Combat proven martial arts. What are the top real world effective arts?

[fangjian]

I think you are missing clfsean's point about apples and oranges. You say arts aren't equal. He is basically saying the same but for a different reason. You basically say an art can be inferior (1 does not equal 2, because 1< 2) Clfsean, I believe is saying arts are not inferior because they are not meant for the same thing (1 does not equal "A" because "A" is not a number) I agree with this second approach.

'they are not meant for the same thing'

This is exactly why I feel one may be superior than another. One style may be opted for just use of the hands or just use of the right knee etc. . The other style is opted for use of 'everything' let's say MMA rules. the 'styles' created for the more flexible rule system will be superior than the styles created for the more strict rule system. The one with the more flexible rule system will be a better approximation to actual combat. And then, let's take it one step further. Let's say that 'flexible rule system' got ever more flexible. Let's say, inside the cage they put random items to possibly be used as weapons. Whatever, a towel, a book, etc. It sounds silly but I think new styles would be born that would prepare someone for even more circumstances. Which seems reasonable to believe. Not make sense?

 

[Xue Sheng]

where they draw their techniques from. Sport SanShou? Traditional BaJi?

Neither.

It is kicking and punching, Qinna and Shuaijiao. It is hard and painful training and basically a quick way to learn how to hurt someone very badly

 

[fangjian]

Neither.

It is kicking and punching, Qinna and Shuaijiao. It is hard and painful training and basically a quick way to learn how to hurt someone very badly

I'd love to see what they do. I would imagine it would be a style based on easy to learn, high %, maximum effect , efficient techniques. I would imagine they wouldn't learn to much 1, 2 round kick .... But more like headbutt, rifle butt-stroke push them away, center-mass and fire.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I'd love to see what they do. I would imagine it would be a style based on easy to learn, high %, maximum effect , efficient techniques. I would imagine they wouldn't learn to much 1, 2 round kick .... But more like headbutt, rifle butt-stroke push them away, center-mass and fire.

Simply hand to hand no weapons usage involved, that is a separate training issue. There are weapons defenses taught. It is trained to police and military.

It is hard training; limited kicks, palm strikes, elbows, punches (actually not so many punches), qinna, shuaijiao

 

[Aiki Lee]

I feel my training is quite beneficial not because of the art itself, but because how it is taught to me. My teacher makes sure we internalize the principles from the kata to be used in self-defense scenarios. Another person teaching my art could be awful at it and therefore not teach effectively and no one would be able to defend themselves. You can have a good teacher of an art and a bad teacher. the art itself does not matter, the specific training methods do.

 

[fangjian]

I feel my training is quite beneficial not because of the art itself, but because how it is taught to me. My teacher makes sure we internalize the principles from the kata to be used in self-defense scenarios. Another person teaching my art could be awful at it and therefore not teach effectively and no one would be able to defend themselves. You can have a good teacher of an art and a bad teacher. the art itself does not matter, the specific training methods do.

Yes I agree. This is obvious, of course. I am just thinking that if you combined all of the techniques/ideas.methods of let's say TKD and Muay Thai and call it 'whatever' I guess, it would be a superior system. I'm still waiting to see someone in MMA competition pull off one of those TKD spin kicks. Those ones that come form 'underneath', like in the blind-spot or something. Love those.

 

[Aiki Lee]

I think this thread is essentially becoming the same thing in the other thread about "beliefs in MA". Perhaps they should be merged? Or else I'm not really seeing a distinction between the two anymore.

 

[kip42]

Thanks for all the replys. I suppose I am looking for the style that anything goes, fight multi attackers, and prepare for the worst. I have rulled out all competition styles since they dont allow, eye, groin, ear claps, join dislocations, and any of the stuff that works extra well. I liked MMA bc I could roll full contact but it would have been easier to rip the bad guys eyes out then role for a choke. I am going to look through all the suggestions on here.

 

[frank raud]

Thanks for all the replys. I suppose I am looking for the style that anything goes, fight multi attackers, and prepare for the worst. I have rulled out all competition styles since they dont allow, eye, groin, ear claps, join dislocations, and any of the stuff that works extra well. I liked MMA bc I could roll full contact but it would have been easier to rip the bad guys eyes out then role for a choke. I am going to look through all the suggestions on here.

Just a thought. If you were to train in a contact style of martial arts, you would gain valuable experience in dealing with resisting opponents, setting up situations to enable you to go for the deadly eye pokes and joint dislocations.

If you spend all your time training and practicing the uber deadly moves, you can't practice at full speed or with realistic contact. Can be a big surprise if the first time you go for an eye strike, the BG doesn't just stand there and accept your technique. If you can control a heavily resisting opponent, it is easier to do all the illegal things you want to do.

 

[frank raud]

Thanks for all the replys. I suppose I am looking for the style that anything goes, fight multi attackers, and prepare for the worst.

Do they teach that style anywhere near where you live? If not , what are your options?

 

[Mike Hamer]

Your best bet in my opinion is to study a variety of combat orientated arts and take what you like best from them, and make it your own. Every style wont suit every person, just like every technique wont suit each individual practitioner. Was there something you liked from Budo Taijutsu that stood out to you? A particular variation of a gun disarm in Krav Maga? You get the point. You gotta find what works for you, then work on transforming what you've learned from different arts into a group of skill sets that you can call your own.
I will definitely echo what others have said in the regards to firearm training. This is a must in today's world no doubt, but you already know that as many others here do.

