How many chain punches can you throw in one second?

[mook jong man]

Video it and post it here through Youtube or Google Video so we can see exactly what you mean in terms of form and timing.

Sorry man but i don't have a video camera, besides in Wing Chun circles four or five punches a second is not considered fast.

My own master Jim Fung could do about ten a second. There is probably a lot of examples of very fast chain punchers on you tube.
I was in no way boasting but because i don't train at a school any more i was trying to find where i'm at in my trainning compared to other Wing Chun practitioners.

 

[KamonGuy2]

All I would say is that there are people who can punch very quickly with no power

The world record holder has no power in his hits

But that is the downfall of trying to hit someone as fast as you can - you forget about the power

As the more sensible people have already stated on thsi thread - I would rather be able to knock a guy out with one or two punches than be able to hit them two hundred times in a few seconds and not cause any damage

What is the point of this thread?

Should I start a new one - 'how fast can you kick?' Or 'how many people have you knocked out?' It as though you are asking people to show that they are amazing or something?

 

[brocklee]

All I would say is that there are people who can punch very quickly with no power

The world record holder has no power in his hits

But that is the downfall of trying to hit someone as fast as you can - you forget about the power

As the more sensible people have already stated on thsi thread - I would rather be able to knock a guy out with one or two punches than be able to hit them two hundred times in a few seconds and not cause any damage

What is the point of this thread?

Should I start a new one - 'how fast can you kick?' Or 'how many people have you knocked out?' It as though you are asking people to show that they are amazing or something?

Well, my point was more along the line of "in a real fight, you don't need that many punches in that short of a time". I do think that if you can throw 10 true WC punches in a second, they should have the same amount of power as if you threw just 3 or 4 because the power doesn't come from strength...it comes from form, structure and joint torquing

 

[matsu]

I do think that if you can throw 10 true WC punches in a second, they should have the same amount of power as if you threw just 3 or 4 because the power doesn't come from strength...it comes from form, structure and joint torquing[/quote]

good point...

i think this is a training thread not a "i can" one.:angel:

matsu

 

[nitflegal]

Quick check yesterday had 3 strikes in the second (jab, reverse, hook). The impact was good and solid on the rope wrapped pillar and nothing broke in my hand, which is a plus. That was Bujinkan method though, so might not compare well to WC.

Matt

 

[brocklee]

Quick check yesterday had 3 strikes in the second (jab, reverse, hook). The impact was good and solid on the rope wrapped pillar and nothing broke in my hand, which is a plus. That was Bujinkan method though, so might not compare well to WC.

Matt

Whats a jab? lol

 

[5masterserrada]

I just saw the thread regarding punches per second. It does mean something because quick and repetative attacking practice can translate easily into eye jabs or quick blinding moves or neck attacks with a knife or other opportunistic weapon (pen, small flashlight, etc.). It also can help train a person to try to get in several punches rather than one. A hand moving at 10 or more punches per second is very hard to stop...period. As far as chain punching to an opponent...if someone can get the drop on you and pummel you in an upward fashion a person can be uprooted by the punches and find it hard to regain balance. Allowing someone to hopefully take advantage of an unbalanced opponent. As far as the one hit quitter punch...I agree with this too. What I am trying to say is that if a person really pays attention, mutiple punches have a much better chance of felling an opponent. Even the MMA are noticing that multiple punches have a better chance of dropping someone. Any good trainer wants every punch to count, but, train their fighters to get in more than one punch. Multiple punches are just harder to deal with. As far as the Ark Wong statement, it is true, for immortals, the rest of us aspire to high standards,or just surviving a fight. Most people do not fall within three punches. It is a good thing that there are not many people walking around who can stop someone with one punch almost every time. It gives guys like me a chance! Well...this is how I feel about punching. Master Ron Saturno

 

[mograph]

When counting, it helps to think musically. If you count seconds as "steamboats" (one-steam-boat, two-steam-boat), kind of like a waltz, but with a punch on each syllable, that would be three per second. Along those lines, if you were to count three seconds as "inaboutasecond, inaboutasecond, inaboutasecond" (or whatever phrase you can jam in), you'd have six punches per second if you punched on each syllable.

Heck, even I can do that. Weakly. Not for long. With bad form. So speed ain't everything ...

 

[yak sao]

I kinda like/live by something Ark Y Wong said: If it's not over in three moves, step back and see what you're doing wrong.

Actually, I think he was talking to himself here........"step back and see what you're doing, Wong"

 

[yak sao]

We do this in class from time to time....it's just a fun way to see how you're progressing in the speed/relaxation thing.

We use the second hand and count how many times we can punch in 5 or 10 seconds.

