Delayed Sword

[Klondike93]

Originally posted by Kirk

K, to break things down further, and get really anal, let me ask
this. You step back to a neutral bow, while simultaneously
executing a right inward block. The power principle associated
with this minute part, as I "know" it to be, is that you step back,
and while twisting with the hips into a true neutral bow, you
execute the block. Anyone do it this way? I have trouble getting
into it all, proper, before the hit/grab comes.

I believe it's called Torque. Your using torque from your hips to break the hold.

Heres a question....where/how does 'marrage of gravity' apply?

I've always thought it was on the outward hand sword. As your foot lands from the kick your hitting with the outward hand sword.

:asian:

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by Rainman



Breath in -breath out- gravitational marriage is at work.

:asian:

Correct Sir. Every move you make every breath you take (is that a song?) Anyway Gravitational Marraige would best be thought of in degrees of assistance for the application at hand.

The human body and its Structural Integrity is predicated on the Resistance of Gravity in all actions.

 

[brianhunter]

does this have anything to do with how you incorporated breathing timing into techniques?????

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by brianhunter

does this have anything to do with how you incorporated breathing timing into techniques?????

Once again yes Sir. Good obs. Without proper breathing "settling" (rooting) is not even possible. Improper breathing creates bouyancy.

"Ummmm. The force is strong with this one."

 

[JD_Nelson]

I believe the right front ball kick should cause the attacker to bend forward at the waist.

When executing the outward handsword, the movement here should combine all three planes. Hoizontal, depth, and Vertical. If the handsword moves downward during this strike I believe this would be another example of marriage of gravity.

Kind Regards

Jeremy Nelson
Yellow AKKI

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by JD_Nelson

I believe the right front ball kick should cause the attacker to bend forward at the waist.

When executing the outward handsword, the movement here should combine all three planes. Hoizontal, depth, and Vertical. If the handsword moves downward during this strike I believe this would be another example of marriage of gravity.

Kind Regards

Jeremy Nelson
Yellow AKKI

In the manner of AK, I'm afraid you are incorrect on all counts.

 

[JD_Nelson]

Am i wrong by definition? or have I completely missed it all together?


Thank you,

Jeremy

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by JD_Nelson

Am i wrong by definition? or have I completely missed it all together?


Thank you,

Jeremy

Well Sir,

"I believe the right front ball kick should cause the attacker to bend forward at the waist."

The initial reaction to most stikes is well defined in human anatomy by method and manner of execution and specific targets. A front "ball kick" I presume in your method of executing the technique attacks the testicles. The reaction initially will be more of a "squatting action" dropping the buttocks with the back straight and chin up.

"When executing the outward handsword, the movement here should combine all three
planes. Hoizontal, depth, and Vertical."

Depth is not a "plane" and this action should not be described in terms of planes butinstead explain not only the execution but it's intended interaction with its target as well as possible effect.

"If the handsword moves downward during this strike I believe this would be another example of marriage of gravity."

Although technically, in Newtonian Physics, any action moving downward is affected by the "pull" of gravity, however in AK the terminology is reserved for a more specific application. ie. placing your foot down at the momemt of contact, allowing your strike to be enhanced by the "pull" of gravity on your entire body weight. The reality is not so much of an enhancement as an efficient application Sir.

 

[JD_Nelson]

.....you can still learn what not to do


Thanks Doc,

I did have some of the thoughts you described as well. Especially concerning planting the foot with the outward handsword. (At least i think this is what was meant) By AK definition I was wrong with the pull of gravity enhancing the strike. This definition clarifiation will help later on Even if I am not ever Wrong Again!!!

I now feel i have not had enough contact to determine the attackers true reaction concerning the front ball kick. thanks for the insight there as well.

I have much to learn!!!

Jeremy Nelson
Yellow AKKI

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by JD_Nelson

.....you can still learn what not to do


Thanks Doc,

I did have some of the thoughts you described as well. Especially concerning planting the foot with the outward handsword. (At least i think this is what was meant) By AK definition I was wrong with the pull of gravity enhancing the strike. This definition clarifiation will help later on Even if I am not ever Wrong Again!!!

I now feel i have not had enough contact to determine the attackers true reaction concerning the front ball kick. thanks for the insight there as well.

I have much to learn!!!

Jeremy Nelson
Yellow AKKI

We all are mere students Sir, and have much to learn. Some are just a little further down the road than others. Thank you for being receptive to my perspectives.

 

[JD_Nelson]

Maybe we should have some more incorrect assumptions here in teh technical forums, Seems that noone wants to discuss anything if they might me off a bit.

Best Regards,

Jeremy Nelson

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by JD_Nelson

Maybe we should have some more incorrect assumptions here in teh technical forums, Seems that noone wants to discuss anything if they might me off a bit.

Best Regards,

Jeremy Nelson

Me & you? Funny I thought that was what the "technical" section was for. Don't worry, there is at least a couple of numbskulls who'll pop up.

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by FLY



As far as letting the experienced folks take a few whacks at it, I'll pass...
But to answer your question Kaith...yes it is taught in Tracy's Kenpo as well.
In Tracy's Kenpo it is taught as a defense against a right punch.

1. Left foot steps back to 6:00, Right foot simutaneously draws back to cat and you execute a right inward block to inside of right punch.

