Defending the weak

[funnytiger]

That is exactly how I have always felt. Doing SOMETHING is better than doing nothing. Obviously putting yourself in immediate physical danger when you don't have all the pieces to the puzzle isn't always the wisest choice. However, the "someone else will probably call the police" attitude is disgusting, IMO.

Ya dig...

 

[Shaolinwind]

A lot of discussion goes on about self defense, but very often I have a completely different concern: being on guard not to defend myself, but others that may need it.

Now this can be a slippery slope: you certainly don't want to get involved in situations that are not your business.

And you better REALLY think about getting in the middle of a public domestic dispute, as these are THE most dangerous conflicts to become entangled in (just ask any LEO: one minute they are defending the "victim," the next minute they are defending themselves against the victim while trying to arrest the perp!).

But I'm talking about situations in which you see an elderly person in a public situation with potential predators. When I am out with my grandfolks, my parents, my children, my significant other, I always feel "on guard," marking potential threats, placing myself inbetween them and potential dangers, etc.

Especially with children: dangers can range from them wandering off to abduction attempts to them stepping in front of a mini-van (almost happened to my daughter! Luckily I WAS on point and within reach, and jerked her back by placing my hand on her shoulder...).

With my grandparents it often takes the form of watching for uneven pavement, steps and inclines and such.

But I even keep my eye out for elderly, disabled or just plain weak folk who LOOK like a victim waiting to be victimized.

It is mostly a matter of thinking and observing: carefully defusing a situation is MUCH more effective than puffing your chest out, assuming a fighting stance or scowling up and calling someone out because they are looking at a lady who doesn't want to be stared at.

Are you prepared and aware enough to be a defender of the weak? Can you walk that fine line between being ready and getting involved when and where you shouldn't?

I'm not sure I am, but then I do my best to be prepared mentally and to keep my eyes open.

Thoughts?

I think the desire to protect others is one of humanitys' finest traits.

 

[Hand Sword]

I think, according to studies, in circumstances of seriousness, most will stand there and watch. You could be drowning, fighting, etc.. most get the deer in the headlights syndrome, and wait for someone else to respond.

 

[funnytiger]

Its called, "Kitty Genovese Syndrome". You can read more about it here: http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/kitty_genovese/6.html and the murder of Kitty Genovese which was witnessed by 38 people who did nothing.

Excerpt:

One dynamic brought forth was the Bystander Effect. This theory speculates that as the “number of bystanders increases, the likelihood of any one bystander helping another decreases.”

Sorry, its kind of off-topic...

 

[Bigshadow]

Its called, "Kitty Genovese Syndrome". You can read more about it here: http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/kitty_genovese/6.html and the murder of Kitty Genovese which was witnessed by 38 people who did nothing.

Excerpt:

One dynamic brought forth was the Bystander Effect. This theory speculates that as the “number of bystanders increases, the likelihood of any one bystander helping another decreases.”

Sorry, its kind of off-topic...

I don't think it was off topic. It is related to this topic and it makes sense.

 

[funnytiger]

I don't think it was off topic. It is related to this topic and it makes sense.

Yay!

 

[Drac]

I think, according to studies, in circumstances of seriousness, most will stand there and watch. You could be drowning, fighting, etc.. most get the deer in the headlights syndrome, and wait for someone else to respond.

Too true...Someone always suffers because of someone elses inability to act..

 

[exile]

Too true...Someone always suffers because of someone elses inability to act..

In communities where people know each other, this doesn't happen. Mostly we don't live in real communities or genuine neighborhoods any more but in `residential areas' on a purely temporary basis, and our real loyalties and affections may be invested in people thousands of miles away (who, ironically, we may interact with in person only very rarely). The bitter truth is, many people seem to feel they have no stake in the well-being of most people they come in contact with on a daily basis. Everyone's a stranger, or almost everyone, and people think they have no stake in protecting strangers against other strangers.

 

[thewhitemikevick]

This is very intricate question zDom. Ahh, maybe it's too early in the morning (or late at night, depending on your perspective) for me to think correctly...but this one really is a hard one. The line is so thin. All too thin to distinguish sometimes. To be a defender of the weak is obviously an honorable thing to do, and in doing so you are showing a conscious act of morality as a fellow brother of the human race. However, in stepping in, sometimes the conflict can be engulfed with an entire new level of hostility. Sometimes interference makes things far worse. But sometimes, it can make things better. I really need to think on this one. It's puzzling. Almost paradoxical lol. Sometimes I'm just not sure if you can possibly know whether stepping in is the right thing to do or not.

 

[Drac]

In communities where people know each other, this doesn't happen. Mostly we don't live in real communities or genuine neighborhoods any more but in.

