Defense from inside your car

[terryl965]

Empty Hands,

I teach Concealed Handgun License classes in the state of Texas. I know well our laws. Carjacking, and someone grabbing you through the window would be considered an attempted carjacking, is subject to deadly force.

9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON

(A) unlawfully and with force entered, or was
attempting to enter unlawfully and with force, the actor's occupied
habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment.

And you do NOT have to retreat (unlike some states laws.)

Deaf

I am with Deaf here Texas has great laws when it comes to certain things

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I think people are overcomplicating this (too many "use a wrist lock" or whatever)...you're in a 3,000 lb. weapon, just drive, he won't hold on for long.

If for some reason I was unable to simply drive away, I'd try to control his arm while reaching either for the fixed blade on the console, or the pistol on my hip...he's not going to like what happens after that. (before anyone says anything, in my state, the "castle doctrine" extends to your vehicle.)

Bingo. Use the vehicle as a tool if necessary.

However, be aware of the area before hand and who is in it so that it will be very hard for someone to approach. Myself, personally I would only slightly crack the window and that would be after the car was already turned on and prepared for escape. I would also have a tool or two inside the car and ready to use if necessary.

 

[shesulsa]

I think people are overcomplicating this (too many "use a wrist lock" or whatever)...you're in a 3,000 lb. weapon, just drive, he won't hold on for long.

artyon:

If for some reason I was unable to simply drive away, I'd try to control his arm while reaching either for the fixed blade on the console, or the pistol on my hip...he's not going to like what happens after that. (before anyone says anything, in my state, the "castle doctrine" extends to your vehicle.)

I keep ... ah ... *something* right next to me and ready to draw for just such an occasion.

in that case, maybe grab his arm and yank it farther into the car to control it, also giving you access to his head/face. Beat him with hammerfists, gouge his eyes, or attack the throat until he decides he doesn't want to play anymore.

On a side note, this is why I always try to park so that I can move my car easily. I'll either pull through the spaces or back in so that when I leave I can just drive out.

Awareness, education and evasive action - three of the four cornerstones to self-defense. I include pre-planning in the "evasive action" category. Good Girl and Boy scouts will know that you should ALWAYS park ***-in.

Bingo. Use the vehicle as a tool if necessary.

However, be aware of the area before hand and who is in it so that it will be very hard for someone to approach. Myself, personally I would only slightly crack the window and that would be after the car was already turned on and prepared for escape. I would also have a tool or two inside the car and ready to use if necessary.

Exactly. I keep the AC in my car in good repair and fully charged to thwart the opportunists who like to jump cars. The driver's window fully open doesn't happen without careful monitoring on my part.

 

[CoryKS]

Well being as hard of hearing as I am an inch of open window is still going to make the guy sound muffled so that's why I rolled it half way down so there'd be no misunderstanding on MY part. Plus I'm still under the impression that I didn't do anything wrong... at least until he opened his mouth and expressed his erroneous perceived deficit. Besides looking the guy once over, I wasn't scared and he couldn't make me scared even if he tried.

I'm pretty hard of hearing too. My point was that I really don't care what the guy is telling me. Never seen him before and I'm on my way somewhere, so the odds are slim that this conversation is relevant to my interests. I might give him some small opportunity to say what he wants to say, but he needs to say it fast and say it loud if he wants me to hear it.

 

[Hawke]

Think "goof" plus one. He may or may not have a goof buddy or two or three.

1. Drive away if situation allows.
2. If his hands are already inside your vehicle break a finger.

If I have to I will put the car in drive and pull away to get out of the dangerous situation and not obey traffic laws to protect myself and a loved one.

Some places in Los Angeles you will get a ticket if you park your car rear end first (usually shopping malls).

When I volunteered with the Red Cross we were trained to point our vehicles for a quick retreat when fighting forest fires.

YouTube has a clip called "Why we need a gun." Due to the heavy use of profanity I am hesitate to put a link here.

