere for a lesson-I'm going to Vegas next week, I may ask Brian VanCise for a lesson......though more likely the next one, rather than this trip.

You do see what I'm saying here, right?

That actually used to be a traditional method of challenge: to go to a school and ask the headmaster/head instructor/grandmaster "for a lesson."

Likewise, in Japan, a dojo might hang a sign outside, the image of a sickle and a bowl of rice, the characters for which 镰 碗 are pronounced, kami wan which is a homophone fora phrase that roughly translates as we don't care if you come in or not. or, some might say, come in and you'll regret it (?)

It's faded to almost nothing, now, but in years gone by, some foolish student-who'll remain nameless-painted this on my barn door....:lfao:

 

[drop bear]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wptn5RE2I-k

Just saying I am with buzz on this one.

 

[drop bear]

Words do not justify a physical response. Say whatever you want. Until you give me reason to believe that you're going to actually do something other than smacktalk. And then I'll respond to what you do, not what you say.

Different country different cultures.

But even over your way. Fighting words are not protected by freedom of speech.
Fighting words - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


For us provocation is a legal defence
https://www.aussielegal.com.au/articles/811/QLD/Criminal_Law/Assault

 

[Tez3]

Different country different cultures.

But even over your way. Fighting words are not protected by freedom of speech.
Fighting words - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


For us provocation is a legal defence
https://www.aussielegal.com.au/articles/811/QLD/Criminal_Law/Assault

It's a very qualified legal defence and you wouldn't want to rely on it as it would be doubtful that 'words' how ever bad would be considered provocation. provocation in these cases is considered something like criminal damage, an attack on another person, cruelty to an animal, things along those lines. You may get away with using perhaps if they said they were shagging your missus but then again I wouldn't bank on it.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Legally, in most jurisdictions in the U.S., ...

In Chines culture, when you challenge me and beat me up, if I go to the police, the whole CMA community will look down on me for the rest of my life. IMO, MA and law just don't go together.

If you challenge me and beat me up, I will train hard for the next 10 years, I then challenge you back. I'll never to the law. That's the way it supposed to be.

 

[elder999]

In Chines culture, when you challenge me and beat me up, if I go to the police, the whole CMA community will look down on me for the rest of my life. IMO, MA and law just don't go together.

If you challenge me and beat me up, I will train hard for the next 10 years, I then challenge you back. I'll never to the law. That's the way it supposed to be.

IN USA, the one with the best lawyer wins...doesn't matter who wound up knocked out. :lfao:

 

[Instructor]

Let's just call a physical challenge what it is, picking a fight. Walking around picking fights is juvenile, no matter how you dress it up.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Regardless of what I think, though, the "no physical challenges" rule is there for very real legal reasons: our hosts would be liable if seen as facilitating such behavior. That being said, it might not be any different than a seminar invitation, or someone saying they're going to go somewhere for a lesson-I'm going to Vegas next week, I may ask Brian VanCise for a lesson......though more likely the next one, rather than this trip.

So another words, if I was to challenge somebody here and then go and meet them in person and a physical confrontation was to ensure and there were legal consequences, it could be traced back to MartialTalk and MartialTalk could have to deal with legal ramifications. That is what I take it as to why MartialTalk doesn't allow physical challenges.

 

[elder999]

So another words, if I was to challenge somebody here and then go and meet them in person and a physical confrontation was to ensure and there were legal consequences, it could be traced back to MartialTalk and MartialTalk could have to deal with legal ramifications. That is what I take it as to why MartialTalk doesn't allow physical challenges.

Well, they also don't want us calling each other names, but that's a very real legal reason for them to require that rule of themselves, so as to limit their liability.

Forums get sued, and individuals on them get sued, sometimes for the silliest of things.......

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Let's just call a physical challenge what it is, picking a fight. Walking around picking fights is juvenile, no matter how you dress it up.

Even picking a fight, there are

- friendly challenge, and
- unfriendly challenge.

In the old time, the friendly challenge was very civil. The moment that you had detected that your opponent's skill level is higher than you, the moment that you stopped. Most of the time, you would say, "I'm late". That mean your opponent already had developed his skill. If you met him few years earlier, you might still have chance to beat him. Today, even if you may come back and challenge him again 3 years later, you have 3 more years training, but your opponent will also have 3 more years training, your opponent may still defeat you. that's the meaning of "I'm late". The "friendly challenge" is a pure skill testing.

