Is grappling better for female self defense than striking?

[Hanzou]

If you dont see it, you're purposefully not even looking XD

Oh I'm definitely looking. I see the same thing in your vids, and the TMA vids that I see when I watch untrained thugs brawl in the streets.

I wouldn't consider either to be showcase of technical skill, though some of the technique displayed by the thugs looks better than the "technique" on display by so-called expert martial artists.

Neither matches the skill level found in boxing or kickboxing.

Additionally, vids like the one above is why I didn't find the one hit slap that Brian posted to be all that impressive. I see untrained kids do that to each other all the time.

 

[Drose427]

Oh I'm definitely looking. I see the same thing in your vids, and the TMA vids that I see when I watch untrained thugs brawl in the streets.

I wouldn't consider either to be showcase of technical skill, though some of the technique displayed by the thugs looks better than the "technique" on display by so-called expert martial artists.

Neither matches the skill level found in boxing or kickboxing.

Nothing in that vid so far looks REMOTELY like the movement in any of the videos I posted bud XD

Keep lookin

As for Skill level of movement in boxing, it isnt as widespread as youre making it out to be.

Heres a highlight of the pacqiao mayweather bout (arguably the two best boxers currently) and they arent circling like Ali either XD

 

[elder999]

I'm curious where any of that above contradicts anything I stated in the earlier post.

Enshin isn't an off shoot of kyokushin, it's an off shoot of Ashihara-an offshoot of kyokushin would have kata.

Just to spin you up, think of Enshin as all bunkai, with a lot less kata.....

 

[Hanzou]

Enshin isn't an off shoot of kyokushin, it's an off shoot of Ashihara-an offshoot of kyokushin would have kata.

Just to spin you up, think of Enshin as all bunkai, with a lot less kata.....

Enshin kaikan

Focus Hybrid and eclectic
Country of origin Japan
Creator Jōkō Ninomiya
Parenthood Kyokushin kaikan, Ashihara kaikan
Olympic sport No
Official website Home

Enshin kaikan - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

 

[elder999]

Enshin kaikan

Focus Hybrid and eclectic
Country of origin Japan
Creator Jōkō Ninomiya
Parenthood Kyokushin kaikan, Ashihara kaikan
Olympic sport No
Official website Home

Enshin kaikan - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Yeah, Wikipedia is basically wrong. Ninomiya was disassociated from kyokushin for nearly a decade with Ashihara before founding Enshin.

 

[Hanzou]

Nothing in that vid so far looks REMOTELY like the movement in any of the videos I posted bud XD

Well to be fair, the majority of your vids are just demonstrations.

However, since you said that my vids also contained the attributes you discussed, tell me, what's the difference between this;

and this;

x09BAq.gif

Other than the fact that two punk kids have better fighting form than two martial arts experts in Asia....

As for Skill level of movement in boxing, it isnt as widespread as youre making it out to be.

Heres a highlight of the pacqiao mayweather bout (arguably the two best boxers currently) and they arent circling like Ali either XD

Are we watching the same vid? They're circling each other and counter punching constantly.

 

[Drose427]

J2tWAR.gif

and this;

[URL='http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/5-20-2015/x09BAq.gif']x09BAq.gif[/URL]

Other than the fact that two punk kids have better fighting form than two martial arts experts in Asia....



Are we watching the same vid? They're circling each other and counter punching constantly.[/QUOTE]

GO back and watch,.....

I've post 4 or 5 different sparring and tournament videos and guess what they did?

Circled and punched/kicked each other constantly XD

 

[elder999]

Yeah, Wikipedia is basically wrong. Ninomiya was disassociated from kyokushin for nearly a decade with Ashihara before founding Enshin.

More to the point, while definitely "hybrid and eclectic," it's form is, essentially, karate not "kickboxing."

 

[Drose427]

More to the point, while definitely "hybrid and eclectic," it's form is, essentially, karate not "kickboxing."

Im not sure he can differientiate the two..

I mean he posted a wiki claiming Japanese Kickboxing came from MT,

When the wiki said pretty plainly it came from Karate guys, using Karate Techs, wanting to spar under Full Contact MT rules.

He seems to be under the impression that Karate adopted kickboxing methods.....when those methods where in Karate first XD

 

[elder999]

He seems to be under the impression that Karate adopted kickboxing methods.....when those methods where in Karate first XD

Karate-in the case of kyokushin-did adapt some kickboxing "methods." The thigh kick entered tournament sparring after fighting muay thai boxers in Thailand, in the early 70's and late 60's.....that's really about it, though........the round kick didn't become a "muay thai" round kick, it was just given a new legal target in sparring....

