Is wing chun effective at all?

[yak sao]

An art is as good as it's practitioner!

That said, the type of art has to be for you specifically. I tried some Wing or Ving Tsun and i had the feeling that i had to adjust my body (postures, stances etc) to much. I was used to using more natural stances in the Silat i did and couldn't used to WC/VT.

So just take some classes and see if it's for you, if it's not just look for something else, simple

I was the same in the beginning. I came from a different southern kung fu system which I had trained in for 14 years and found the structures, footwork and stances of WT very foreign to my way of moving and thinking but I stuck it out.
In fact, for whatever reason, I saw WTs potential after that first day of training and stopped training that other system that very day.
It took a lot of retooling and rewiring of muscle memory but I am here to tell you it was worth it.
I am now 20 years into WT and my only regret is I didn't find it 20 years sooner.

 

[Dylan9d]

I was the same in the beginning. I came from a different southern kung fu system which I had trained in for 14 years and found the structures, footwork and stances of WT very foreign to my way of moving and thinking but I stuck it out.
In fact, for whatever reason, I saw WTs potential after that first day of training and stopped training that other system that very day.
It took a lot of retooling and rewiring of muscle memory but I am here to tell you it was worth it.
I am now 20 years into WT and my only regret is I didn't find it 20 years sooner.

Everyone their own taste right? Thats the beauty of martial arts and thats why there are so many

 

[Danny T]

Everyone their own taste right? Thats the beauty of martial arts and thats why there are so many

The thing about taste is one can become accustomed to it and in time grow to enjoy it.
I also had a tough time coming from a boxing and shotokan background. But having full contact competition experience and some close quarter combat experience I recognized some excellent possibilities. It was over 100 hrs of training before I became somewhat comfortable. Been in WC for almost 40 years now. I also train in Muay Thai and boxing which started several years after being in WC and my Ajarn would often tell me, "Sir, this is Muay Thai not wing chun change your stance. It took several months to adjust to the taste of MT but I did and today I have no problem flowing between wc and mt or blending their flavors. My wc is far better because of the mt training, also my mt is better because of my wc knowledge and skills.

I think it comes down to having a good instructor/teacher and having the desire/passion to learn something new.

 

[Dylan9d]

The thing about taste is one can become accustomed to it and in time grow to enjoy it.
I also had a tough time coming from a boxing and shotokan background. But having full contact competition experience and some close quarter combat experience I recognized some excellent possibilities. It was over 100 hrs of training before I became somewhat comfortable. Been in WC for almost 40 years now. I also train in Muay Thai and boxing which started several years after being in WC and my Ajarn would often tell me, "Sir, this is Muay Thai not wing chun change your stance. It took several months to adjust to the taste of MT but I did and today I have no problem flowing between wc and mt or blending their flavors. My wc is far better because of the mt training, also my mt is better because of my wc knowledge and skills.

I think it comes down to having a good instructor/teacher and having the desire/passion to learn something new.

Well the desire or passion to learn something new isn't the problem i think. Something has to be somewhat appealing to you before you start something new.
I have grown custom to the natural stances of the Silat i practice but these stances are also covered in the Eskrima i practiced and also the Kickboxing/Muay Thai i have practised and also the Krav Maga i have practised. And the stances in Wing Chun are far from natural, same goes for the arm movements and footwork.

It doesn't matter though because i can choose what i practise and thats the beauty of it all

 

[Transk53]

IRAS. Internally Rotated Adduction Stance

The EWTO coined this term to describe the Character Two stance (Yee Gee Kim Yuen Ma).

And you're right, this stance, while very restrictive feeling in the beginning, is very mobile and fluid. In fact, I would say that about WT/WC as a whole. At first you are consumed with structure, stance etc. but the time comes when you break through all of that and it becomes about movement.

Thanks for putting me right on that. He was a foreign fella so I must have misheard.

 

[Transk53]

Not going to win many friends on here with that approach. I am from LT lineage...we spar other lineages, in fact I have a standing invitation to any WC guy of any lineage and any MAist of any style, including boxers and wrestlers, to come and train/spar with me or my group.

And yes, we spend a lot of time closing the gap as well.

What MA does not close the gap I wonder?

 

[Kwan Sau]

What MA does not close the gap I wonder?

The martial art of gun fighting!

 

[Transk53]

The martial art of gun fighting!

Oh yeah, the one where you stand 1760 yards apart like Quigley lol

 

[Paul_D]

Is it effective for what purpose? Is it effective for cage fighting, probably not as it is not designed to score points in competition. Is it effective for self defence? To paraphrase Iain Abernethy, you don't take your Wing Chun out of your pocket and hit someoen with it, it's YOU that is in the fight, not your art.

But Wing Chun is based on effective principals, the same principals found in all effective arts. If these principals weren't sound then all these arts wouldn't; bother with them, they only bother with them as they are effective.

