Marriage = having a witness to your life??

[Jenna]

Maybe "annoy" is a bit too strong, at least for my friends. I guess I just find that I like my solitude and privacy. I love to spend time with friends, but at some point I just need to be left alone again. Difficult to explain further than that.

Michael my clever friend you do not have to explain the virtue of solitariness to me one bit Someone smart once said.. "we are rarely PROUD when we are alone.." and but I think there is even much more to it than that sort of self evaluation.. some of us do instinctively seek a little solitude not as loners I think but in my case just to clear a little Jenna space with no one else in there.. anyways I truly believe it is easier to appreciate company after a little time to ourselves.. thank you again

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

 

[Flying Crane]

Michael my clever friend you do not have to explain the virtue of solitariness to me one bit Someone smart once said.. "we are rarely PROUD when we are alone.." and but I think there is even much more to it than that sort of self evaluation.. some of us do instinctively seek a little solitude not as loners I think but in my case just to clear a little Jenna space with no one else in there.. anyways I truly believe it is easier to appreciate company after a little time to ourselves.. thank you again

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

Early on in our dating relationship, my wife once made a statement that went a long way in showing her understanding of me. She said this out of the blue, without me bringing it up, or discussing this in any way. She told me that, just so I know, if I ever needed her to clear out and give me some space for a while, that was OK and I just needed to say the word.

I knew when she said that, that I wouldn't need to.

 

[jfarnsworth]

To Jason hey thank you for following up and on your mention of "lemon" cars I am thinking again why we imagine that the car we pick out from the courtyard of the local dealership is the right car for us.. why would we not go to another county or heck another country to find the perfect car for us? I think we are lazy and pick a car from the local traders magazine and compromise on the fact that it aint got climate control or whatever.. but then maybe later we realise we are too hot and uncomfortable in our car without the aircon... hmmmm.. well is that right do you think?

Well then.... You are just gonna drag me into this conversation aren't 'ya? From my experiences I've seen more long term relationships work out rather than marriages. Maybe, possibly, they are able to get along better as a whole knowing that at any time you can leave. I don't know (shrugs shoulders) just my thoughts. There is so much strain on marriage of even who is or who will pay such and such a bill. What's for dinner. Do you like this.... No. Why didn't you do....... Well I thought you were. The list can go on. As I stated before. As you get older your ideas, thoughts, and perceptions chance. At this point I wouldn't look at a woman the same as I did when I was 20. This just comes from maturity. As soon as kids come along that puts even more strain on the relationship. Maybe the individual talk beforehand about kids. How many do you want? I don't know? HOw many do you want? .... Well here's one. OK, let's get by doing such and such. Hey, guess what? Another kid along. Ok, let's change our lifestyle to accomidate. Um.... Hey, guess what? Ugh. Yes? you know the rest. There are people cut out for parenting as well. Others are not. Now you are tied at least 18yrs. of life with your significant other.

Now before I get nasty hate emails and PM's and such. Don't get me wrong there are some very nice relationships out there. Some where 2 people just really dig eachother all the time. Kids are no problem. I salute each and every one that finds that relationship. However, they are scarce. The general public don't want to put in that much effort. There are always good and bad of everything. Whether it be marriage, parenting, even your co-worker. Some you want to hand a pink slip to and others you know the company can't do without.
Sorry, I'm done ranting now.

 

[Jenna]

Well then.... You are just gonna drag me into this conversation aren't 'ya? From my experiences I've seen more long term relationships work out rather than marriages. Maybe, possibly, they are able to get along better as a whole knowing that at any time you can leave. I don't know (shrugs shoulders) just my thoughts. There is so much strain on marriage of even who is or who will pay such and such a bill. What's for dinner. Do you like this.... No. Why didn't you do....... Well I thought you were. The list can go on. As I stated before. As you get older your ideas, thoughts, and perceptions chance. At this point I wouldn't look at a woman the same as I did when I was 20. This just comes from maturity. As soon as kids come along that puts even more strain on the relationship. Maybe the individual talk beforehand about kids. How many do you want? I don't know? HOw many do you want? .... Well here's one. OK, let's get by doing such and such. Hey, guess what? Another kid along. Ok, let's change our lifestyle to accomidate. Um.... Hey, guess what? Ugh. Yes? you know the rest. There are people cut out for parenting as well. Others are not. Now you are tied at least 18yrs. of life with your significant other.

Now before I get nasty hate emails and PM's and such. Don't get me wrong there are some very nice relationships out there. Some where 2 people just really dig eachother all the time. Kids are no problem. I salute each and every one that finds that relationship. However, they are scarce. The general public don't want to put in that much effort. There are always good and bad of everything. Whether it be marriage, parenting, even your co-worker. Some you want to hand a pink slip to and others you know the company can't do without.
Sorry, I'm done ranting now.

