Deflecting Hammer

[Kempojujutsu]

You've got to love that block, except if your are on the receiving end of it. That was the first time I got to see that clip. several guys I work with told me about it.
Bob:asian:

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I got a video of this technique tonite courtesy of one of my friends who is a local Kenpo instructor. I'm in the process of doing a quick and dirty edit to it and will post it shortly tonite.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

ok, heres the clip... My thanks to Sensei Bob Koch at Robert Kochs International Black Belt Academy for his help in making this..and to Colin the wonder Uki for being the 'attacker'.

Its a quick and dirty edit, and I didn't get a clean export to my system so its a tad fuzzy in spots.

Did the technique from 2 angles and slowed both down to 30% speed..also last segment is a more complete version with extensions. Was asked to mention the family groupings that relate to this.

Enjoy.

Deflecting Hammer Clip (5MB MPEG)

 

[kenmpoka]

Thank you bob for the clip. Although, I don't think the tek was executed real good. Too much telegraphing in the upper body in the beginning, and also the foot work should be a push-drag and not a step pull.

:asian:

 

[eternalwhitebelt]

Here goes all of the posts of what was wrong with it. Everyone look out! Let the Kenpo killing begin. I think it takes guts to put yourself on film for everyone to critique your every move over and over. Although I do not agree with how he did the tech., I will commend whoever this is for sharing the art and helping to pass it on.

 

[Rainman]

Although I do not agree with how he did the tech., I will commend whoever this is for sharing the art and helping to pass it on.

Ditto

 

[Rob_Broad]

Anyone else have a clip of this technique? It would be interesting to see the differences and similarities of the various versions.

 

[kenpo3631]

The great thing about this technique is by moving off line from the attack you are negating his attack.

Moving off line? To where?

If I am understanding you correctly, are you stepping off on an angle as you block? Which brings me to another point, this technique is not done with the outside downward block, it's not a block- but a closed hand parry.

I'll explain myself more later, but are you describing stepping to an angle Rob?

 

[Rob_Broad]

Originally posted by kenpo3631



Moving off line? To where?

If I am understanding you correctly, are you stepping off on an angle as you block? Which brings me to another point, this technique is not done with the outside downward block, it's not a block- but a closed hand parry.

I'll explain myself more later, but are you describing stepping to an angle Rob?

Stepping offline of the attack is the same as stepping to away to angle. Just a different way of saying the same thing.

 

[fanged_seamus]

Originally posted by kenpo3631

Moving off line? To where?

If I am understanding you correctly, are you stepping off on an angle as you block? Which brings me to another point, this technique is not done with the outside downward block, it's not a block- but a closed hand parry.

You are moving towards 7:30 (facing 1:30) if the attack is coming from 12:00 (think of a clock). You then strike with an outward, downward block/strike, not a parry. A parry redirects with minimal force, and misses by inches. Here, you are STRIKING the lower leg with force, drawing it past you at an angle. If the technique were done with a parry, I don't know that you'd upset your attacker's balance sufficiently.

That's my interpretation, anyway. I could be wrong.

Tad Finnegan

 

[Roland]

.. 'Deflecting' Hammer, right?
I have never heard the term Closed Hand parry before, but it does makes lots o' sense! I like it!

 

[Bob Hubbard]

The qualitys pretty cruddy on this clip...I had some PC problems... I'm going to try to re-export it next week and see if I cant get a clearer version up. It was a spur of the moment thing when I was at the school. Bob Kochs a cool guy...my GF's a student of his and is testing for black I think next month.

One of the things I see in Kenpo is the variations on each technique. Tweak this, swap out this for that and you have another tech, etc.

I'm hoping to get some more clips of the other techniques we're discussing and put em all up.

:asian:

 

[kenpo3631]

Originally posted by Roland

.. 'Deflecting' Hammer, right?
I have never heard the term Closed Hand parry before, but it does makes lots o' sense! I like it!