 

[tellner]

there's a bunch of videos on youtube that could be the one you're talking about. You don't have to embed the clip, but it would be helpful if you could post a link.

 

[Hawke]

Send me a PM and I'll send you the link.

The clip is a crazy guy that picks up an impact weapon and starts smashing a car stuck in traffic. The car just drives back and forth while the guy keeps smashing the window, headlights, the side and back of the car.

 

[KenpoTex]

Send me a PM and I'll send you the link.

The clip is a crazy guy that picks up an impact weapon and starts smashing a car stuck in traffic. The car just drives back and forth while the guy keeps smashing the window, headlights, the side and back of the car.

if you're talking about the black guy beating the car with a tire-iron (what it looked like to me) on the street corner in Vegas, he needed to either be shot or run-over.

 

[Mr G]

One of my early memories is when I was riding with my Aunt when we were boxed in by traffic, waiting for a light or something. Some guy walked up, opened my door, and leaned in to grab my Aunt's purse. I leaned over and covered he purse with my body (I don't know why, I was a little kid). She leaned on the horn yelled at him and started driving up on the curb. He backed off and the traffic started moving so we got 'otta there.

I have no idea what year this was, but she was driving an orange Vega.

 

[hongkongfooey]

I am with Deaf here Texas has great laws when it comes to certain things

That's because Texas isn't overrun with liberal pansy men, who believe that self defense is uncivilized, like we have here in the People's Republik of Maryland. In the PRM, the victim goes to jail, and the aggressor gets counseling and a free lawyer to file suit against the real victim.

 

[hongkongfooey]

Use the Trunk Monkey. I love these commercials.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/31859/trunk_monkey/

 

[Big Don]

My first inclination would be to steer the car into the attacker. Aside from that, and not carrying a gun, I'd have to, as others noted, pin/trap the hand/arm and poke, gouge, etc his eyes while hoping he'll expose his throat enough to make a spearhand strike or ½ fist punch fit.
I dunno, I hadn't really thought about it.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Scenario... you walk through the parking lot to your car, unlock the door, get in, start up the engine and before you can put it in reverse/drive someone is knocking on your window. You roll the window down half way to hear what they have to say... moments later (reasons are moot at this point) the guy reaches in the open window and grabs your shirt/collar....

What to do? How to take care of this?

I was in that situation last Sunday... only the guy didn't reach in the car. But he was being belligerent. Words were exchanged and he basically walked off.
I had thought about what I would've needed to do if he had reached in the car to grab me, his body language, tone of voice and fervor in his eyes said he wanted to.

It made me wonder about it and wonder at the various arts and their techniques (if any) in dealing with that scenario.

My thoughts were: to allow him to grab me then break his grip and hold his hand while pulling his arm further into the car and pinning it to the steering wheel... then raise the window (it's electric on mine) and trap his arm up to his shoulder... open the car door hard, pushing him backwards/off balance, get out and close the door... hard... here two things could happen as I tried it out with a friend later (going very slowly and gently)... his arm came out and automatically went up... closing the car door would've crushed his arm/wrist in the door frame thus further incapacitaing him or he would've kept his arm down, even rotating it in an attempt to hit the window button... or even still... risk severely lacerating himself by pulling his arm out and/or breaking the window...
Had his arm been trapped in the door then a few simple techs would've been sufficient to render him out of the game; (hard) knee to the groin and to the solar-plexus.

What would've you done? What techniques does your art (please name) teach in this situation?

Given what you said where the mistakes of not making eye contact so they knew you were not a prey animal, and/or also missing them (* It happens to everyone *), and you are in the situation with the window open and an aggressive person on the outside.

I know others have said similar things, but here is what I would do.

1) I would put the car in gear, and move the vehicle.

2) If the grab was hurting or could cause me damage, I would try to remove that threat and then counter with the vehicle.


I have been in situations where I have seen it coming and got out of the car to address the issue. I have been in situation where before they could approach the vehicle was in gear in moving, even if it was the wrong way on a one way street or expressway entrance or exit.