 

[cwk]

I don't really train chain punches that much, at least not more than 3-4 at a time but I can see what people are talking about in terms of building stamina for continuous technique.
In sparring, If I use them at all, it's usually 3-4 punches after I've bridged and controlled enough to have a clear line of attack or if they start back pedaling . This is just to give them something to think about and upset their balance while I try to work in some leg techniques or change the angle to control further and to put myself in a position where I can drop some heavier shots.
Anyway, to answer the original question, I just had a go and can do about 5 without neglecting power and about 7 tappy tappy crap punches with poor form.
For the way I personally express the art, 5 is more than enough for me.

 

[matsu]

Actually, I think he was talking to himself here........"step back and see what you're doing, Wong"

i just checked back into this post and saw this,i actually laughed out so loud, two people came to see what was so funny!!

i seem to have dropped this from training so i,m glad i did check back in...... another thing to go back on the list.

matsu

 

[BloodMoney]

Most guys who are trying to chain punch really fast turn their punches into little ***** slaps, ive seen it before, they tighten up the circle and/or get all flicking like with them. If I punch like that I dont know how many I could do in a second, would be a few.

At the "normal" fast speed I punch at I can do 3 maybe 4 punches in a second but they are all solid and I make sure I am sending my energy into the pad (it makes the supports of my hall shake when you do it properly). So yeah 3 good hard chain punches in one sec. I practice that little "3 round burst" often and quite like it, its a good little flurry. You can make it four without punching any faster by adding a jab with the lead hand before the 3 punch flurry too...

 

[KamonGuy2]

A few guys have said it already, but be careful not to train speed over good technique or positioning. Ive trained with a lot of guys who could hit fast, but they were little taps and they couldnt assert any kind of force into them

Pad training is okay, but Bobs are better, and human beings even better than that.

Wall bags are flat against a wall so there is a lot of resistance suporting it. This means that your punches often sound harder than they are. A human being often doesnt give that support in a fight (ie they move). Its like stamping your foot on the floor (and making a noise) and then doing the same thing but on maybe a trampoline

 

[Si-Je]

Sorry man but i don't have a video camera, besides in Wing Chun circles four or five punches a second is not considered fast.

My own master Jim Fung could do about ten a second. There is probably a lot of examples of very fast chain punchers on you tube.
I was in no way boasting but because i don't train at a school any more i was trying to find where i'm at in my trainning compared to other Wing Chun practitioners.

Your getting faster Mook! Master Fung was scary fast!

The speed of your punch will increase the power of your punch. Mass x Speed = power
And yes, make sure to go back to your chest. More power and helps to keep you from getting latched.

 

[snyderkv]

Your getting faster Mook! Master Fung was scary fast!

The speed of your punch will increase the power of your punch. Mass x Speed = power
And yes, make sure to go back to your chest. More power and helps to keep you from getting latched.

Mass x Speed = Power

I thought about this and I think it's incorrectly assumes that speed is a major contributor to the equation. I think Mass is.

Take a tiny amount of mass away and increase speed a lot. You may have lost power
Now add a lot of mass and take a little speed away and you just gained lots of power

I'm using the facts from the 5.56 vs the larger 7x rounds from an AK47. Much more powerfull at 25%? less speed but more than 25% mass.

Anyways

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

How many chain punches can you guys do in one second. I'm talking ones that go all the way back to your chest and out again.
Try and be honest, im estimating with out proper equipment that i can almost do five in one second. How about you gentlemen and ladies.

I cant seem to get past one...
they always fall down when the first one hits them..
oh well i lose

 

[yak sao]

I'm no physicist....hell, I'm not even sure if I'm spelling it right, but from what I recall the actual equation is force = mass X acceleration....

 

[mook jong man]

Mass x Speed = Power

I thought about this and I think it's incorrectly assumes that speed is a major contributor to the equation. I think Mass is.

Take a tiny amount of mass away and increase speed a lot. You may have lost power
Now add a lot of mass and take a little speed away and you just gained lots of power

I'm using the facts from the 5.56 vs the larger 7x rounds from an AK47. Much more powerfull at 25%? less speed but more than 25% mass.

Anyways

As far as Wing Chun is concerned , assuming our stance is developed , speed is the main contributor to the equation .

If your stance is ok and you have learned the correct way to coordinate your punch with stepping , then a very large percentage of your body mass will be behind the strike.

Unlike an automatic weapon where you can change the ammunition , we can't suddenly start decreasing or increasing our mass.

Not without spending a fair bit of time dining at the " Golden Arches Restaurant " or putting in some quality time at the pub that is.

You can increase your muscle mass by heavy weight training , but in Wing Chun that can be counter productive.

So that leaves us with increasing our speed , this is done by increasing our level of relaxation through practice of the Sil Lum Tao form , Chi Sau and punching drills etc.

 

[mook jong man]

I'm no physicist....hell, I'm not even sure if I'm spelling it right, but from what I recall the actual equation is force = mass X acceleration....

Yep , thats right.

And the formula for increasing mass is -

mass = big macs X pizza X beer X chips X k.f.c X more beer X ice cream = big fat bastard