B
Black Belt FC
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Who do you consider to be the prominent Hapkido Leaders in the US? Top ten Non Koreans and Koreans? And why?
Enson
3rd Black Belt
from what i've seen... john pellegrini! hee hee! there i said before anyone else did. i really don't know. he is the only hapkido instructor i know.
Shogun
Master Black Belt
Bong soo Han - for pioneering.
and I dont know much else about Hapkido practitioners.
and I dont know much else about Hapkido practitioners.
American HKD
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Greetings
That's a very subjective question because there are a few different HKD styles being practiced all with different leaders.
KHF and a few different Kwans and there US leaders.
Sin Moo HKD
JR Wests system
Rudy Timmerman
IHF
WHA
WHF
Who's the top ten of each ??????????
That's a very subjective question because there are a few different HKD styles being practiced all with different leaders.
KHF and a few different Kwans and there US leaders.
Sin Moo HKD
JR Wests system
Rudy Timmerman
IHF
WHA
WHF
Who's the top ten of each ??????????
Han-Mi
Purple Belt
I love the subject line
LEADING USA Hapkido LEADERS
artyon:
:supcool:
LEADING USA Hapkido LEADERS
artyon: :supcool:
OP
Master Todd Miller
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #6
There are many different Hapkido groups here in the USA.
The Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc. is affiliated with GM Lim, Hyun Soo in Taegu city South Korea. I would have to say that GM West, GM Timmerman are 2 of the more prominant people as they have been doing Hapkido since the 60s.
Take care
Todd
Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc.
www.millersmudo.com
The Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc. is affiliated with GM Lim, Hyun Soo in Taegu city South Korea. I would have to say that GM West, GM Timmerman are 2 of the more prominant people as they have been doing Hapkido since the 60s.
Take care
Todd
Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc.
www.millersmudo.com
glad2bhere
Master Black Belt
I would LOVE to respond to this but I can't figure how the term "leadership" is being used. Seems like everybody who starts his own organization so as to maintain dominance over his turf could be considered a leader. I tend to think of a leader as someone whose deportment or value system is something I would want to emulate as opposed to someone who promotes an event or manages the till. On the other hand there are a lot of really nice guys whose students and peers respect them and keep pretty much to themselves. In this way, saying that a person is a good teacher or mentor is also a good leader doesn't seem to follow any more than flipping it around to say that a good leader is also a good teacher. Thoughts? Comments?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
Best Wishes,
Bruce
American HKD
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Dear Bruce,
Your right in you comments. Leaders are few and far between if any can be found at all.
A leader should be respected by all, be of very high moral character with vast knowledge of the Art.
I'd say Ji Han Jae is the world leader in HKD whether one wants to admit it or not. Ji's credits to the Art run to deep to be denied.
As far as Americans I have not been exposed first hand to enough American Masters to have a real opinion. 98% of the HKD I know comes from Koreans.
I do know Americans such as Masters Whalen, West, Timmerman, are highly respected and seem to fit the bill of true leaders of Traditional HKD.
Your right in you comments. Leaders are few and far between if any can be found at all.
A leader should be respected by all, be of very high moral character with vast knowledge of the Art.
I'd say Ji Han Jae is the world leader in HKD whether one wants to admit it or not. Ji's credits to the Art run to deep to be denied.
As far as Americans I have not been exposed first hand to enough American Masters to have a real opinion. 98% of the HKD I know comes from Koreans.
I do know Americans such as Masters Whalen, West, Timmerman, are highly respected and seem to fit the bill of true leaders of Traditional HKD.
glad2bhere
Master Black Belt
Dear Stuart:
"......I'd say Ji Han Jae is the world leader in HKD whether one wants to admit it or not. Ji's credits to the Art run to deep to be denied. ....."
Thats very true. Most people that one would consider a true leader are usually the type of people who eschew the limelight. I notice that Chang Chin Il likewise keeps to himself, though people who have had the experience of working with him speak highly of both his teaching and technical abilites. Would you be willing to expose yourself a bit and give some qualities you find in Ji that cause you to view him as a leader? By this I don't mean his traditional position as originator of modern Hapkido. Rather, I am thinking about personal traits or accomplishments that encourage you to use him as a model for problem-solving or conduct in your own life. You can also reserve the right not to go there if you would rather not. My thought is that you and Mike and a number of other folks are very strong supporters of Ji and since we are talking about leadership it might help the discussion to use your relationship with Ji to characterize what it is we are viewing as leadership traits, yes? Thoughts? Comments?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
"......I'd say Ji Han Jae is the world leader in HKD whether one wants to admit it or not. Ji's credits to the Art run to deep to be denied. ....."