Sad but true..`The kind of neigborhood I grew up in has faded into history..You knoe everybody and they knew YOU..If you messed up as a kid you got disciplined by one of the neighbors AND THEN you got it again when you got home...

 

[Bigshadow]

Sad but true..`The kind of neigborhood I grew up in has faded into history..You knoe everybody and they knew YOU..If you messed up as a kid you got disciplined by one of the neighbors AND THEN you got it again when you got home...

That is so true! I remember it being that way when I was a kid. It certainly is far from that today.

 

[Drac]

That is so true! I remember it being that way when I was a kid. It certainly is far from that today.

You said it... Now we respond to calls because some neighbor YELLED at another neighbor's children...

 

[bydand]

Sad but true..`The kind of neigborhood I grew up in has faded into history..You knoe everybody and they knew YOU..If you messed up as a kid you got disciplined by one of the neighbors AND THEN you got it again when you got home...

That is so true! I remember it being that way when I was a kid. It certainly is far from that today.

Come on over to my little town. Still like it was 30 or more years ago around here. Usually that is a bad thing because it means those involved haven't been open to change or growth, but when it comes to neighborhoods, it is the best thing that could happen. Sure, it is a small dumpy little place, but the value of your neighbors are still held in high regard. It is a place where kids still put a million miles on their bikes every summer, neighbors help each other with yard work, the community sledding hill is at a church, no bars and no desire to open one, house keys; why would you need those?, and my kids can go to the 1 store and get something to eat or drink and tell the owner Mom or Dad will be in later to pay (no names, everybody knows everybody.)

The first time I was ever in this town was right after I moved to Maine in 1987. I was doing a small job in town and went into the store to get something for lunch, only to discover that I had left my wallet at home that morning. The check-out lady didn't even bat an eye, just rang everything up, put my first name on top of the slip and tucked it under the till. Didn't even ask for a last name and had NEVER seen me before. Plus they have one of the best schools around and it was a no-brainer to get a home here.

I count myself and my family lucky every single day. Here it is still common practice to step in and help those who cannot do for themselves.

 

[Drac]

Sounds like MY kind of city..Wonder if their PD accepts lateral transfers???

 

[bydand]

Wow, if they did it would make 3 cops for us. Did I mention we were small. We have the Chief and 1 full time guy, plus a couple of part-timers. We do have 2 cars though now, that way Barney and Andy can each have one. No disrespect intended, I hold them in the highest regard and think they do a great job.

 

[Drac]

Wow, if they did it would make 3 cops for us. Did I mention we were small. We have the Chief and 1 full time guy, plus a couple of part-timers. We do have 2 cars though now, that way Barney and Andy can each have one. No disrespect intended, I hold them in the highest regard and think they do a great job.

LOL..That is small.....

 

[zDom]

Thanks for all the great contributions to this discussion!

 

[Drac]

Thanks for all the great contributions to this discussion!

You are welcome..It was an intelligent thread that was YOUR idea..

 

[jks9199]

You said it... Now we respond to calls because some neighbor YELLED at another neighbor's children...

Thankfully, in my current assignment, I'm spared that crap...

Dealt with plenty of it before, though. Along with the "he parked on the street in front of my house!" or "their tree dropped leaves into my yard!" and "their making too much noise..."

(Has it ever occurred to some of these folks to knock on their neighbors door and ask them to turn it down or move the car or whatever?)

All of this reminded me of a great example of someone not calling (because they didn't want to bother the police!).

A couple years back, just as I came on duty, the shift before me was trying to catch some kids who had been breaking into cars. One citizen had caught them red-handed, and was trying to detain them, but the kids fled before our units got there. A couple of hours later, I got a call for a house on that street, where the complainant wanted to discuss a suspicious event. Seems about 3 hours before (and about 20 minutes before the other squad was chasing the kids), a young mother had been up feeding her baby, and saw some kids going up the street, pulling on car door handles... The more she thought about it, the more she wondered what they might have been doing, so she finally called it in, apologizing for wasting our time with something so silly...

Gee... Think calling that in earlier might have been helpful?

 

[Kacey]

And yet... when this guy pulled up across the street from my house (I live across from a park) with his stereo blasting, and I asked him to turn it down, so I could hear the radio I was listening to while doing yardwork, which led to a confrontation, which he left when he realized that a) I was in the process of calling the police (and giving them his plate number), and b) I wasn't backing down the way he expected, and c) I was holding a shovel... the police showed up shortly thereafter and told me that I should have just called in the first place without talking to the guy. They came back later and told me they'd caught him at a store up the street with drug paraphenalia and an outstanding warrant, and had arrested him and impounded the car.

Where is the line? When do you take direct action and when do you call? Yes, I know this depends on the circumstances, the person, etc. - but how do you decide?