Hey Jason yes I will drag you into the vortex.. ha! I will drag yous all down with me where I am going.. but hey these are all good observations and yet I think your insightful observations could equally apply to ANY relationship besides a one nighter.. dont you think? like here.. you said "The general public don't want to put in that much effort" and that is what I was saying to Rich that we are lazy and yet are these things not worth bothering over? Surely that is not the case. but the thing I wonder most about is the argument that marriages are not so good in comparison to just relationships because there is less of a chance to leave.. which must not be good for those in long term relationships to think the partner is not an advocate of marriage because they have actually given thought to leaving..

>>hey babes you are just the best thing that ever happened but let us not get hitched in case I change my mind..
>>oooh darling that is such a reassuring thing to say to me.. but I am one step ahead and have packed my bag I am off with Jason the guy I met in my MA class..
>>You are doing WHAT?? Oh well.. boy am I glad I never said I DO.. getting dumped out like this is so much neater than a divorce..
>>yeah Jason from my MA class.. he is averse to marrying also.. so I can take him or leave him too.. ha!


Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

 

[Rich Parsons]

To Rich Ahh Rich you are wise and always make sense to me and see I am listening to you and taking it in and then thinking ahh but that would not be me and but I am conceited to think if I found someone it would last for always and I know no one goes into marriage NOT believing it will last forever but plainly for many it does not.. but is there any sense in the idea that people are too lazy to work at things? I mean we are used to fast food and disposable possessions and everything is treated like a consumable I think and I wonder do we even treat partners like that also?? I have one of my peepz who got married just last year and yes I was bridesmaid huh! and but they had to live apart because of where his job was and just six months in and he went off looking for other women and I think that was just the worst thing and they have separated altogether which broke my heart I will say and but I wonder what is wrong with people? You get married and maybe it is impossible to turn off the ol urges that help us to get partners in the first place.. is that what it is? I do not now maybe you would have a thought since you always put things well for me..

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

Jenna,

I agree with laziness. I also think that consumer approach to relationships is there.

Recently I heard some early 20's using a term I had not heard before. Expiration Dating. Those involved cannot see that there is an expiration just like the milk one buys, bout those all around them can see it that it is already going bad.

There is another term being used by Psychs and professional's here in the states. The Term is "Starter Marriage". Now this is fine if both think it is a starter marriage, but most often one person enters into the marriage knowing they will not have a child or wish not to have a child, and will divorce their partner before they are 30. This is for those who cannot afford to live alone and or need the appearance of being married at work to be able to be mroe upwardly mobile.

In 2004 I read a couple of studies. Detroit Metro area or South East Michigan region and Pittsburg Pennsylvania had the highest ratio of women to men. Now being a single man, this would seem like the right place to be. Until further studies are reviewed. South East Michigan is the fattest region in the United States. (* A little weight or mass that is proportional is fine, but too much is not attractive to me. And no I am not a person who prefers the model look, as I think many need to gain a few pounds. *) Another study had South East Michigan being in the top three for single women with more than two kids. And a great many of those were from multiple partners. And while an active partner is something that I would prefer, I have found it very difficult to deal with the "ex's", in particular if there is more than one, which makes it even more difficult to find a solution to a problem that may arise. Now add in that South East Michigan was also high (* I beleive top 10 *) in sexually transmitted diseases, and also high for drug usage, and that leaves one with a very small portion of the population that can fit what on paper looks like the person one would go for. (* I would say normal or average, but when the numbers are that most do drugs and have a disease then this is the average or the Norm or Normal. *)

So, while I agree that I may be jaded by my experiences, and by those of my friends, (* Divorced as well, used for citizenship, a pay check for someone kids to get insurance, etcetera *) I still hold out that I may find someone I can get along with.

The issue is that I am not perfect and I have some issues and hang ups. Those who would date me or get involved need to understand that, just as I understand that the person I would be involved with his their baggage and hang ups and needs special consideration in certain areas. Both sides needs to understand this and be willing to work with the other side. So the right woman who is willing to handle my issues may be a woman with multiple kids from different relationships. But since I have been burned really bad for money in the past, my hang ups are things that most women will not consider. The issue of a pre-nup, where every thing that is mine before the marriage stays mine and the same for her. All family heirlooms stay with the family if a break up occurs, and that everything accrued during the relationship is split 50/50. But most women do not wish to discuss this, for if I truly loved them then I would not be worried about such items. And they may be right, and I do not know.

 

[jfarnsworth]

Hey Jason yes I will drag you into the vortex.. ha! I will drag yous all down with me where I am going.. but hey these are all good observations and yet I think your insightful observations could equally apply to ANY relationship besides a one nighter.. dont you think? like here.. you said "The general public don't want to put in that much effort" and that is what I was saying to Rich that we are lazy and yet are these things not worth bothering over? Surely that is not the case. but the thing I wonder most about is the argument that marriages are not so good in comparison to just relationships because there is less of a chance to leave.. which must not be good for those in long term relationships to think the partner is not an advocate of marriage because they have actually given thought to leaving..