Thats very true. Most people that one would consider a true leader are usually the type of people who eschew the limelight. I notice that Chang Chin Il likewise keeps to himself, though people who have had the experience of working with him speak highly of both his teaching and technical abilites. Would you be willing to expose yourself a bit and give some qualities you find in Ji that cause you to view him as a leader? By this I don't mean his traditional position as originator of modern Hapkido. Rather, I am thinking about personal traits or accomplishments that encourage you to use him as a model for problem-solving or conduct in your own life. You can also reserve the right not to go there if you would rather not. My thought is that you and Mike and a number of other folks are very strong supporters of Ji and since we are talking about leadership it might help the discussion to use your relationship with Ji to characterize what it is we are viewing as leadership traits, yes? Thoughts? Comments?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
OP
Master Todd Miller
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #10
I think the better question is what traits does one need to have to be considered a leader/good leader?
Some thoughts I have.
1. A leader has to be good at what they do.
2. A leader needs to be able to relate to people.
3. A leader needs to lead in a positive direction and not be selfish or out just to promote themselves.
There are more traits that a leader should have but this is a start.
Take care
Todd Miller
Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc.
www.millersmudo.com
Some thoughts I have.
1. A leader has to be good at what they do.
2. A leader needs to be able to relate to people.
3. A leader needs to lead in a positive direction and not be selfish or out just to promote themselves.
There are more traits that a leader should have but this is a start.
Take care
Todd Miller
Korea Jungki Hapkido & Guhapdo Assc.
www.millersmudo.com
glad2bhere
Master Black Belt
Dear Todd:
"....... A leader needs to lead in a positive direction and not be selfish ...."
I'm sorry for how what I am about to say might be taken, but I must say that I am a bit disappointed. To me it seems everytime a string such as this comes up (and that in ITSELF is a rarity) we always start at the same point. At the risk of stirring up consternation I for myself would like to take this a step beyond where you have positioned us, 'kay?
I would like to say that a leader is not just good at what they do, or needs to be able to relate to people. Take the next step. To me a leader is a role model who shows how this behavior is done and then causes the people around them to want to live their life the same way. Heres' an example of what I am talking about.
How many people say they practice a "martial art"? I don't want to even get into this issue but lets take a look at the results, yes? If a person really practices a martial art how is their community better for them following this Warriors' Path? Even little things like volunteering their time, giving blood or pitching in to clean-up road kills or trash along the highway. People don't mind posturing about how tough they are, but how does that position make their community better?
Now, getting back to the idea of leadership, how do identified leaders encourage their "martial art" students and cadre to make their communities better? DO they encourage their students to make the community better? Do they provide a role model by which students can see HOW to make their communities better? Do they espouse a view that makes community improvement a priority? I know that often with my students the question comes up in Hapkido-- "Does this stuff really work?" and I wind up asking them "Do YOU really work?" As I said before I think a leader is more than just the head of an organization and thats why I thought Stuarts relationship with Ji Han Jae might be a good place to start. Thoughts?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
"....... A leader needs to lead in a positive direction and not be selfish ...."
I'm sorry for how what I am about to say might be taken, but I must say that I am a bit disappointed. To me it seems everytime a string such as this comes up (and that in ITSELF is a rarity) we always start at the same point. At the risk of stirring up consternation I for myself would like to take this a step beyond where you have positioned us, 'kay?
I would like to say that a leader is not just good at what they do, or needs to be able to relate to people. Take the next step. To me a leader is a role model who shows how this behavior is done and then causes the people around them to want to live their life the same way. Heres' an example of what I am talking about.
How many people say they practice a "martial art"? I don't want to even get into this issue but lets take a look at the results, yes? If a person really practices a martial art how is their community better for them following this Warriors' Path? Even little things like volunteering their time, giving blood or pitching in to clean-up road kills or trash along the highway. People don't mind posturing about how tough they are, but how does that position make their community better?