 

[geezer]

IRAS. Internally Rotated Adduction Stance

The EWTO coined this term to describe the Character Two stance (Yee Gee Kim Yuen Ma).

Hey Yak, as you probably know, I trained with LT back in the 80s. I had little contact with the EWTO except for brief seminars with some Germans like Emin. Then in the early 90s I had to leave WT for about 15 years. When I came back in 2007, the US organization had become very influenced by the EWTO curriculum.

So anyway, some of the younger technicians I met kept going on about IRAS, and were astounded when I didn't know what they were talking about. I remember saying, "Oh, you mean Character Two Stance". Then they were the ones looking confused! Personally I prefer the term "Goat Riding Stance" (from Yee Gee Kim Yeung Ma) ...mainly because I'm a contrarian goof-ball.

But there is one thing that always bothered me. The EWTO is run by Keith Kernspecht and the Germans, ...so does the acronym IRAS also work in German as well as English? Or do they have yet another term?

 

[yak sao]

But there is one thing that always bothered me. The EWTO is run by Keith Kernspecht and the Germans, ...so does the acronym IRAS also work in German as well as English? Or do they have yet another term?

I've always wondered that myself.

As for me, I always liked "character two", maybe because it was the first term I learned.

 

[yak sao]

I don't know why I never thought of this before, but I went to an English to German translation site and typed in Internally Rotated Adduction Stance and it gave me Intern gedreht / Adduktion Haltung.

Any German speakers out there to verify this? My German is pretty much limited to what I've picked up from old war movies and Volkswagen commercials.

 

[geezer]

My German is pretty much limited to what I've picked up from old war movies and Volkswagen commercials.

Same here. My ancestors may be German, but...

 

[Transk53]

I have a Polish colleuge whom speaks German. If not solved by Monday, I will ask him to look at the above post.

 

[Pat M]

In all honesty Wing Chun isn't for me, but having tried it a number of times I can without doubt say that in a practical situation I feel that it would 'work' and be very effective at that. It came across as a powerful style that works to keep you safe without expending too much of your own energy.

Part of me wishes it did fit for me, but hey Kenpo will have to do for me. Hope that helps.

Love the logo you are using as your profile picture. Simple but a great logo, the best kind.

 

[Pat M]

Well I have searched the website of where I am planning to learn wing chun and the master who taught the master thier was taught by ip Ching which is ip man's son and also 1 of the 5 grandmasters left and I don't only want to learn wing chun but I want to start with it

I would recommend starting your training and see how you go, as it appears you have limited MA experience anything will be a forward step down the road. Given your Sifu's, Sifu's, Sifu .. was Ip Ching you may find that his more physical style may have rubbed off a little if not a lot onto students students making it a little less structural although never straying far from it.

Just give it a go, I have trained and studied many MAs including Karate based (long range) and I do not think you are missing out, it is just a different discipline. Give it a go.

 

[wingerjim]

Wing Chun as a style is more effective than most systems and styles out there, but ultimately it depends on who is teaching and how you train. Mosy of the folks who derride Wing Chun do so because it has never been shown as effective in MMA but miss the point that Wing Chun is not designed for nor trained for the sporting environment. If you are young and athletic or powerfully built then MMA is a good route to go for you or you could simply train muay thai and BJJ, but if you want something that doesn't rely heavilly on strength and athletism then you'll have to look elsewhere and Wing Chun as stated previously is as good as or better than most things available.

I agree completely....MMA is a sport with rules. Wing Chun trains a person that the only rules lie in the forms, the human body and the training. Groan kicks, knee kicks, throat chops, etc are all against the rules of MMA, but not so in Wing Chun. This is not to say any MMA fighters are not good on the streets, on the contrary, it just means comparing the streets to the MMA cage is like comparing watermelons to kiwi fruit. What works well in MMA would likely work well on the streets, but so do other Martial Arts that may not be as effective in MMA.

 

[Vajramusti]

I agree completely....MMA is a sport with rules. Wing Chun trains a person that the only rules lie in the forms, the human body and the training. Groan kicks, knee kicks, throat chops, etc are all against the rules of MMA, but not so in Wing Chun. This is not to say any MMA fighters are not good on the streets, on the contrary, it just means comparing the streets to the MMA cage is like comparing watermelons to kiwi fruit. What works well in MMA would likely work well on the streets, but so do other Martial Arts that may not be as effective in MMA.

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"Groan kics"(sic)-they are the best kind probably.(g)

 

[Danny T]

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"Groan kics"(sic)-they are the best kind probably.(g)

LOL.
At my age, with all the injuries over the years, all my kicks are groan kicks. Just getting up is a groan.

 

[Vajramusti]

LOL.
At my age, with all the injuries over the years, all my kicks are groan kicks. Just getting up is a groan.

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VBG- I can relate to that!!