Well in this technique you step back to 6 o'clock. The "General" rule is when blocking step to an angle, when parrying stay on the line. In addition, if you apply this rule to this technique, you will see that if you indeed step to say 7:30 and use an outside downward block, you put your opponent out of the "close" range. This means you need to add steps to get closer to your opponent, heck, he might be at kicking or "long" range.:asian:

 

[Roland]

That is pretty much how I was thinking, why add steps when you don't need em eh?
If you did off angle, the elbow would be prety much useless then I guess. Time to go in for a kick and then.......................(insert whatever technique you like best here)

 

[Mace]

Big surprise there, right. When you step to 7:30, your downward block will ride the kick past your thigh, basically keeping your opponent on the 12-6 or 11:30-5:30 line. As soon as your left foot hits fire a left palm heel to the shoulder that grabs and pull for the right elbow. The push drag is if you need it, but with a commited attacker I usually don't.
On a side note, I really don't think that you should be teaching a yellow belt to step straight back with an incoming front kick. Liability and cracked ribs and all. Just offangle and deflect.
Respectfully,
Mace

 

[Klondike93]

Here's how it was explained to me :

I thought you were suppose to step back to 7:30 deflect the kick and slide in with the inward elbow.

My instructor corrected me to step to 6:00 with the downward block just enough to "stretch" the kick out then push-drag in with the inward elbow. It was pointed out that when I stepped to 7:30 I was now doing the inward elbow on the 7:30-1:30 line instead of straight in on the 12:00-6:00 line. It made sense that their weight is moving on that line, so to get borrowed force you have to be on that line as well.


:asian:

 

[Roland]

Captured Twigs is left foot, but sideways, because he is behind you, you can't go through him, right!
Grasp of Death is forward, becase he is pulling you ( so to speak)

I think Deflecting Hammer does work better going to 6, but it also fits in with KISS. Teaching the Yellow belts the same move, repeatiton, someone attacks, get out of the way! use same foot, no matter what, cause it is easier to remember as a beginer.

Personally, I like thrusting Salute and others better, because of the off angles, but I see why this one is the way it is.
Tired right now, so heres hoping someone can explain better!



Hey Mace, no problems with disagreeing man, it is all good right?

 

[Mace]

You are definitely right, its all good. That's what makes these forums fun, there's discussion. Would be kind of boring if we all did it the exact same way.

My only problem with stepping to 6 is that you are not teaching a beginner to get out of the range of the attack. Stepping straight back is fine with a shorter weapon, but with such a long range weapon I like the offangle in case the block isn't effective.
Mace

 

[WilliamTLear]

From what I've been taught... You're supposed to step off of the line of attack by stepping toward 7:30. The best way to avoid being hit... is not to be there.

 

[Kenpo Yahoo]

My instructor corrected me to step to 6:00 with the downward block just enough to "stretch" the kick out then push-drag in with the inward elbow. It was pointed out that when I stepped to 7:30 I was now doing the inward elbow on the 7:30-1:30 line instead of straight in on the 12:00-6:00 line. It made sense that their weight is moving on that line, so to get borrowed force you have to be on that line as well.

Unless you are striking perpendicular to your opponents path of action, you will have some component of their force moving in your direction. For instance most of the replies have said to step to 7:30 because it will take you off the line of attack (at least for a front kick).

Quick mechanics lesson: Use the standard clock as a reference. You are standing in the center of the clock. Your attacker throws a kick that will travel from the 12:00 mark to the 6:00 mark. For arguments sake, you step to 7:30. By doing so you've changed your angle by 45 degrees (every 30 minutes=15 degrees). Let's work with some numbers to make this a little easier to understand. Let's say that your opponent kicks at you with a force of 100 (we'll stay unitless for simplicity). This means that you will only encounter the amount of force directed 45 degrees off of his line of attack or 100 cosine (45), which equals about 70. So that means that your 100 will meet his 70 at the point of impact making an impact of 170. If 200 was the maximum amount you could collide with or 100% of the possible collision then 170 is equal to 85% of the maximum possible force achieved from the collision.

This means that even if you were to deviate to 7:30 and maintain your 7:30 to 1:30 line of attack, you would still hit with 85% of the total possible force. However, if you were to adopt a slightly different path of attack, for instance 1:00, you would increase your percentage from 85% to 93.3 %. Couple this with the fact that you've decreased your attackers ability to smack ya', and you've got a pretty sweet trade-off. A lot of safety for a little bit of power. Pretty good deal if you ask me.

This also doesn't take into account the fact that you driving a weapon through a curvilinear path of action (i.e. you will use your hips to create torque for the elbow strike), creating even more force. Or even the fact that the attacker is so over-committed with their kick that your block causes them to fall into you with the back of their head (I've seen, and had this happen to and for me).

Hopefully this makes sense. I really do love this technique, it's simple yet effective.