Can hard work make up for lack of talent?

[Kung Fu Wang]

a good strength training program will make you stronger much faster than a martial arts class.

I call that "ability" training. There is no short cut for this and talent won't matter.

 

[drop bear]

Yes, I learn all of them from the same sensei. He makes sure to show how they can all work together. I spend the least time on MMA & about equal time on kickboxing & karate. I really enjoy both of them & would prefer to focus there, absolutely.

I don't see learning all three as an issue. Let's put it this way. Doing multiple arts will progress you faster than doing one and going home early to watch tv.

 

[drop bear]

well sort of, most people can get better at most things, with dedication, but there is a genetic limit on how far that can work, they can only be so fast or so strong. yes you can win fights just on aggression, until you run in to a more talented fighter who is equally aggressive, then your sat on your bum.

aggression is also a genetic trait, well that or steroids

Why would aggression be genetic? Humans are free willed you can choose to be whatever you want.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Why would aggression be genetic? Humans are free willed you can choose to be whatever you want.

I may be wrong in this, DB, but I think I read something some unspecified time ago (is that vague enough??) about genetic components for aggression. Or maybe it was a genetic component of inhibition.

In any case, here's a page that touches on the topic: Genetics of Aggression - Oxford Scholarship

 

[jobo]

Why would aggression be genetic? Humans are free willed you can choose to be whatever you want.

humans have practically no free will, between genetic traits and conditioning, they have very few actually free choices to make

you cant choose to be agresive, like you can5 choose to b3 emphathic ,you can choose not to be either and you can fake both, but 5hats not the same thing

 

[Gerry Seymour]

humans have practically no free will, between genetic traits and conditioning, they have very few actually free choices to make

you cant choose to be agresive, like you can5 choose to b3 emphathic ,you can choose not to be either and you can fake both, but 5hats not the same thing

There's a question about what defines free will. If someone chooses to develop their empathy (which is possible, within limitations), then it could be argued they're choosing to be empathetic. It's not something that can really be chosen in the moment, but can be chosen in advance. The same goes for many habits and conditioned responses - we can choose to develop different ones.

 

[dvcochran]

Yes, that's exactly what he does.

I think what others have said about muscle memory makes sense - I may be making very slow progress because there's so much that's new, I'm only learning / practicing so much at one time.

Over the weekend I started setting additional time aside to practice some of the basics that I feel comfortable with on the bag, & so haven't been practicing at home. I can do them but that doesn't mean my body remembers them without having to think about it each time.

Hey, I have been doing TKD since 1982. I still have to "think" about technique. It does get natural and muscle memory is a very real thing I think. But when our mind gets sliced into a dozen pieces by demands of the day it is not uncommon to have to stop and remember something you have already learned.

 

[dvcochran]

There's a question about what defines free will. If someone chooses to develop their empathy (which is possible, within limitations), then it could be argued they're choosing to be empathetic. It's not something that can really be chosen in the moment, but can be chosen in advance. The same goes for many habits and conditioned responses - we can choose to develop different ones.

Agree, but jobo said emphatic.

 

[jobo]

There's a question about what defines free will. If someone chooses to develop their empathy (which is possible, within limitations), then it could be argued they're choosing to be empathetic. It's not something that can really be chosen in the moment, but can be chosen in advance. The same goes for many habits and conditioned responses - we can choose to develop different ones.

no you either have empathy or you dont, if you dont nothing on earth will give it to you.

 

[jobo]

Agree, but jobo said emphatic.

if you going to posted every time I do a typo, then your odds on to be top poster of the month

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

if you going to posted every time I do a typo, then your odds on to be top poster of the month

hmm that's an idea

 

[Gerry Seymour]

no you either have empathy or you dont, if you dont nothing on earth will give it to you.

If someone entirely lacks it (a psychopath), you're correct. But someone who simply doesn't empathize well can develop that ability.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

hmm that's an idea

It'll never work. Give up the dream.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

It'll never work. Give up the dream.

Yup, just checked. Even if I reply to every one of his posts with corrections, I'd still be only at 2/3rds your posts.

 

[drop bear]

I may be wrong in this, DB, but I think I read something some unspecified time ago (is that vague enough??) about genetic components for aggression. Or maybe it was a genetic component of inhibition.

In any case, here's a page that touches on the topic: Genetics of Aggression - Oxford Scholarship

There is a theory that nature effects nurture while nurture also effects nature.

Your actions can alter brain chemistry.
How Nurture Affects Nature – FABBS

 

[drop bear]

humans have practically no free will, between genetic traits and conditioning, they have very few actually free choices to make

you cant choose to be agresive, like you can5 choose to b3 emphathic ,you can choose not to be either and you can fake both, but 5hats not the same thing

How Nurture Affects Nature – FABBS

 

[jobo]

Yup, just checked. Even if I reply to every one of his posts with corrections, I'd still be only at 2/3rds your posts.

yes but then you have your own normal posts, go for it

 

[jobo]

How Nurture Affects Nature – FABBS

yea, I'm not that impressed with rat studies that apply to humans? and I've seen it postulated that putting people in a dangerous high stress environment ( like prison)switches on the muscle growth gene, which is why despite no coaches, poor diet and little in the way of equipment a seemingly high percentage of prisons are ripped. or maybe the stress of there being an imminent risk of being beaten to death makes them train harder ?

but my point remains between genetic disposition and conditioning( enviroment) people have little free will to exercise

 

[jobo]

If someone entirely lacks it (a psychopath), you're correct. But someone who simply doesn't empathize well can develop that ability.

so how do you measure this small improvement .?

 

[Tez3]

You can certainly 'teach' aggression, or at the very least bring it out of people. Military training does this. To be honest most people can wind someone else up until they become very aggressive. There's also certain circumstances that will bring aggression out of people such as attacking loved ones etc. I can decide when to be aggressive.

On empathy.

"According to the latest neuroscience research, 98% of people (the exceptions include those with psychopathic tendencies) have the ability to empathise wired into their brains - an in-built capacity for stepping into the shoes of others and understanding their feelings and perspectives.

The problem is that most don't tap into their full empathic potential in everyday life"
Can you teach people to have empathy?