improper touching in the Dojo

[D.Cobb]

Originally posted by rachel
There is a man in our class who when paired up with my friend or myself, maybe other women too, I haven't asked them yet , always ends up punching our breasts. When he is supposed to throw punches at us and we have to block them he always punches too high or low and manages to punch our breasts. My friend thinks he does it on purpose. I think he may on occasion but that he might have a depth perception problem.I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. Any way I talked to our teacher and he said it's not really his place to say anything to this man and we should tell him ourselves. I prefer not to work with this individual because of this. I can tell this person but the teacher said in a real fight we could be touched on our breasts and to deal with it. Wrong answer? I'm kinda pissed with my teachers response to this. If someone is trying to cop free feels in the Dojo it's unacceptable. And we can block it's just that he always manages to get a few touches in and we are not happy. What should we do?

Seeing as your teacher won't do anything about it, you need to kick this guy as hard as you can, right where his mother will not kiss him, and yell as loud as you can, I SAID DON"T! .

And when teacher has something to say, remind him of his response to your complaint. And say something like, "Well that's what would happen if he touched me in the street like that. Plus I'd get the police involved!"

That'll make them both think twice about their respective responsabilities as far as female students are concerned. Also buy yourself one of thos plastic breast guards. Don't tell anyone, and whatch his face when he busts his knuckles by punching you wrongly.

I hate sexual harrasment in the dojo!

--Dave

:asian:

 

[PaulP]

Hi Rachel
All the responses are good.
Yes there are accidents, the occasional contact does happen. It is up to your instructor to stop this. But if he doesn’t, you can refuse to train with him and if this is happening to others they can do the same.
I had a similar situation. Years ago at the first club I trained at there was a woman that used to always strike the guys in the groin. It could have been self-defense or sparring, it didn’t matter. We would tell her, but that didn’t stop her. So my training buddy and me decide to reciprocate. Every time she kick or punched us in the nads we would punch or slap her breasts (and they where big targets). She complained saying that women’s breasts are very sensitive and it hurt. She also had a hard time explaining the bruise to her husband. We told her that the boys down there where sensitive also (I was bruised on occasion also and that’s wearing a cup). She seemed to get the connection.
A buddy of mine at another club had this guy that would always hit the other guys in the nads also. Instead beating on him I decide to wear a boxing no foul cup over his uniform. A no foul is a big cup with a big padded lower abdomen protector, it’s big and red. When they did sparring and he was partner with this guy he would loudly excuse him self and quickly return with this on. It was a humorous way to defuse the situation. You could try a big chest padding like they have for Tae Kwon Do.
The bottom line is, if you are uncomfortable with what this guy is doing, it’s wrong. Don’t put-up with it.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

PaulP, that's certainly an interesting turn of events. This time it's a woman who's the perpetrator and attacking the guys' nether regions i.e., their cooters.

I hope she learned her lesson to shut that crap down. Just the simple thought of taking a shot in the Nads makes me want to fall to the ground and curl up in the fetal position.

It seems that Rachel's tormentor needs to learn the same lesson as your woman gonads attacker, and that is, don't go there!!!

Rachel's Master Instructor needs to step up and correct this problem in order to protect all of the girls and women in his dojo.

 

[liangzhicheng]

I'm going to jump on the bandwagon...yes, what the guy is doing is wrong, and the teacher should do something about it. Time to jump off the bandwagon...women and men should be treated equally. Improper contact happens irregardless of sex. The instructor should protect everyone from this, not just the females. Note that I'm not targeting anyone with this comment. I train with several women. How I train with them depends on their comfort level. Do I avoid touching their breasts? Yes. However, with the women who are more confident about their martial abilities, I feel more comfortable targeting the chest area instead of going higher near the neck. Women shouldn't need to be protected, and having us men jumping in when women are in trouble helps enforce the image of women being weak, which is most definitely not true. Good luck with your situation, Rachel.

 

[Cruentus]

I am more curious as to what the outcome of all this will be. Can you update us when the time comes?

Thanx

 

[Damian Mavis]

All my female students wear a hard cupped bra made for martial arts and they have never have never had a problem since it's like putting a wall on between your chest and any incomming objects.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[Seig]

I have tried to encourage female chest protectors of one sort or another and the women tend to look on them with disdain. As a rfesult, sometimes, incidental contact occurs.

 

[Damian Mavis]

I look at chest protectors with disdain too... but that's a federation bias... anyway, these martial arts bras are non visible and go on just like any sports bra under thier uniform. I don't see how a woman could have any issue with that.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[tkdcanada]

I imagine that they would be VERY uncomfortable. Anyway, it's either wear something, or suck it up, just like a guy wearing a cup (I'm talking about UNintentional contact). Personally, I don't find that area very sensitive anyway - being hit there would be not different than being hit anywhere else. Just my opinion.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

I'm a guy, and when we're doing drills, defensive techniques, or even supposed non-contact sparring, I very rarely take a shot to the nads, and by the same token I know the gals at my dojang very rarely experience shots to the chest. It's all controlled training in a training hall, dojang, dojo, whatever. Bottomline is that it's controlled.

However, during full contact exercises, then it's pretty much open season. In any event, let me point out that everyone wears protective equiptment during these full contact training exercises. So, if you take a shot to the balls or the chest, you just eat it and suck it up because you are, or should be wearing cups and chest protectors. The equiptment deflects most of the impact/danger to your privates.

That said, if you have a guy who's consistently copping a feel on the girls during exercises where normally you don't need to go to those areas, then shouldn't the master instructor put a stop to that?

If you're in a training hall environment, then a MI should not allow his female students to be sexually harassed. It's not about being overly protective of women or girls. IMHO it's about respect for female martial artists . They deserve as much, I understand this because I have sisters and a daughter who's a martial artist. I wouldn't allow them to be harrassed at a MA school, or anywhere else if I could prevent it... :asian:

 

[Seig]

I think we all agree in principle if not execution. :asian:

 

[rachel]

Everything is cool with this person now. I was working with him the other day and there was no problem this time. Also he just got hurt in class so I don't know when he'll be back. He twisted his knee. I believe my instructor wants me to take the initiative because we both believe it 's accidental and because I'm very quiet in class. He wants me to be more vocal. I need to speak up. He's a very good teacher. He's not unfeeling or anything. I don't want everyone thinking he's a bad person because he's far from it.

 

[satans.barber]

Well that's a happy ending at least then

For the record, if someone had approached me as an instructor with the same problem, I would have put the man responsible on a formal warning, and thrown him out of the club on any subsequent infraction.

It's certainly not the place of the student to sort out such problems, I don't think - what would be to stop him just doing it to someone else?

Glad it's sorted,

Ian.

 

[jfarnsworth]

Originally posted by rachel
Everything is cool with this person now. I was working with him the other day and there was no problem this time. Also he just got hurt in class so I don't know when he'll be back. He twisted his knee. I believe my instructor wants me to take the initiative because we both believe it 's accidental and because I'm very quiet in class. He wants me to be more vocal. I need to speak up. He's a very good teacher. He's not unfeeling or anything. I don't want everyone thinking he's a bad person because he's far from it.

Glad to hear all is well. :asian: