Die with Honour or Live in Shame...

[Kacey]

I ask again what do you think should I be ashamed?

No. You acted with maturity and forbearance - the Fijian you described was obviously looking for a fight, which you avoided; he is the one who should feel ashamed, as his actions were those of a schoolyard bully, while yours were those of a mature adult.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Clearly you acted well and in the right manner. You might want to think about where you go out now that you are no longer single and a new parent.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com

 

[Rich Parsons]

Honour is a term that people use not understanding the depth of its meaning, its not a matter of acting the vigilante, Shame is also a misrepresented concept....should I have been ashamed that I did not raise my fists but left the monkeys to act like monkeys.

Savage,

My thoughts on this should not matter. It is what you think that should matter.

And from your comment about Monkeys being Monkeys, I agree from my point of view. Not that you needed any such comment from me.

 

[Jenna]

Iwill share with you an experience I had a few weeks ago...and you tell me whether I had honour or Shame.

Since the birth of my child, I havent had much time for anything. My training has suffered, but it is a sacrifice I gladly make to see the joy in my childs eyes...I wouldnt miss that for the world, and I have been doing martial arts all of my life....I will go back of that there is no question, but right now I am just enjoying being a father.

So my wifes cosins came in from the land down under and we go out.....I dont drink so I was the driver. Anyway we arivve at the infamous Traps bar....a favourite watering hole of mine from my single days. So I walk in and everyone makes for the pool table...I say allright I am going to get the drinks....the middle bar is full so I move to the front bar to buy the Jugs/Pitcher.

So if you will let me tell you about the layout:

There is a narrow stair going downward...about 4 steps then you gat into the bar there are booths to the left and the bar on the right a little open space and then a locked door. You cant walk side by side between the bar and the booths, its single file.

Any way so I make my way to the corner of the bar...the far corner to order my drinks when one guy (an old friend...now ex friend), comes up to me and says:

David: "What the *ahem* do you think you are doing here"

Savage: "Well G, whats up?"

David: "So what you gonna buy me a jug or what?"

Savage: "Here take this one and I will get another"

Savage (to bar tender): "Pate get me another Jug bro!"

I looked up at this point and there was this guy standing behind David. Eyeballs almost popping out of his head:

Johhny: "you remember me?....You remember me MOTHER Trucker?"

SAVAGE: "Yeah I remember you..whats happening"

I extended my hand

J: "No, **** you...whats up? You wanna **** with me"

S: "David whats up with your boy?"

J: "you called david a b***h, now we gonna **** you up"

S "Yeah I called him a *****, I always called him a *****..whats your problem?"

D "Hey man hes scared (refering to me)"


J: "When I see you in a dark alley I am gonna slit your throat"

At this stage I remember thinking...seriously dude when do you think I am going to be in a dark alley?

Thats when this big fijian guy came up and stood beside me.

S: "Listen I am going to take my beer and leave now"

I turned picked up my jug and made to leave when the big guy stuck his fingers in my jug and dripped beer onto my head. I started to lose my temper...I wanted to fight, I mean there were only six of them....but I checked it, I didnt want to spoil the evening for my wife, she rarely gets a night out.

J: "do it again"

So the big guy did.

S: "are you done"

Then the bouncers walked in...and I took the opportunity to leave. The rest of the evening was uneventful.

Honour is a term that people use not understanding the depth of its meaning, its not a matter of acting the vigilante, Shame is also a misrepresented concept....should I have been ashamed that I did not raise my fists but left the monkeys to act like monkeys.

I ask again what do you think should I be ashamed?

Hey Savage my friend and are you savage by name or by nature I wonder?? Well thank you for sharing your story and to answer your question directly.. do I think you should be ashamed? .. I will say that NO ONE can TRULY make you feel shame except yourself and therefore it should NOT matter to you what any person thinks of the level of virtuousness of your actions.. Only YOU can decide whether your actions are honourable or shameful.. therefore I am happy for you that by your implication your actions were honourable because as far as I am concerned that is the ONLY IMPORTANT thing for you in this situation.. ​

and I will ask you a very simple question my friend in light of the apparent level you are at.. have you ever felt shame before?​

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna​

 

[mantis]

Hello my MT friends of sound body and mind

Well these here are venerable concepts you might read in any of the old or ancient martial treatises but they do not belong to our modern age would you agree? I am speaking specifically about the CHOICE between dying with honour and living with shame

Nowadays there is no such choice to be made.. I mean while we can certainly die with honour.. I am thinking of those in active service or volunteering to provide aid in countries at war or in famine and disease and to die in these circumstances is honourable and likewise there are myriad +1 ways to live in shame.. however there is no CHOICE to be made between these two whereby we live in such shame it would be better to die with honour or whereby we are forced to live in shame having no vehicle to die with honour… we are able nowadays to bridge and reconcile these notions and this ancient CHOICE is no longer a part of our culture, right?

Anyone have any thoughts on the CHOICE between the two and the reality of its existence or not? Thank you

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna

we've a saying
a coward dies a 1000 times a day, but a brave only dies once

die in honor

 

[Jenna]

we've a saying
a coward dies a 1000 times a day, but a brave only dies once

die in honor

Hey mister mantis Jr can you explain this wisdom for me please in the context of this question?

And since you are a forthright speaker my friend can I ask you simply as in my initial question since I am not being answered directly.. can I ask plainly.. is it better to die with honour or live in shame ?

Thank you

Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna