Corrupted Poomsae

[puunui]

Actually it would be in Muju and I'm sure with such a big attraction they will accommodate for the night life. They are already set up as a tourist place for most part as Muju is a big ski area for Korea, Japan and China. So having the Taekwondowon there would give them tourism during the off-season for skiing. BTW...There is nightlife in Jeonju after 8pm...you just have to know where to go.

It is a big attraction in terms of size, but how many people will really visit it on a regular basis? The Kukkiwon is in Seoul, and for the most part there are very few tourists there at any one time. I always visit the Kukkiwon (there and kyobo) when in Korea, but Muju, I don't know if I would go everytime.

 

[d1jinx]

I think it was a combination of a lot of different factors which led to the way it is done in the US. For one thing, many of the early taekwondo teachers who immigrated to the US learned their poomsae in Korea when there was the fascination with Japanese karate, with the wide stance and so forth. Then when they learned the new forms (which were supposed to be done with the short narrow stance), they learned at short seminars which did not allow enough time to fully absorb the technical aspects of the forms. They just wanted people to get the movements. There is also an amount of peer pressure involved, at least those involved with the USTU. There is or was a USTU style, doing the slap blocks in taebaek with dynamic tension, for example, instead of quickly like how it is supposed to be done.

Those sorts of things.

I agree and completely understand that now. My GM's and the ones I know all came here in the 70's just after Vietnam. All were shown the Taegueks AFTER leaving Korea. Although they were doing them when I started. The taegueks were the first poomses I learned. (80's)

Since the Kukkiwons Push within the last few years to get everyone to the standards, I can say that they are all making every effort to do it the KKW way. The ones who aren't are americans....

 

[puunui]

Since the Kukkiwons Push within the last few years to get everyone to the standards, I can say that they are all making every effort to do it the KKW way. The ones who aren't are americans....

I do think other countries, especially those active at WTF International Events, are pushing hard for the standards, because they wish to win medals. I don't know why so many in the US are opposed. You would think we Americans would be the first to adopt the "new" way, given our attitudes regarding constantly new things in other areas. In the land of the free and the home of the brave, people chained to the old ways and are afraid to change.

 

[mastercole]

Sounds like I may also get to meet Joe then and thank him personally for the help he's given me! (and thank you personally of course my friend!)

Any Englishman that sends me impossible to find Mott The Hoople gigs gets our assistance He has been busy training and rendering more video from my old VHS tapes. As a matter of fact I am getting ready to put up something soon, I'll send you the link.

 

[mastercole]

I disagree. it might be a great plan, but the execution is no good. For one thing, it is in muju. If they had done it in Seoul, at the Olympic Park someplace for example, then there would be much less objection. As it stands, the Seoul City Taekwondo Association (by far the largest regional association of the KTA) will be displaced, and now we have to travel way down the penninsula, frequently after a very long plane flight, to get there. And when we finally get there, other than the Taekwondowon, there is nothing to do. Chonju shuts down at 8pm.

I don't disagree with you. I thought finding a remote mountain area not far from Seoul would have been ideal. But now that it is a done deal, I'll run with it and learn to like it I guess. Also, the benefits for the the whole southern region of Korea could be tremendous. Plus I have good friends and seniors in Chollabukdo.

 

[puunui]

I don't disagree with you. I thought finding a remote mountain area not far from Seoul would have been ideal. But now that it is a done deal, I'll run with it and learn to like it I guess. Also, the benefits for the the whole southern region of Korea could be tremendous. Plus I have good friends and seniors in Chollabukdo.

This is definitely a "make lemonade" situation, at least for me. I like Seoul best when visiting Korea. Second is pusan, for the seafood.

 

[andyjeffries]

Any Englishman that sends me impossible to find Mott The Hoople gigs gets our assistance

LOL! I still find it funny that you're in to a rare UK band...

He has been busy training and rendering more video from my old VHS tapes. As a matter of fact I am getting ready to put up something soon, I'll send you the link.

COOL!

 

[miguksaram]

Moved my reply to a whole new thread called Taekwondowon

 

[miguksaram]

This is definitely a "make lemonade" situation, at least for me. I like Seoul best when visiting Korea. Second is pusan, for the seafood.

Next time we are in Jeonju, I will make sure you are fed well sir.

 

[Archtkd]

I agree and completely understand that now. My GM's and the ones I know all came here in the 70's just after Vietnam. All were shown the Taegueks AFTER leaving Korea. Although they were doing them when I started. The taegueks were the first poomses I learned. (80's)

Since the Kukkiwons Push within the last few years to get everyone to the standards, I can say that they are all making every effort to do it the KKW way. The ones who aren't are americans....

The funny thing is when I started training in Kenya in the mid-198os, we were doing the current poomsae because my instructor Ernest Olayo, was the student of Han, You-Keun, (the 1975 World Taekwondo Championships fly-weight gold medalist). GM Han, a younger teacher of the Moo Do Kwan lineage, was already teaching the modern standards, to his students at an elite school known as Moi High School-Kabarak, which Master Olayo attended.

