Are you religious yes? No?

[Paul_D]

In the US, religious believers attacking atheists is commonplace.

Really? I find that scary. I would say it's more likely to be the other way around here. If you go around telling people you believe in invisible magician's who live in the sky, people are likely to look at you gone out and give you a wide berth. There is a US comdeian over here, who I will have to paraphrase as I can't rember which one he is and therefore can't find the exact quote, but he says we have "gotten over religion" here in the UK.

There was a debate a few years ago about it being silly for shops to have to close early for religious reasons on a Sunday, their second busiest trading day, when only 4% of the population regularly attend church. Atheism is the norm. Religious beliefs are respected as long as you keep it to yourself, but the moment you try to inflict your beliefs on others you will become the target of ridicule. I certainly am not aware of anyone I know who genuinely believes in the existence of a god.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I had a good discussion the other day with my friend. He said, "I believe in God but my God may be different from your God." When asked which God does he believe in, he said, "My God is not Jesus, Muhammad, Buddha, or ,... My God is the creator of the universe". This just make me to think, why should the creator of the universe needs to

- have a name?
- come from earth?
- look like human?
- ...

He will spend all his time trying to take care the whole universe. He won't care whether we believe in him or not.

 

[Tez3]

Atheism is the norm. Religious beliefs are respected as long as you keep it to yourself, but the moment you try to inflict your beliefs on others you will become the target of ridicule. I certainly am not aware of anyone I know who genuinely believes in the existence of a god.

I wouldn't say atheism is the norm, rather that the usual quiet faith is carrying on. Yes we have the noisy imports of evangelism with it's marketing but many people who feel they don't have to go to church still believe in a deity. I know many people who do, different faiths but who all believe in a god, they just don't feel the need to go around telling everyone. It's a personal thing, it has been for a long time here, why would we go on and on about it?

 

[Gnarlie]

No, atheist really doesn't suggest any such thing. The overwhelming majority of atheists don't talk about it much, don't proselytize, don't go on television and rant against those who disagree with them, or commit violence against believers. Compared to 95% of the religious denominations out there, atheists have a much, much lower incidence of aggression or militancy in the name of their beliefs/unbeliefs.

You're right, and I would love atheist to mean just that to everybody. But until the more militant amongst their number perhaps begin to call themselves *antitheists*, I am loathe to say I am an atheist, lest others assume a similar level of religious intolerance might exist in me. It's the loud ones that people see and are aware of.

 

[jezr74]

I had a good discussion the other day with my friend. He said, "I believe in God but my God may be different from your God." When asked which God does he believe in, he said, "My God is not Jesus, Muhammad, Buddha, or ,... My God is the creator of the universe". This just make me to think, why should the creator of the universe needs to

- have a name?
- come from earth?
- look like human?
- ...

He will spend all his time trying to take care the whole universe. He won't care whether we believe in him or not.

But why not just accept the overwhelming facts of how the universe was made and learn some science that can explain it all, and bask in the immense universe and it's wonderful discoveries it has to offer?

 

[Steve]

I don't think 'public' religion is very common (yet) in the UK, probably because of the religious persecutions that have gone on here people do still tend to be reticent to say whether they believe in religion or not. It certainly isn't a big thing when it comes to politics, we don't have politicians telling us what their beliefs are and I think if anyone started bringing religion into politics they would lose popularity pretty quickly. This is an interesting debate. Debate Should David Cameron do God - IV Drip - Voices - The Independent

Spaghetti monster? Sure,why not? in the UK we have the Jedi as an official religion.

So, this is a relatively new thing?

Hey, are you leaving the Flying Spaghetti Monster out of the conversation? He will smite you with his noodly appendage!

LOL. I think people outside the USA might miss the reference to this classic response to the idea that we teach creationism alongside evolution as science.

 

[Cirdan]

For the mythically inclined, there certainly is a lot to choose from...

 

[Transk53]

I had a good discussion the other day with my friend. He said, "I believe in God but my God may be different from your God." When asked which God does he believe in, he said, "My God is not Jesus, Muhammad, Buddha, or ,... My God is the creator of the universe". This just make me to think, why should the creator of the universe needs to

- have a name?
- come from earth?
- look like human?
- ...