In the old time when a student finished from his teacher, his teacher would tell him to travel around the world and test his skill against as many MA guys as possible. That's the spirit of "friendly challenge". It's used to test whether your defense skill and offense skill work or not.

The friendly challenge usually has rule such as:

- If you can land your punch on my head within 1 minute, you win, otherwise I win.
- If I can take you down within 5 seconds, I win, otherwise you win.
- ...

In "unfriendly challenge", both you and your opponent may want to cause some "body injury". It can be ugly. If you kill me, my son will try to kill you, your son then try to kill my son, and ... It may continue like this for generations.

Of course things like this can only happen in the MA world, and it depends on whether people still maintain this kind of MA tradition or not.

 

[Tez3]

So another words, if I was to challenge somebody here and then go and meet them in person and a physical confrontation was to ensure and there were legal consequences, it could be traced back to MartialTalk and MartialTalk could have to deal with legal ramifications. That is what I take it as to why MartialTalk doesn't allow physical challenges.

'Ensue'. ensure gives the sentence a whole other meaning. Why would anyone bother to issue a challenge, they would only be laughed at. :rofl:

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Hey, if physical challenges are verboten, how about metaphysical challenges?

I hereby dare the lot of you to meet me on the astral plane for no holds barred spiritual combat, if you've got the chi balls for it. Anyone who doesn't show up is admitting my superiority in the extradimensional fighting arts.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Hey, if physical challenges are verboten, how about metaphysical challenges?

I hereby dare the lot of you to meet me on the astral plane for no holds barred spiritual combat, if you've got the chi balls for it. Anyone who doesn't show up is admitting my superiority in the extradimensional fighting arts.

I am already there waiting. It was like you were following me.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Have you ever met a challenger who wanted to set the rule?

- punch only, no kick.
- kick/punch only, no take down.
- push hand only, no wrestling.
- arm wrestling only.
- ...

I have experienced all those kind of "weird" challenges. When a 250 lb guy challenges you in "arm wrestling", your MA skill is not going to help you in any way.

 

[K-man]

Hey, if physical challenges are verboten, how about metaphysical challenges?

I hereby dare the lot of you to meet me on the astral plane for no holds barred spiritual combat, if you've got the chi balls for it. Anyone who doesn't show up is admitting my superiority in the extradimensional fighting arts.

What a baseless challenge. I am here waiting on the astral plain, with an endless supply of chi balls, ready to knock you over at 20 paces and you haven't even bothered to show up. What sort of challenge do you call this?
:sp15:

 

[Touch Of Death]

Have you ever met a challenger who wanted to set the rule?

- punch only, no kick.
- kick/punch only, no take down.
- push hand only, no wrestling.
- arm wrestling only.
- ...

I have experienced all those kind of "weird" challenges. When a 250 lb guy challenges you in "arm wrestling", your MA skill is not going to help you in any way.

When people try to make it fair, they are almost always giving themselves the advantage.

 

[Touch Of Death]

What a baseless challenge. I am here waiting on the astral plain, with an endless supply of chi balls, ready to knock you over at 20 paces and you haven't even bothered to show up. What sort of challenge do you call this?
:sp15:

He just tasked you; now, he knows he can order you around. Are you going to let him get away with that?

 

[tshadowchaser]

Have you ever met a challenger who wanted to set the rule?

- punch only, no kick.
- kick/punch only, no take down.
- push hand only, no wrestling.
- arm wrestling only.
- ...


If challenge I set the rules. Then I have the opponent show his insurance policy and tell me what hospital he wishes to visit and if the unthinkable happens what funeral home he wishes to visit. Yes he must sign all sorts of waivers. when that is done and he is straightening up from signing I hit him from behind with a chair :hmm:

 

[drop bear]

Have you ever met a challenger who wanted to set the rule?

- punch only, no kick.
- kick/punch only, no take down.
- push hand only, no wrestling.
- arm wrestling only.
- ...

I have experienced all those kind of "weird" challenges. When a 250 lb guy challenges you in "arm wrestling", your MA skill is not going to help you in any way.

Yep mma arm wrestling.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xF50HOPVmmw