>>hey babes you are just the best thing that ever happened but let us not get hitched in case I change my mind..
>>oooh darling that is such a reassuring thing to say to me.. but I am one step ahead and have packed my bag I am off with Jason the guy I met in my MA class..
>>You are doing WHAT?? Oh well.. boy am I glad I never said I DO.. getting dumped out like this is so much neater than a divorce..
>>yeah Jason from my MA class.. he is averse to marrying also.. so I can take him or leave him too.. ha!

You just, ah.... are keeping me from lurking in the shadows:jedi1: . My list of things could go on and on. My analogy about the car I was referring to my bicycle. I love to bike. My wifey does not like to go on the rides I do. I"m gone for too long. I say so. Then again, I'm supposedly at the studio too much. Ok, generally 1 day a week? I say so. I lift weights too much. Again, on my lunch hour that doesn't bother a living soul in my household. Again, I say so. Anyway, back to my bike. My gearing is a little off. It doesn't hit the gears like it should. I can't fix the stupid thing to shift exactly when it's supposed to. What if, now, just what if; I would have picked the exact same bike right beside it? Maybe I would have been much happier with it:idunno: . Same as relationships. I still think in marriages there is much more to deal with than only dating, or even a serious relationship. The divorce rate in the u.s. is high. For second marriages it's even higher. If there are kids involved ex's create a problem. Believe me, I know this to be true. I'm counting the day when I no longer have to speak to my ex-wife. She puts a strain on my current marriage like nothing else. Getting to hear both of them crab & complain on the same day.... I hope your getting my point. I say to only get married when you're old enough and wise enough to try and enjoy it. I actually know a couple of guys who are in their 50's that's never been married. They never wanted to. They like to hunt, fish, motorcycle, drink, travel and all sorts of stuff w/o having to ask permission to go here and there. Oh well.
Ok, I'm done again.

At least for now.

 

[Ceicei]

Marriage, at least for me, does not mean "begging for permission" from each other to do things we enjoy. We do let each other know to coordinate our schedules and make sure the kids are taken care during our activities.

My husband loves ATVing/motorcycling, computer gaming with his friends, and bike riding. These aren't my interests. I love training in martial arts, caving, and customizing model cars. These aren't his interests. We don't keep track of how many times he does that and how many times I do that. we support each other with these activities. We have the understanding if we can do what we enjoy most, we will be happier within the marriage.

There are many shared activities that we (as a family) all do. We love camping, firearms shooting, boating/wave-running, and several other activities. We do these together a lot.

What makes our marriage stronger are the rules we've always kept even before we got married: 1) We always say "I love you" when we leave each other for the day and again when we meet together. 2) We do not ever call each other "bad names". Criticism of each other's character does nothing to help the situation. 3) When we have disagreements, we talk about the specific problem. 4) If the problem is completely resolved, then it is over. There is no need to dredge the same problem/issue all up again and again--totally unnecessary since it feeds and aggravates hostility.

These are the only four "iron-clad" rules we live by. Our kids, however, do struggle with these because of their exposure to schoolyard and neighborhood relationships, so they are trying to develop and internalize these four rules. The process is not as easy as it seems, since it does require communication skills.

We take life day by day, realizing that the unexpected do happen, and try to work through the situations together as they come up.

- Ceicei

 

[Rich Parsons]

Marriage, at least for me, does not mean "begging for permission" from each other to do things we enjoy. We do let each other know to coordinate our schedules and make sure the kids are taken care during our activities.

My husband loves ATVing/motorcycling, computer gaming with his friends, and bike riding. These aren't my interests. I love training in martial arts, caving, and customizing model cars. These aren't his interests. We don't keep track of how many times he does that and how many times I do that. we support each other with these activities. We have the understanding if we can do what we enjoy most, we will be happier within the marriage.

There are many shared activities that we (as a family) all do. We love camping, firearms shooting, boating/wave-running, and several other activities. We do these together a lot.

What makes our marriage stronger are the rules we've always kept even before we got married: 1) We always say "I love you" when we leave each other for the day and again when we meet together. 2) We do not ever call each other "bad names". Criticism of each other's character does nothing to help the situation. 3) When we have disagreements, we talk about the specific problem. 4) If the problem is completely resolved, then it is over. There is no need to dredge the same problem/issue all up again and again--totally unnecessary since it feeds and aggravates hostility.

These are the only four "iron-clad" rules we live by. Our kids, however, do struggle with these because of their exposure to schoolyard and neighborhood relationships, so they are trying to develop and internalize these four rules. The process is not as easy as it seems, since it does require communication skills.

We take life day by day, realizing that the unexpected do happen, and try to work through the situations together as they come up.

- Ceicei

Sounds like you have good communication between you both, and are willing to address issues as they arise. This is good.

Thank you for showing a positive example.