On Aikido: Its Origins and its efficacy

[Spinedoc]

If you compare what he was actually doing in the 1930's with what he was doing in the 1960's (there's a good comparison here), there was actually....very little change. The changes you're thinking about were primarily introduced by Kisshomaru Ueshiba and Koichi Tohei in Tokyo after the war (see “Is O-Sensei Really the Father of Modern Aikido?”).

You might also be interested in "The Ueshiba Legacy, by Mark Murray", a further discussion of the changes that occurred between Morihei and Kisshomaru Ueshiba.

Best,

Chris

Yes, and there is some other good evidence, presented by Stanley Pranin that Kisshomaru Ueshiba was not a particularly talented Aikidoka, and certainly nowhere near being on the level of martial prowess as his father. Now, we know that Aikido was tempered after the war, but the question is whether it was tempered out of necessity because Kisshomaru was not as good as his father? Or, was it tempered because of the general ban in post-war Japan on all things budo?

I read something not long ago that after the war, O'Sensei basically retired to Iwama and rarely, if ever came to Hombu, and in addition, he was quite vocal and critical of his son's teaching at Hombu, to the point where, he was actually encouraged to stay away. I have no idea how true/not true that is.

Mike

 

[Spinedoc]

The man who shaped modern aikido in his image by Stanley Pranin

Who changed Aikido after the war and what were their motives? by Stanley Pranin

Kisshomaru’s situation was extremely complex. As the Founder’s son, he was expected to carry on in his father’s footsteps and manage the course of the development of aikido. In terms of martial ability, he was inexperienced and his temperment such that he rejected a rigorous training model in favor of gentler forms of practice that more closely resembled a cardiovascular exercise system.

 

[Chris Li]

Yes, and there is some other good evidence, presented by Stanley Pranin that Kisshomaru Ueshiba was not a particularly talented Aikidoka, and certainly nowhere near being on the level of martial prowess as his father. Now, we know that Aikido was tempered after the war, but the question is whether it was tempered out of necessity because Kisshomaru was not as good as his father? Or, was it tempered because of the general ban in post-war Japan on all things budo?

There actually was no post-war ban, that's both a myth and a misunderstanding. Basically, budo as pre-war indoctrination was removed from the public school curriculum. There's a good article about that here. However, Kisshomaru (who was there at the time) said that many Japanese were unsure of what the exact rules were and erred on the side of caution.

I trained some with Kisshomaru, and he actually had quite a bit of stuff - but I think that he suffered by comparison with some of the greats. On his own he would have probably been fine.

Personally, I think it was less a matter of skill than it was a matter of marketing - creating a product that appeals to a wider and casually training audience.

I read something not long ago that after the war, O'Sensei basically retired to Iwama and rarely, if ever came to Hombu, and in addition, he was quite vocal and critical of his son's teaching at Hombu, to the point where, he was actually encouraged to stay away. I have no idea how true/not true that is.

Morihei retired to Iwama in 1942 and didn't really come back to Tokyo until the mid 1950's. Even after that (until his death) he was only in Tokyo at most a third of the time - he would stay in Iwama or travel to Osaka or Shingu. When he was in Tokyo he was not responsible for the regular teaching schedule and taught only occasionally.

He always supported Kisshomaru, but he was known to gripe to those who knew him. He had quite a temper and could be trying to deal with (not just about Aikido).

Best,

Chris

 

[drop bear]

What I meant to say drop bear,
Is people who do koryu don't care what mma people think of it because if someone isn't doing koryu they won't get it and though many videos are on YouTube the depth of the system is only given orally. So even taking a class or two won't even give to much of an understanding.

So it is an exclusionary art. Which i dont get the point of by the way.