2. Right foot snap kick to the opponent's groin

3. Right foot plants down between the opponent's legs as you deliver a right chop to the right side of the opponent's neck/throat.

Oh ya....your left hand covers during the whole process

FLY

:asian:

For the record: Ed Parker taught Delayed Sword both ways, initially as a punch, then later as the WOK solidified, as a lapel grab. Different schools still do it the way they were taught, althought the "punch version" seems to be the most popular because it's the easiest, I think, to teach. Neither way is wrong, but eventually if you are to address the suggestions of the WOK, the lapel grab must be addressed.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I think delayed sword illistrates The entire art. To teach it as a defense against a missle attack is a natural extension of the grab defense. We create distance stabilize our base. While attempting to remain neutral our arm goes long recoils and grows long again. From neutrality we would choose to strike with which ever weopon the situation required. While kicking with the lead leg is the closest weopon the groin is not the closest target. We at this point would choose to effect our opponents posture or his balance. If we choose balance the kick to the groin we then be a sweep to the ankle or a stomp to the inside of the knee. It doesnt matter because the timing and basic motion will remain the same. The techniques are all, in fact, star block in a required situational order. If this is true then our basic jab,jab, cross is really one of the only ideas we really need and remembering a list of techniques not only becomes unusefull but hinders you as a martial artist. Any attack becomes a method by wich I may employ delayed sword; because, its all delayed sword.

 

[Marcus Buonfiglio]

"I drop to a cat stance from a natural and ""kick em in the Jimmy from the get go, ""


I haven't heard that expression in quite sometime. Clyde you crack me up:rofl: :rofl:

 

[Brenwulv]

Originally posted by Doc


The initial reaction to most stikes is well defined in human anatomy by method and manner of execution and specific targets. A front "ball kick" I presume in your method of executing the technique attacks the testicles. The reaction initially will be more of a "squatting action" dropping the buttocks with the back straight and chin up.

While I'm by no means the most knowledgeable around, I'm not sure how you figure this one, Sir.

If the kick were a scoop kick and came up more vertically from underneath the groin, then yes, I see the dropping of the hips, and "squatting" as you said.

A front kick however is just that, a kick from the front, impacting on a horizontal plane. This will cause the person to bend over at the waist, if nothing else but to move their groin away from the pain.

As for the term 'ball kick', that's just using the ball of the foot in the strike, not the whole sole. Ball kick doesn't equal testicle kick.

Respectfully,
Never

 

[Sigung86]

Originally posted by Brenwulv
While I'm by no means the most knowledgeable around, I'm not sure how you figure this one, Sir.

If the kick were a scoop kick and came up more vertically from underneath the groin, then yes, I see the dropping of the hips, and "squatting" as you said.

A front kick however is just that, a kick from the front, impacting on a horizontal plane. This will cause the person to bend over at the waist, if nothing else but to move their groin away from the pain.

As for the term 'ball kick', that's just using the ball of the foot in the strike, not the whole sole. Ball kick doesn't equal testicle kick.

Respectfully,
Never

Had a very cool response here... But read Doc's reply... As usual... It is concise and correct. I don't need to get in depth ... So, I won't other than to reiterate the Good Doc's post and say, in a not too respectful manner ... You are incorrect.


Respectfully?
Oh sure, why not...

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by Brenwulv

A front kick however is just that, a kick from the front, impacting on a horizontal plane. This will cause the person to bend over at the waist, if nothing else but to move their groin away from the pain.

Moving the hips backwards does not equal "bendng over at the waist." Nor does it account for any significant strike to the lower body causing the feet to move rearward. The fallacy of being struck and suddenly "bending forward" is completely false.

As for the term 'ball kick', that's just using the ball of the foot in the strike, not the whole sole. Ball kick doesn't equal testicle kick.

I think I may be vaguely familiar with what is an incorrect and confusing use of the terminology. I was attempting to understand what "you" meant by the term. In our cuurriculum the ambiguous term "ball kick" doesn't exist.

 

[Brenwulv]

Originally posted by Sigung86
Had a very cool response here... But read Doc's reply... As usual... It is concise and correct. I don't need to get in depth ... So, I won't other than to reiterate the Good Doc's post and say, in a not too respectful manner ... You are incorrect.


Respectfully?
Oh sure, why not...

Why not tell me in your words why I'm wrong? Perhaps you can explain it in a way that will make me see it better.

And Never is a nickname of mine, but I can see how my sig might be misinterpreted, so I apologise.

Respectfully,
Joel

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by Brenwulv
Why not tell me in your words why I'm wrong? Perhaps you can explain it in a way that will make me see it better.

And Never is a nickname of mine, but I can see how my sig might be misinterpreted, so I apologise.

Respectfully,
Joel

No problem I figured it was your nickname.

You are not "wrong" and I don't see it that way, it is simply finding common ground for communication in this medium.

Anyway the term we use is a "front kick," to describe the action, then "with the ball of the foot," to describe the weapon. This is a more descriptive and appropriate use of the terminology. After all a front kick can utilize more than one weapon. Admittedly "ball kick" is slang and could be misconstrued as the action, target, or both. To avoid confusion I try to avoid slang in academic discussions without some clarifications.