Attacking the Guard

[windwalker099]

I think his comments are based on what he may see in forms or in training. Granted it's really difficult to see Hung Ga sparring.

Different people have different experiences.

Had a friend who practiced Hung Gar, trained in the 'iron wire' set—sparring with him was like hitting a rock. From what I’ve seen of Hung Gar and Choy Lee Fut, their long-arm techniques are executed from a different stance, the stepping, similar to the stepping in your clips.

Rong Dong / Mike Staples
using crane, and gorilla or ape..aspects.
Tibetan White Crane, the horse used and stepping seems to be very different
from most other CMA I've seen.

Based off of whats called triangle in and out
using the 45° horse

practiced as shown at first with the hands on the waist..


TWC a sister style of Lama hop gar... a little different based off of the same root style.

Mike, at the time was exploring using "boxing" as a kind of short arm addition to the syllabus.

Note: My training in Tibetan White Crane (TWC) was limited, focused primarily on striking. Did a lot of 'testing' against other stylists in making it functional, there are other aspects, didn’t get a chance to explore.
For those who teach or have it as their main practice, feel free to correct, or fill in gaps as needed...
Appreciated


@ Kung Fu Wang

Reminds me of your "Rhino" guard

David Ross,
Chan Tai San Lion’s Roar Lama Pai Kung Fu

 

[windwalker099]

If you don't want to exchange punches with your opponent, you should control/disable your opponent's arm ASAP.

My method was to kill "disable" the arm or leg,,,,using TWC
Never liked controlling as done in n-mantis, through grabbing,

N-Mantis / TWC


One of my teachers students, plum flower mantis in Korea,...Mr Lee

Taiji uses whats called "sticking" combined with balance disrupting instead of grabbing...

 

[windwalker099]

In other words, when I grab my opponent's wrist, I do want him to respond so I can take advantage on. My goal is not on his wrist but on something else.

Variations

 

[JowGaWolf]

My comment on his overhand is his overhand doesn't change into a grab/pull.

That same movement can be used to pull the punching arm. It just depends on where your arms lands when you do the technique. In Jow Ga the pulling opens up the opponent, for the uppercut and a clinch would most likely occur after the upper cut. The reason why the clinch doesn't occur after the overhand is because of what the over hand is targeting. It main target is the back of the head. If someone lands it then there may not be any need to clinch. But you have to be committed to "smashing energy" and not "Wrapping energy."

For example, in order for the "back fist, overhand, uppercut" combo to make sense,

The back fist does a few things at the same time.
1. Fills the punching lane
2. Clears any linear punches that are going in.
3. Sends a strike, If your opponent ducks or move to your inside then you can hit them with that back fist.
4. The back fist can strike and knock down a guard.
5. The back fist can be extended to target head or initiate a wrapping of the arm.
6. Assists in powering the overhand.
7. used a a distractive technique.

The type of back fist being used here is not the same as the bruce lee backfist. The power for this backfist doesn't come from snapping. It comes from whipping and sinking. It requires engagement body core to provide it structure and strength.

 

[JowGaWolf]

However, hand hand trapping techqniues seems to be mostly ideal when following up with a head strike, and since we don't to that sparring in our style, it's not so much training.

You can probably do a good job with it if they try to control your arms as Kung Fu wang posted when he grabbed his students lead guard.

Different people have different experiences.

We can only go on and talk about what we experience. Which is always better than guessing.

From what I’ve seen of Hung Gar and Choy Lee Fut, their long-arm techniques are executed from a different stance

Is this what you see in form or sparring. If this is based on sparring then I would go with that. If it's based on form then I would use caution. The forms often miss key parts needed to make the technique effective. My guess is that this is because there are some things we can only learn through sparring. So if the teacher didn't use the techniques in sparring, then they make changes to form thinking that it's a small change but in reality, that small change has a big effect. As for the stance, there will be a limited number of stances that work with these techniques. If you use the wrong rooting, then the punch will throw you off balance or you'll only be able to throw one of these punches like MMA. They usually throw the punch and recover. If you have the most stable stance then you should be able throw this punch and then another.



As for that scissor sweep. "White crane splashes water"

It is done exactly as it's done in the form.

There is no need to hold your opponent's leg in order for it to work. The swinging arm works more of a counter balance to the sweep so that your sweep will have power. The arm has to swing in front of your body so it really doesn't matterwhere. There's no specific place you have to aim for so long as your arm swing has enough force to swing through.

This is Jow Ga version of that sweep. The thing to take note of are the position of the sweeping leg and the swinging arm which is the same as the illustration and the video. It didn't require me to control an arm or a kick.

This is the begining of the sweep. He was standing on 2 legs, my foot hooks behind his leg. As shown in the illustration

Based on me using this technique. The accurate parts of this drawing is the first part and the last part. Specifically the hooking of the sweeping foot and the lifting of the foot. The one key part that I think it does not and cannot highlight is that in the sweep you do not lift your leg. Your leg will rise on it's own with the sweep. The most important parts is the movement of the sweep across the body and the swinging of the arm arcoss the body.

There are variaties of how this sweep can be used, but in terms of the form and the illustration, capturing a kick is not required for this technique to work.

 

[windwalker099]

Is this what you see in form or sparring. If this is based on sparring then I would go with that.

Back in the day, had a friend who practiced Hung Gar. IME, sparring, the only way to truly learn about others—and yourself.

Forms

View forms as tools...some might need more tools then others to do the same things.
There is a saying "less is more"