KRAV MAGA TRAINING • That's why the Street is different from your Dojo

[drop bear]

Interestingly, we were taught knee on belly and knee on sternum.

Knee on sternum sucks btw.

there is a positional asphyxia risk associated there by the way.

just in case people want to get heavy with the legal ramifications.

 

[drop bear]

Mmm! Where I come from bouncers also work inside removing patrons who are no longer welcome. As to the second part, I'm not sure what I have posted that gave you that impression. Perhaps you could elaborate.

security guards do all sorts of stuff.

 

[Tez3]

drop bear, I honestly think you are having a conversation with yourself as well as dropping in comments that are amusing only in your head. I know you think having a conversation is like sparring but really it's not. I don't think you have read what K-man has actually written and I don't think Hanzou needs to be told what the 'ramifications' are on a technique he will be very familiar with.
I imagine you think you are the only one who deals with violence and potential violence, that you feel you are bringing us your wisdom and knowledge gained from years out in the field as it were. Sadly that's not the case, many of us have been in situations that have taught us more than reading your posts do, we all speak from our own experience. We have learnt from instructors that have also had the same or often more experience. In other words we aren't bloody stupid mate so stop treating us as if we are.

 

[K-man]

i have not heard a mabye from you in this before. You don't run. You don't ground work you infight and never monkey dance.

and the running thing is a bit of a tangent. It stops you getting sniper punched under the right circumstances. So if you don't run after me all the better. I am creating a bit of space.

you are putting a lot of restrictions out there. And making them black and white occurrences as to what will happen.

I'm not sure what you are arguing for or against here. I train because I enjoy it. I teach so I can pass on the information I have had the privilege of learning. If I ever need to use the skills I have learned it will be in a self defence situation, not sparring, not competition and not in a security/ bouncing environment. In self defence hopefully I will never need to resort to fighting. If that becomes necessary I will not be chasing someone. They can come to me or I will be out the door if escaping is an option. I have no intention of fighting on the ground. If I was taken to the ground my prime objective would be to regain my feet and disengage. The monkey dance is what in legal terms is consensual fighting, not that that makes it legal. I'm not into consensual violence except in the dojo

As to running. If you are running away, why would I want to chase you? You can make all the distance you like. In the meantime I'll be leaving.

I'm putting no restrictions on anything. Under the law, I can fight to defend myself, my family or my property. Outside of that I am throwing myself on the mercy of the court. From past experience playing the 'legal game' is generally beneficial only for barristers and solicitors. I will only be fighting if there is no other option.

 

[Transk53]

security guards do all sorts of stuff.

Yes security has all manner of different stuff to take part in, but l don't think chasing someone down a street and giving them a kicking is appropriate. I think you always have to do what's necessary. Someone has a dig fair enough.

 

[ballen0351]

i am sure it can be taught. But the question was has k man used what he has been taught?

Question has nothing to do with Kman Your claim that you cant use peripheral vision in the real world and that is just flat wrong.

unless you taught him.

nope

i mean that is what you do right. Train. Test. Train some more.
removing your focus from the job at hand. By concentrating on external threats Increases the risk of not being able to do that job. You don't get to do both at once effectively.

Nonsense. I train new recruits how to do this every year. No worrying about ALL threats will get you killed. You know out in the real world......

3,4, 10 on one you are suggesting there is any likelihood you could stand and trade?

Yep I've done it and I'm still here

You wouldn't cover and move?

sometimes you cant move.

i don't see how you achieve that. Regardless how much better training you have.

Welcome to the real world.

 

[Danny T]

Interestingly, we were taught knee on belly and knee on sternum.

Knee on sternum sucks btw.

Was taught both points and the neck in Karate, Wing Chun and Pekiti-Tirsia as well as in CSW and BJJ. Using the term 'knee on belly' generically as knee on the body controlling his body with pressure.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Was taught both points and the neck in Karate, Wing Chun and Pekiti-Tirsia as well as in CSW and BJJ. Using the term 'knee on belly' generically as knee on the body controlling his body with pressure.

Yeah, I consider "knee on belly" or "knee mount" to be a generic term. The way I normally teach it is actually shin across the waistline like a seat belt. The knee on sternum variation is nastier, but a bit less secure and easier to escape. The knee on face version is just being mean, although it does help build your pain tolerance if you're the person on the bottom.

 

[Transk53]

Mmm! Where I come from bouncers also work inside removing patrons who are no longer welcome. As to the second part, I'm not sure what I have posted that gave you that impression. Perhaps you could elaborate.

Sorry. I meant to double quote you and drop bear. My edit button did not work.

 

[Transk53]

Sorry. I meant to double quote you and drop bear. My edit button did not work.

Also you are. Depending on the size of the venue, it could be a two man or a big team. The front door staff tend to stay on the front door, unless a code red is called. Then you can make use of bar staff and management.

 

[K-man]

Sorry. I meant to double quote you and drop bear. My edit button did not work.

Cool!

 

[Transk53]

Cool!

Just finding drop bears credentials as a doorman a bit sceptical. I have worked with one Ozzie, things seem a little off.