Now, getting back to the idea of leadership, how do identified leaders encourage their "martial art" students and cadre to make their communities better? DO they encourage their students to make the community better? Do they provide a role model by which students can see HOW to make their communities better? Do they espouse a view that makes community improvement a priority? I know that often with my students the question comes up in Hapkido-- "Does this stuff really work?" and I wind up asking them "Do YOU really work?" As I said before I think a leader is more than just the head of an organization and thats why I thought Stuarts relationship with Ji Han Jae might be a good place to start. Thoughts?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
OP
kwanjang
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #12
glad2bhere said:
Hello Bruce et al:
Thank you for the cudos. I am truly humbled.
FWIW. I have always included this type of training in my programs. I truly believe that teaching martial art without adding the Jung Shin spirit is not in the best interest of the student. Our students, either as a group or as individuals, are encouraged to make a difference in their lives by doing positive things with and for their families, fellow human beings, and communities. IMHO, one needs to compliment hard training with Jung Shin in order to keep focused toward good and positive things rather than just learning how to hurt others.
gmunoz
Purple Belt
OH yeaaahhhhhhhh! John Pellegrini is the man! Hapkido master!Enson said:
American HKD
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Dear Bruce,
I first met Doju Ji in 1982/83 through my teacher Son Tae Soo, he was visiting many Masters here in Philadelphia to discuss Sin Moo HKD. At the time Ji was living in California I was only exposed to him for a few days then. Needless to say during that time as a young 1st Dan and very impressionable.
Fast foward to 2003-04 I started training with him directly and had the oportunity over the last year to find out alot about the man as well as the martial artist.
Without going into great details these are some of my assesments.
Doju Ji is a very humble man IMO.
He practices the philosophy he teaches
Completly willing to transmit Sin Moo HKD in it's entirety.
Willness to teach anyone who's interested.
Doesn't put down anyone including his ememies.
Continues his own intense research and development of Hapkido & spiritual arts.
Vast Martial Arts knowledge in various traditions other than HKD.
Very open minded to new ideas techniques & variations of HKD.
Openly accepts the fact there are many clones that come directly from him.
I hope this helps?
I first met Doju Ji in 1982/83 through my teacher Son Tae Soo, he was visiting many Masters here in Philadelphia to discuss Sin Moo HKD. At the time Ji was living in California I was only exposed to him for a few days then. Needless to say during that time as a young 1st Dan and very impressionable.
Fast foward to 2003-04 I started training with him directly and had the oportunity over the last year to find out alot about the man as well as the martial artist.
Without going into great details these are some of my assesments.
Doju Ji is a very humble man IMO.
He practices the philosophy he teaches
Completly willing to transmit Sin Moo HKD in it's entirety.
Willness to teach anyone who's interested.
Doesn't put down anyone including his ememies.
Continues his own intense research and development of Hapkido & spiritual arts.
Vast Martial Arts knowledge in various traditions other than HKD.
Very open minded to new ideas techniques & variations of HKD.
Openly accepts the fact there are many clones that come directly from him.
I hope this helps?
glad2bhere
Master Black Belt
Dear Stuart:
Yep, NOW we're getting somewhere!!! Both your post and Rudys', I think ,begin to speak to putting the "martial" into martial art and for me THATS what makes a leader! For my part, anybody can open schools and anybody can collect fees for doing seminars. Its the desire to become more than what a person starts with that a good teacher and leader instills in their students and cadre. So when did you first notice that you wanted to do things HIS (Jis') way rather than just take what he was teaching and integrate it into your own way of doing things? Was there a particular moment or is it something you noted over a period of time?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
Yep, NOW we're getting somewhere!!! Both your post and Rudys', I think ,begin to speak to putting the "martial" into martial art and for me THATS what makes a leader! For my part, anybody can open schools and anybody can collect fees for doing seminars. Its the desire to become more than what a person starts with that a good teacher and leader instills in their students and cadre. So when did you first notice that you wanted to do things HIS (Jis') way rather than just take what he was teaching and integrate it into your own way of doing things? Was there a particular moment or is it something you noted over a period of time?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
OP
Hanzo04
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #16
an up and coming leader of american hapkido is master chris garland of executive martial arts who teaches jin jung kwan hapkido. and korean master would Bong Soo Han.
glad2bhere
Master Black Belt
All I know about Chris Garland was his role in the article by Ji Han Jae not so long ago. Seems there was some exception taken to the way he characterized his place in the matter of succession. Does anyone know Master Garland well enough to speak to this, or his priorities in teaching? Thoughts? Comments?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
Best Wishes,
Bruce
American HKD
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Dear Bruce,
......So when did you first notice that you wanted to do things HIS (Jis') way rather than just take what he was teaching and integrate it into your own way of doing things? Was there a particular moment or is it something you noted over a period of time?......