 

[Deaf Smith]

That's because Texas isn't overrun with liberal pansy men, who believe that self defense is uncivilized, like we have here in the People's Republik of Maryland. In the PRM, the victim goes to jail, and the aggressor gets counseling and a free lawyer to file suit against the real victim.

Ergo... come to Texas (or Floriada for that matter.)

Deaf

 

[tellner]

That's because Texas isn't overrun with liberal pansy men, who believe that self defense is uncivilized, like we have here in the People's Republik of Maryland. In the PRM, the victim goes to jail, and the aggressor gets counseling and a free lawyer to file suit against the real victim.

Oh, I dunno. Oregon is quite a liberal State. And we have better CCW laws than Texas. For some weird reason you guys can't carry in churches. And I seem to recall laws about having to register the particular weapon you want to carry and to pay a fee and requalify with each one. No such ******** out here or in latte-sipping Washington.

The deepest pit of depravity in the State, Portland, is notable for its grand juries. They are some of the most likely to tell the DA to take a hike when he seeks indictments in home or multiple attacker defense cases.

 

[Bodhisattva]

Oh, I dunno. Oregon is quite a liberal State. And we have better CCW laws than Texas. For some weird reason you guys can't carry in churches. And I seem to recall laws about having to register the particular weapon you want to carry and to pay a fee and requalify with each one. No such ******** out here or in latte-sipping Washington.

The deepest pit of depravity in the State, Portland, is notable for its grand juries. They are some of the most likely to tell the DA to take a hike when he seeks indictments in home or multiple attacker defense cases.

Actually, Oregon is extremely CONSERVATIVE, but PORTLAND is very liberal.

 

[tellner]

Not even close.

The I-5 corridor, home of most of the population, is quite liberal. Eastern and parts of Southern Oregon are generally quite conservative. But we're no longer a swing state in national elections. We're firmly in the "blue" category.

 

[shesulsa]

Not even close.

The I-5 corridor, home of most of the population, is quite liberal. Eastern and parts of Southern Oregon are generally quite conservative. But we're no longer a swing state in national elections. We're firmly in the "blue" category.

Props.

 

[MA-Caver]

Given what you said where the mistakes of not making eye contact so they knew you were not a prey animal, and/or also missing them (* It happens to everyone *), and you are in the situation with the window open and an aggressive person on the outside.

I know others have said similar things, but here is what I would do.

1) I would put the car in gear, and move the vehicle.

2) If the grab was hurting or could cause me damage, I would try to remove that threat and then counter with the vehicle.


I have been in situations where I have seen it coming and got out of the car to address the issue. I have been in situation where before they could approach the vehicle was in gear in moving, even if it was the wrong way on a one way street or expressway entrance or exit.

Well Rich, with the fact that I felt that I had nothing to worry about I didn't break eye contact with him... more so held it with the *ahem* accusations that he was making/repeating and thus causing my own blood-pressure to rise and blood to boil ... well essentially ticking me off something fierce. So in that circumstances I don't break eye contact nor drift my sight from his whole body movements. I was ready for him to reach into the car.

I doubt that I would've moved the car at all. After all it is my parents', had it been my jeep... heh, that's different now isn't it? But control, and plotting this or that based on what he does and what he could do.
I was planning to mess him up. Least ways I get charged with assault and not attempted manslaughter. Of course I'd argue self-defense all the way. After all his bodily evidence would've been in the car once he reached in and I did my thing. Forensics would've shown that.

Besides what I told him caused him to back off and walk away. As Stewie is wont to say... Victory is mine!

 

[Brian King]

There is a Systema DVD out (there is also a second older different instructional video that is also very good but no longer in production) that covers many of the situations discussed in this thread as well as some of the psychological issues faced with many tips on how to move around inside and outside of your vehicle. It is a great video for those that spend a lot of time in their vehicles, professionals and those that wonder what if while they are in or around vehicles.
I highly recommend it.

This link on Vladimir’s web site has a short video clip of the DVD

http://www.russianmartialart.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=111

Regards
Brian King