 

[drop bear]

Yes security has all manner of different stuff to take part in, but l don't think chasing someone down a street and giving them a kicking is appropriate. I think you always have to do what's necessary. Someone has a dig fair enough.

there a circumstances. You get a back up call or something.

i used to work shopping centers. A back up run could be a half marathon before i even got to the fight.

but i am not strictly keeping this bouncing either. Part of the methods i am endorsing are also the ones i find hard to stop. Rather than the ones i use.

security is quite often using the many vs one tactics.

 

[drop bear]

drop bear, I honestly think you are having a conversation with yourself as well as dropping in comments that are amusing only in your head. I know you think having a conversation is like sparring but really it's not. I don't think you have read what K-man has actually written and I don't think Hanzou needs to be told what the 'ramifications' are on a technique he will be very familiar with.
I imagine you think you are the only one who deals with violence and potential violence, that you feel you are bringing us your wisdom and knowledge gained from years out in the field as it were. Sadly that's not the case, many of us have been in situations that have taught us more than reading your posts do, we all speak from our own experience. We have learnt from instructors that have also had the same or often more experience. In other words we aren't bloody stupid mate so stop treating us as if we are.

mabye if you were part of the discussion you would get better responses.

so far you have not discussed the topic at all.

so i am not sure what you are trying to achieve.

 

[drop bear]

Question has nothing to do with Kman Your claim that you cant use peripheral vision in the real world and that is just flat wrong.

nope

Nonsense. I train new recruits how to do this every year. No worrying about ALL threats will get you killed. You know out in the real world......

Yep I've done it and I'm still here

sometimes you cant move.

Welcome to the real world.

l claim peripheral vision is limited in application in the real world. And that is just flat right.

ok so your training is the same or different to k mans?

i had a look. Your average range of peripheral vision is about a hundred degrees sideways. How much better do you get someone's range through training?

because a hundred degrees really isnt much

you have fought 10 guys on your own?

 

[Tez3]

mabye if you were part of the discussion you would get better responses.

so far you have not discussed the topic at all.

so i am not sure what you are trying to achieve.

Well you got me beat there as I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Transk53]

there a circumstances. You get a back up call or something.

i used to work shopping centers. A back up run could be a half marathon before i even got to the fight.

but i am not strictly keeping this bouncing either. Part of the methods i am endorsing are also the ones i find hard to stop. Rather than the ones i use.

security is quite often using the many vs one tactics.

Yeah I understand aggression and the moment. This is what I teach my guys by personality, but tactics work as a team.

 

[Transk53]

l claim peripheral vision is limited in application in the real world. And that is just flat right.

ok so your training is the same or different to k mans?

i had a look. Your average range of peripheral vision is about a hundred degrees sideways. How much better do you get someone's range through training?

because a hundred degrees really isnt much

you have fought 10 guys on your own?

No all wrong.

(Edit> as I personally do not think it is appropriate to brag about taking on 10 blokes)

 

[ballen0351]

l claim peripheral vision is limited in application in the real world. And that is just flat right.

then your not doing it right

ok so your training is the same or different to k mans?

I have no idea what or how he trains. I know how I train officers

i had a look. Your average range of peripheral vision is about a hundred degrees sideways. How much better do you get someone's range through training?

because a hundred degrees really isnt much

Yep and if you don't get "tunnel Vision" learn not to panic and move you body and your head I can increase that range pretty far. If I stare at you I get 100 degrees. then if I look left I can still see you in my right side peripheral and my left is now 100 degrees farther so I still see you and that much farther. Look off to the right and same thing. before you know it you can cover a large amount of ground. Then add that to the eye naturally looks for movement it makes it even easier as long as you stay calm

you have fought 10 guys on your own?

Actually in the 4-5 min I was waiting for help I probably hit over 20 different people So I don't know an actual number. We have a bar area that on weekends its nothing to have several1000s of people in the summer. Huge fight in a parking lot I work my way to the middle and see people stomping a man to death and a gun laying on the ground next to him.. He's laying next to a car so I kicked the gun under the car then I put myself between him and the crowd and used the car to protect my back. I emptied a can of pepper spray then started swinging my baton at anyone that wouldn't get back. There was several people that attempted to attack me and him. Apparently he punched his girlfriend in front of a large group of minority guys who took offense when they tried to get him to stop he called them a bunch of racial slurs which made them even more pissed. then he started to pull a gun from his pocket which made them even more mad. Had I just concentrated on one guy at a time Id have had my head knocked in like him. You keep your head on a swivel learn not to fixate on one thing.

The first lesson I teach and the one every police recruit falls for is the domestic violence scenario. You send them in and say the male beat up the female. Have the roll players argue and the recruit ALWAYS gets in the middle it never fails. Then when he arrests the male he always turns his back to the female and that's when she attacks him. After we teach them better tactics and train them that nothing is ever as it seems and never fixate on anything for too long they do much better.
Ask anyone that has ever been robbed with a weapon most victims fixate on the weapon and can describe it pretty well but never look at the suspects face they get tunnel vision.

 

[drop bear]

Yeah I understand aggression and the moment. This is what I teach my guys by personality, but tactics work as a team.

i am not saying they don't. But in the vein of multiple attackers. That is generally us. We are the ones who use those tactics. But there is also a set of counter tactics that spoil what we do.

those are the ones that you would employment against multiples.