GM Yoon, Mogg, was my kwanjang at the Kenya Taekwondo Association main dojang, which master Olayo had moved after graduatiing from college. Yoon came from the Oh Do Kwan lineage and was teaching corrupted stuff, even though he gave younger Kenyan and Korean instructors some leeway. There always seemed to be conflicts in how poomsae was being taught and judged in Kenya back then, and that problem still exists today, especially because Kenya's early taekwondoin, who were taught by Yoon had come from karate backrounds. The conflicts are reducing, though, thanks to an increase in the number of Kenyans travelling to Korea for training and the emergence of the Internet, which is helping Kenyans gain access to modern stuff. The introduction of WTF international poomsae competition also has greatly helped in pushing serious Kenyan taekwondoin to adopt Kukkiwon standards.

 

[d1jinx]

The conflicts are reducing, though, thanks to an increase in the number of Kenyans travelling to Korea for training and the emergence of the Internet, which is helping Kenyans gain access to modern stuff. The introduction of WTF international poomsae competition also has greatly helped in pushing serious Kenyan taekwondoin to adopt Kukkiwon standards.

ah yes, the "internets". it is a grreat thing that has shrunk our world. no more are we unable to obtain current information on any given subject thanks to the "internets". Its not what it was 10 years ago, thats for sure.

I agree with you 100%. The Internet and WTF Poomse system has forced the hands (so to speak) of everyone to finally return to the same page.

 

[puunui]

Next time we are in Jeonju, I will make sure you are fed well sir.

The food is good, just nothing to really do there. I have my favorite places i like to go to when in Seoul, I guess I just have to learn to have new favorite places in Muju.

 

[miguksaram]

The food is good, just nothing to really do there. I have my favorite places i like to go to when in Seoul, I guess I just have to learn to have new favorite places in Muju.

I am not too familiar with Muju itself. The first time there was back in 2009 during the fall and it was a ghost town. We were at a decent resort, but nothing going on..even the night club was dead. However, that is to be expected in ski resort area. It is my hope that they will have more things to do in the off season once the Taekwondowon is up and running.

 

[mastercole]

The funny thing is when I started training in Kenya in the mid-198os, we were doing the current poomsae because my instructor Ernest Olayo, was the student of Han, You-Keun, (the 1975 World Taekwondo Championships fly-weight gold medalist). GM Han, a younger teacher of the Moo Do Kwan lineage, was already teaching the modern standards, to his students at an elite school known as Moi High School-Kabarak, which Master Olayo attended.

GM Yoon, Mogg, was my kwanjang at the Kenya Taekwondo Association main dojang, which master Olayo had moved after graduatiing from college. Yoon came from the Oh Do Kwan lineage and was teaching corrupted stuff, even though he gave younger Kenyan and Korean instructors some leeway. There always seemed to be conflicts in how poomsae was being taught and judged in Kenya back then, and that problem still exists today, especially because Kenya's early taekwondoin, who were taught by Yoon had come from karate backrounds. The conflicts are reducing, though, thanks to an increase in the number of Kenyans travelling to Korea for training and the emergence of the Internet, which is helping Kenyans gain access to modern stuff. The introduction of WTF international poomsae competition also has greatly helped in pushing serious Kenyan taekwondoin to adopt Kukkiwon standards.

Very interesting. Was GM Yoon considered the founder of Taekwondo in Morocco? I know GM Mohammed Yoon of Morocco, who is also from Oh Do Kwan and wonder if they are the same person.

 

[puunui]

Very interesting. Was GM Yoon considered the founder of Taekwondo in Morocco? I know GM Mohammed Yoon of Morocco, who is also from Oh Do Kwan and wonder if they are the same person.

I think it is a different person. I also met GM Yoon from Morocco at a Kukkiwon function in Seoul. He has a very interesting martial arts background.

 

[mastercole]

I think it is a different person. I also met GM Yoon from Morocco at a Kukkiwon function in Seoul. He has a very interesting martial arts background.

The Ministry of Culture, Sports and Tourism presented him with a special government award for having over 1 million followers through the Mid-East. At one point he and I were sitting together in the crowd, when he was called to the stage during Taekwondo Day Celebration at Olympic Park. The Minister personally presented him the award. I was amazed and did not realize the government announced it. He came back and sat down and we continued to talk. He went to Morocco in the 70's, founded Taekwondo there and converted to Islam. His father was a General in the South Korean Army. He and several other boys of General's would go to CHOI Hong Hi's home and learn Taekwondo from him directly. He said that he and those few other boys were the only direct students of CHOI Hong Hi. He said he has been a life long member of Oh Do Kwan and teaches the Kukkiwon curriculum. He and I were assigned as room mates at Olympic Parktel, we would talk for a few hours then he would leave and come back the next day, I'm sure he had a lot of friends to see.

Here is a photo of GM Yoon in our room, and one with a Middle East athlete.

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

 

[Archtkd]

Very interesting. Was GM Yoon considered the founder of Taekwondo in Morocco? I know GM Mohammed Yoon of Morocco, who is also from Oh Do Kwan and wonder if they are the same person.

No that's a different GM Yoon. I had written a brief history of Kenya taekwondo in one of the threads, which mentions GM Mogg Yoon, as being of the pioneers of Taekwondo in Kenya, where he still lives today and is most likely a citizen. He was brought to Kenya in the late 1970s by GM Lee, Ki Jin, the grandfather of Kenya taekwondo, who was also from the Jidokwan lineage. GM Yoon was involved in the formation of the Kenya Taekwondo Association and was its kwanjang for many years. He is no longer actively involved in Kenya taekwondo now because of politics. I'm still working on research on the history of taekwondo in Kenya and will shoot you what I've come up with so far.