If you'd like to learn a little bit about what we do in Instinctive Response Training than you can visit http://www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
If you can make it to Nevada, Texas, or Michigan, you can stop by and train with us!

 

[blindsage]

I liked MMA bc I could roll full contact but it would have been easier to rip the bad guys eyes out

Which style would allow that in training?

 

[fangjian]

Which style would allow that in training?

Hehe. Maybe Harimau Silat?

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Whatever you do, don't by in to the "it's not the style that matters, it's the practitioner" mentality too much. It does have a little bit of truth,

Actually, it has a lot of truth, though not entirely in the way that most people are thinking when they make the statement. Most people say this with an eye towards training hard, and certainly, if I'm training hard, I have a better chance in a violent encounter than I do if I train haphazardly.

However, outside of training, the practitiioner does matter. An 135 pound 85 year old man practicing MMA will likely be at a distinct disadvantage against a twenty five year old TKD heavyweight tournament fighter. An absurd comparison, I know, but the twenty five year old heavyweight TKDist will have the advantage because he's twenty five and his opponent is eighty five.

They have weight classes in MMA, boxing, wrestling, TKD, etc. for a reason; size does matter. They separate competitors by age and gender because like it or not, it does matter (though regarding gender, to a greater or lesser degree, depending on the art).

A friend loaned me a book a while back about a diminutive female vampire hunter. The books were so-so, but one line stuck in my head. The main character said, "I've trained hard in several martial arts and I'm more than a match for any badbuy my size. Unfortunately, there aren't many bad guys my size."

Andre the Giant would have been a tough opponent for anyone no matter what he trained in. Because he was a frickin' giant.

but some styles ARE better than others. This is a fact.

Every style is better than every other for something and for some people. Figure out what you want to do and what is best for you.

If you learn a presentation/demonstration art, whatever it may be, be realistic about what it is designed to do. XMA is 'better' for flashy demonstrations and presentations than jujutsu.

If you take a fitness oriented tai chi class for health and wellness, chances are that it is better for health and wellness than sport karate, particlarly if you are starting the art as an over fifty years of age student.

Taekwondo is better for learning high kicks than boxing. Aikido is better for joint manipulation and grapples than taekwondo. BJJ is better for groundfighting than aikido.

Everything has its strong suit. Not everyone takes to every art equally well either. That is why some people are utterly frustrated in one style and in Heaven in another.

If you are in the wrong art for you, then regardless of its statistical superiority, it is not better than one that is the right art for you.

Daniel

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I have trained in US Army Combatives, BJJ, Commando Krav Maga, and the Bujinkan. I am looking for a combat proven martial arts for winning an altercation. I am considering a move away from the Bujinkan system for the same reason that I moved away from Commando Krav Maga... the fact that its not proven to be real.

What styles have evolved through what worked in combat? I dont like competition based arts and want one that will end the fight with no rules.

Try Autojutsu.

It is the ancient art of mobile combat. It was developed for millenia, but achieved its truest expression in the twentieth century. Special touraments are held each year at county fairs and autojutsu masters demonstrate their skill with this crushingly powerful art.Autojutsu is the only art that has acknowledged the unvarnished truth that no punch, kick, or ground fighting technique can prevail against horsepower and torque.

Not to mention an average of two tons of steel! Twentieth century grandmasters of this art include such luminaries as Enzo Ferrari, Soichiro Honda, Henry Ford, Walter P. Chrysler, Kiichiro Toyoda, Louis Chevrolet, Karl Benz, and Ferdinand Porsche.

The deadly weapons used in autojutsu are legal in all nations and in all states, and is the only street legal weapon that can conceal you!

Police of every state practice this traditional art, as do sport autojutsu masters such as Danika Patrick, Jeff Gordon, and Dale Earnhardt Junior.

The art has also been adapted to all terrain fighting by Grandmaster John Willys, making it one of the most versatile armed combat methods in the world.

Be you law enforcement, high society, or a regular man on the street or offroad, or even a back woods country boy (or girl), autojutsu is an art that you should be practicing. Best of all, if you drive to work on a regular basis, you are practicing!

Cinematic examples of autojutsu:
LeMans
Deathrace
James Bond
The Dukes of Hazzard
Bullitt
The French Connection
The Italian Job
Speedway
Days of Thunder

Daniel

 

[FriedRice]

I say train to fight. Train hard. Spar hard. Compete in the ring/cage. See if you can knock somebody out. Fake strikes at the eyes, throats, nuts, etc. aren't the same as actually punching someone in the face at max power or getting punched the same....regularly every week. Any trained and experienced fighter will develop more power, precision, agility, reflex, confident, etc...it wouldn't be hard at all to target nuts, throats, kneecaps, etc. on the streets where there's no rules. Elbowing and kneeing someone in the face repeatedly and it too, the face, will become a pressure point.

This is why MT & BJJ for MMA is so effective and practical. You learn to fight. You practice fighting. Then you fight.

 

[Indie12]

It varies!

 

[mook jong man]

This is why MT & BJJ for MMA is so effective and practical. You learn to fight. You practice fighting. Then you fight.

and 20 years down the track you end up with chronic injuries and Parkinson's disease..... nice.

 

[Indie12]

I love it when people say "Hand To Hand Combat is not Martial Arts"

If that's the case, then what exactly are we fighting with?

 

[Aiki Lee]

H2H isn't necessarily martial arts. Any goon can get into a fight with his fists. Martial arts have to have skills organized from principles that can be passed on.