He will spend all his time trying to take care the whole universe. He won't care whether we believe in him or not.

Probably would have to delegate there. I agree though, what says that the God has to be human.

 

[Tez3]

Well it seems that there are atheists that kill for their beliefs, Chapel Hill shooting Three young Muslims gunned down in North Carolina family home - Americas - World - The Independent

 

[Cirdan]

Well it seems that there are atheists that kill for their beliefs, Chapel Hill shooting Three young Muslims gunned down in North Carolina family home - Americas - World - The Independent

Interesting. I would however point out that the gential mutilation community is almost entirely religious. Same goes for suicide bombers.

(edit)
Oh and since "atheists being particularily nasty now" was mentioned earlier, here is the good Dr Dawkins reading his fan mail.

 

[Tez3]

Interesting. I would however point out that the gential mutilation community is almost entirely religious. Same goes for suicide bombers.

(edit)
Oh and since "atheists being particularily nasty now" was mentioned earlier, here is the good Dr Dawkins reading his fan mail.

Christians also perform FGM as do Muslims and animists, it's cultural rather than religious, it's believed it keeps girls 'pure' rather than having any religious significance.
The key word is 'some' atheists, not atheists per se. Not all of any group commit violent crimes.

Religion or Culture Stop FGM Middle East

 

[Cirdan]

Christians also perform FGM as do Muslims and animists, it's cultural rather than religious, it's believed it keeps girls 'pure' rather than having any religious significance.

Come now Tez, you don`t see the connection between the idea of female sexual "purity" (need for control) and religion?
Genital mutilation is often believed to have religious support by those who practice it, it is little comort to the victims if this is debatable. Indeed there are no religious scripts requiring the practice, but local religious leaders often contribute to it`s support.

WHO Female genital mutilation

 

[Tez3]

Come now Tez, you don`t see the connection between the idea of female sexual "purity" (need for control) and religion?
Genital mutilation is often believed to have religious support by those who practice it, it is little comort to the victims if this is debatable.

However, one could also say than rather just a religious custom it is one that is endorsed by men for the control of women, now whether they use religion as an excuse or not is debatable, however it is said in places where this is practised that men will not marry women who have not had this done and will not tolerate them being part of society. That women are also complicit is a given but primarily I would still say this is cultural rather than a primarily religious practice given that it goes across religious borders as well as none, because there are those who practice no religion who also do this horrific thing.

 

[Cirdan]

However, one could also say than rather just a religious custom it is one that is endorsed by men for the control of women, now whether they use religion as an excuse or not is debatable, however it is said in places where this is practised that men will not marry women who have not had this done and will not tolerate them being part of society. That women are also complicit is a given but primarily I would still say this is cultural rather than a primarily religious practice given that it goes across religious borders as well as none, because there are those who practice no religion who also do this horrific thing.

Those who practice female genital mutilation are almost exclusively religious, I am sure you can dig up a case of the vanishingly small percentage of non-religious practicioners if you want.

Of course it is being used to control women, that does not change the fact that female gential mutilation is thought to have religious significanse and often is encouraged by religious leaders. You could argue that burning innocent women as "witches" had nothing to do with religion too. Human sacrifice? Cultural!

 

[RTKDCMB]

Interesting. I would however point out that the gential mutilation community is almost entirely religious. Same goes for suicide bombers.

(edit)
Oh and since "atheists being particularily nasty now" was mentioned earlier, here is the good Dr Dawkins reading his fan mail.

Fundies say the darnedest things.

 

[Tez3]

Those who practice female genital mutilation are almost exclusively religious, I am sure you can dig up a case of the vanishingly small percentage of non-religious practicioners if you want.

Of course it is being used to control women, that does not change the fact that female gential mutilation is thought to have religious significanse and often is encouraged by religious leaders. You could argue that burning innocent women as "witches" had nothing to do with religion too. Human sacrifice? Cultural!