 

[elder999]

Well, I have to say. I'm really glad we hashed this out, and can all agree that BJJ is better for female self defense than striking.

Wha-wha-wha?

 

[Steve]

Wha-wha-wha?

Lol. Oh great. Now you're going to want to argue about it!

 

[jezr74]

Interesting thread. 10% Article, 40% Conjecture, 50% Crazy.

 

[Hanzou]

It would appear though that you feel that BJJ which is derived from traditional Asian arts as you say it is the epitome of all martial systems? Am I correct in assuming that?

In all honesty, I feel that Judo is the epitome of traditional Asian martial arts. However, I feel that rules and regulations have stifled its development, and its offshoots, Bjj and Sambo have done a better job of doing what Judo should have done. I view Bjj as simply a more eclectic and open form of Judo.

So no, your assumption would be wrong.

 

[Hanzou]

Hanzou like you I absolutely love BJJ. I just don't think it is the end all be all in the martial arts world. Important yes, invincible absolutely not. (it is the practitioner in the end that matters) Is it great for what it does? Absolutely!!! Does it have limitations? Absolutely!!! Unfortunately some times with you making almost everything about BJJ you come across as someone very "new" and inexperienced in the martial arts. Because most people who have been around the block a time or two and involved in "real world" encounters do not see everything black and white but instead shades of grey. They have seen or been involved with enough violence that they have witnessed some strange ****.

I'm curious where you get the idea that I believe that Bjj is "invincible". I'm in agreement with you that it is very important. Despite the common belief around here, I only discuss Bjj when it pertains to the topic of the thread. I don't interject Bjj when the thread doesn't warrant it. Further, since the majority of my martial arts experience in grappling, that's the perspective I'm coming from. I think the problem is that when something comes from a Bjj or MMA perspective, some traditional stylists have a sort of inferiority complex and feel that the Bjj or MMA practitioner is attacking their style. I've gotten that charge simply by asking why Kung Fu and Karate while engaged in fighting doesn't resemble pre-arranged forms that are supposedly so integral to their system.

And of course comes the childish charge that I simply don't understand traditional styles, which sounds like a snake oil salesman who gives you a tonic that doesn't do what its supposed to do.

Here's what I do understand; I understand that my experiences with traditional martial arts line up perfectly with those Asian martial artists slapping themselves silly on the streets of China. They even line up perfectly with the video of that Karate guy wildly hitting that pimp and knocking him unconscious by pure luck. You really think I don't know why karate guys don't fight like their katas? You really think I don't know why a Taiji master can't stop a simple takedown? You really think I don't know why Wing Chun and Aikido guys came up with that anti-grappling nonsense? You really think I don't understand why Stephen Hayes can't come up with a simple counter to the guard?

I know the answers to all of those questions. I'm simply seeking some honesty, and to date, I have yet to receive any. That's okay though. It's what I've come to expect from a certain segment of the MA community.

 

[Hanzou]

Yeah, Wikipedia is basically wrong. Ninomiya was disassociated from kyokushin for nearly a decade with Ashihara before founding Enshin.

It's pretty clear that Ashihara karate comes from Kyokushin, and that Enshin in turn comes from Ashihara and Kyokushin.

So how is Wikipedia incorrect here? Kyokushin -----> Ashihara Karate -----> Enshin Karate.

Of course all of that is irrelevant to the main point; All of those are modern styles of Karate.

 

[jezr74]

For what is worth. More on the details of what happened. Sounds like she fought him off using some ground skills. Then attacked him standing using her striking skills.

Karate champ Taela Davis fights off thug in disturbing daylight assault

Win Win.

 

[RTKDCMB]

They even line up perfectly with the video of that Karate guy wildly hitting that pimp and knocking him unconscious by pure luck.

Pure luck? He used a specific technique to a specific target which had the desired effect of ending the engagement.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Yeah, Wikipedia is basically wrong.

Wikipedia wrong about something,such a shocker.

 

[Hanzou]

Pure luck? He used a specific technique to a specific target which had the desired effect of ending the engagement.

LoL! If you say so.

Like I said, I've seen better "technique" between two thugs on World Star Hip Hop.