Interesting question and also not a simple one. I cant say I do things like Ji after all everyone's different.
Basically I alway had the veiw that a MA Master was more like Kwai Chang Cain of the TV series Kung Fu rather than someone who knows how to fight (no morals or ethics etc.)
Ji Han Jae seemed to be the first person in my 25 years in MA that I see has the whole picture of MA, thats similar to my thoughts of MA.
Although I studies for many years with Master Son a very humble and honest man and also some very fine Korean Masters they didn't have the philosophy behind Hapkido that I was looking for. When I question my teacher over the years nothing really came out of it because he didn't really know.
When I was invited by Master Ji to train with him last summer (just for the record when myself and Hackworth and my teacher met Master Ji at the meeting that never took place) I didn't know what to except. I just felt it would be good to learn from the source and my Master said he's number one in the world and I should go.
So I was very surpised to find a humble man teaching and practicing a spiritual form of Hapkido. As time went on I realized he's the REAL THING! and not a put on.
One more point I believe HKD is missing a standard philosophy to the Art it has some general concepts that vary from Kwan to Kwan but no prescribed philosophy.
I also don't think Choi Yong Sool wasn't educated in any philosophy and I think he taught only phyiscal techniques.
Ji studied Korean Taoisism as well as Chinese & Japanese versions of Taoism to form Sin Moo he also claims to learned the mental aspects from Taoist Lee and Grandma.
......So when did you first notice that you wanted to do things HIS (Jis') way rather than just take what he was teaching and integrate it into your own way of doing things? Was there a particular moment or is it something you noted over a period of time?......
Interesting question and also not a simple one. I cant say I do things like Ji after all everyone's different.
Basically I alway had the veiw that a MA Master was more like Kwai Chang Cain of the TV series Kung Fu rather than someone who knows how to fight (no morals or ethics etc.)
Ji Han Jae seemed to be the first person in my 25 years in MA that I see has the whole picture of MA, thats similar to my thoughts of MA.
Although I studies for many years with Master Son a very humble and honest man and also some very fine Korean Masters they didn't have the philosophy behind Hapkido that I was looking for. When I question my teacher over the years nothing really came out of it because he didn't really know.
When I was invited by Master Ji to train with him last summer (just for the record when myself and Hackworth and my teacher met Master Ji at the meeting that never took place) I didn't know what to except. I just felt it would be good to learn from the source and my Master said he's number one in the world and I should go.
So I was very surpised to find a humble man teaching and practicing a spiritual form of Hapkido. As time went on I realized he's the REAL THING! and not a put on.
One more point I believe HKD is missing a standard philosophy to the Art it has some general concepts that vary from Kwan to Kwan but no prescribed philosophy.
I also don't think Choi Yong Sool wasn't educated in any philosophy and I think he taught only phyiscal techniques.
Ji studied Korean Taoisism as well as Chinese & Japanese versions of Taoism to form Sin Moo he also claims to learned the mental aspects from Taoist Lee and Grandma.
OP
kwanjang
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #19
From what I had previously heard, and now with Master Rosenberg's further information, I think GM Ji teaches what I envision martial arts to be. I met GM Ji at one of the WKSA functions where he demonstrated. He certainly seemed to walk his talk, and he was humble to boot... I liked that a lot
American HKD
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Dear Rudy,
I'm glad to hear there's more Masters with the same vision about MA.
I don't think too many people realize that aspect of MA because it's not taught in any systematic way as part of Traditional Hapkido.
Sin Moo teaches these philosophies from white belt. Some of the pholosophy is Taoist based and hard to really due if your not a monk, but most is very practically applied to everyday life.
Sin Moo http://www.sinmoohapkido.com/mindbody.html they do list some phiolosphy there.
I'm glad to hear there's more Masters with the same vision about MA.
I don't think too many people realize that aspect of MA because it's not taught in any systematic way as part of Traditional Hapkido.
Sin Moo teaches these philosophies from white belt. Some of the pholosophy is Taoist based and hard to really due if your not a monk, but most is very practically applied to everyday life.
Sin Moo http://www.sinmoohapkido.com/mindbody.html they do list some phiolosphy there.
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