They aren't however just of one religion, the current climate is to blame Muslims and them alone for this. Christians should also be clamouring at their co religionists rather than directing the whole blame on Muslims. In Africa it is most often done by non Muslims, animists usually. In Egypt the religious leaders have strongly stated that FGM is wrong and should not be done but some people persist in defying them and still do it.
The other part of it is that males are responsible, if they, all of them said they would no longer take wives who had this done and they agreed to educate their daughters as well as their sons it would come to an end, hiding behind religion is not the answer. People say religion causes war and strife, well no it doesn't, it's the banner, the excuse for people to do bad things while feeling pious about it. Piety isn't the sole province of the religious the non religious can be equally pious about their beliefs.

 

[Transk53]

Looking at it. Is it not the case that as humans we are all fanatical in our own ways. Being a fundie would translate across a lot of things in life. Anyway might sign up to Jedi. Just as plausible as something from the first century AD

 

[Tez3]

Looking at it. Is it not the case that as humans we are all fanatical in our own ways. Being a fundie would translate across a lot of things in life. Anyway might sign up to Jedi. Just as plausible as something from the first century AD

People blame 'religion' for all sorts of things, they say it starts wars, spread cruelty, etc etc. The truth is people use their religion as an excuse to be a lousy human being doing things they would condemn in others, their 'religion' can be anything it can be no religion but it's what people hide behind. Rarely someone comes out and says they are staring a war because they want the land, wealth and power that their neighbour has, it has to be dressed up as 'righteous' before people will join in. The neighbours have to be demonised and put so in the wrong it seems the 'right' thing to do to invade, kill and oppress. It does has to be religion of course it can be a something that people feel strongly about such a being 'wronged' by another country or that the other country is 'evil' ( such as being communist, so many countries were demonised because they were communist and invaded such as Grenada)

If people feel they have a faith in a diety I don't see why they should be pilloried for it why should it matter to others what people believe in if it harms no one? Blaming one religious person for the faults of humanity as a whole doesn't make sense, before blaming 'religion' people should examine closely the real causes of conflict and war and they will find it's not religion that has started it but the greed and nastiness of humans. You think IS is a 'religious' war? Look closer, they want land, power and the wealth that the countries they want to invade have, it's wrapped up in religion to get the followers but it's no more a 'religious' war than the Crusades were.

 

[Transk53]

People blame 'religion' for all sorts of things, they say it starts wars, spread cruelty, etc etc. The truth is people use their religion as an excuse to be a lousy human being doing things they would condemn in others, their 'religion' can be anything it can be no religion but it's what people hide behind. Rarely someone comes out and says they are staring a war because they want the land, wealth and power that their neighbour has, it has to be dressed up as 'righteous' before people will join in. The neighbours have to be demonised and put so in the wrong it seems the 'right' thing to do to invade, kill and oppress. It does has to be religion of course it can be a something that people feel strongly about such a being 'wronged' by another country or that the other country is 'evil' ( such as being communist, so many countries were demonised because they were communist and invaded such as Grenada)

If people feel they have a faith in a diety I don't see why they should be pilloried for it why should it matter to others what people believe in if it harms no one? Blaming one religious person for the faults of humanity as a whole doesn't make sense, before blaming 'religion' people should examine closely the real causes of conflict and war and they will find it's not religion that has started it but the greed and nastiness of humans. You think IS is a 'religious' war? Look closer, they want land, power and the wealth that the countries they want to invade have, it's wrapped up in religion to get the followers but it's no more a 'religious' war than the Crusades were.

Yep agree. Been going on for a thousand and will continue to do so. Human greed and ideals that have no place. No I do not think the IS war has anything to do with religion. Like the Templar's, greed and money and an overzealous view of their importance. Always felt that this is quite apt>

John Connor: We're not gonna make it, are we? People, I mean.

The Terminator: It's in your nature to destroy yourselves.

John Connor: Yeah. Major drag, huh?

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Well it seems that there are atheists that kill for their beliefs, Chapel Hill shooting Three young Muslims gunned down in North Carolina family home - Americas - World - The Independent

The details of the case are still under investigation, but according to the killer's wife the murders were related to a parking dispute with the neighbors and had nothing to do with religion.

Atheists can be asshats just as much as religious folks - we just don't use religion to justify it. (After all, there are so many excuses out there for bad behavior - why limit yourselves to one religious dogma?)