Aikido against a boxer

[Martial D]

Nikkyo

I shall await you picking this apart

Pick what apart? This is a slow motion cooperative drill. Literally everything works when the guy cooperates.

Let's see it in real-time against someone fighting back.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

They need to know how the dynamics of striking works. So they don't constantly rush in to traps.

And some lomenchenko.

You will see how he constantly gets that angled entry.

I wish I was that good at cutting that entry angle. He's smooth.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I wish I was that good at cutting that entry angle. He's smooth.

Er, I mean, TMA...secret techniques...stupid rules...self-defense!

 

[Gerry Seymour]

For the last time mate, and this time I mean it, you are making no sense whatsoever and it's because you are not even trying to make!
Who's gonna judge such a holistic art as Aikido and claim that it has no useful foundation?? The.....invulnerable boxer??
I'm soooo out of here, like, for good.

He hasn't claimed boxers are invulnerable. But they are among the most compact fighters, and their punches are fast. That presents a specific problem for aiki arts.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Change levels is still safest because you don't have to fart around identifying and redirecting strikes. He will probably be going for your head. So you can just guess.

We've talked before about how weak my level changing is, man.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

also students change to some because Aikido is marketed the way it is think it passive and non aggressive and they see all the big throws and it impresses them and they trot along. Very few actually even consider the martial side

And this - and some will disagree with me - is a good fit. If the folks participating don't really care about the martial side, then ditch the atemi and the "hard" throws. Focus on the cerebral and attractive stuff, and spend all your time only on flow. That stuff's fun and can be studied a lifetime if it's done right, and everybody's happy. There's only a problem with that approach if someone is trying to use it (exclusively) to develop fighting/defensive skills.

 

[now disabled]

And this - and some will disagree with me - is a good fit. If the folks participating don't really care about the martial side, then ditch the atemi and the "hard" throws. Focus on the cerebral and attractive stuff, and spend all your time only on flow. That stuff's fun and can be studied a lifetime if it's done right, and everybody's happy. There's only a problem with that approach if someone is trying to use it (exclusively) to develop fighting/defensive skills.

I have no issue with that at all as each has his or her own path

 

[drop bear]

He hasn't claimed boxers are invulnerable. But they are among the most compact fighters, and their punches are fast. That presents a specific problem for aiki arts.

They own a range in which they are safe. The tank analogy was pretty good. It is your job to get through that range. All they have to do is keep that range.

Ever fought a tall guy? Same thing.

 

[drop bear]

I have no issue with that at all as each has his or her own path

Until you get in to discussions like vs a boxer.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

They own a range in which they are safe. The tank analogy was pretty good. It is your job to get through that range. All they have to do is keep that range.

Ever fought a tall guy? Same thing.

Tall guy is a great analogy. Works better I striking, but applies somewhat in stand-up grappling too.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Can someone answer me this simple question?

Do Aikido guys ever test their MA skill against people form different MA systems?

When my Aikido friend Armando Flores and I competed in Austin local Karate tournament, the week after, Armando was kicked out of his Aikido Association. Even today, we still don't know why?

 

[now disabled]

T

Can someone answer me this simple question?

Do Aikido guys ever test their MA skill against people form different MA systems?

When my Aikido friend Armando Flores and I competed in Austin local Karate tournament, the week after, Armando was kicked out of his Aikido Association. Even today, we still don't know why?

There is only one form of Aikido that has competition and that is Tomiki (a deshi of Ueshiba it did cause some issues between Tomiki and the Aikikai ). Are you saying he was kicked out because of him competing?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Are you saying he was kicked out because of him competing?

Yes! That was back in 1976. Not sure the policy has been changed since then or not.

 

[now disabled]

Yes! That was back in 1976. Not sure the policy has been changed since then or not.

Hmmmm I have no clue at all

All I can say is in a Karate Tournament then if your using Karate skills which I assume the rules would dictate then you and your friend were Karateka and nothing to do with Aikido thereby where is the issue ?

The only thing I can think of is and was your friend taking his Karate into the Aikido dojo and trying to start competition there or indeed just trying to start competition in Aikido as if it was and I assume his style was not Tomiki then that may have been the reason. As I said the only style of Aikido (derived and from Ueshiba's Aikido ) that has competition is Tomiki and well it is a thing well well known that Aikido is not promoted as a competitive art and it is frowned on.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Can someone answer me this simple question?

Do Aikido guys ever test their MA skill against people form different MA systems?

When my Aikido friend Armando Flores and I competed in Austin local Karate tournament, the week after, Armando was kicked out of his Aikido Association. Even today, we still don't know why?

The answer, like other arts, is it varies by individual. Many do not. Some do.

I know some folks in Aikido who are deep into the philosophy of peace and would be bothered by a student competing - a very closed-minded view of competition. I know others in Aikido who have no issue with it.

 

[now disabled]

For the American Aikidoka who might not have seen these two in their prime

 

[now disabled]

Another one who had a great effect on American Aikido

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

As I said the only style of Aikido (derived and from Ueshiba's Aikido ) that has competition is Tomiki and well it is a thing well well known that Aikido is not promoted as a competitive art and it is frowned on.

If a MA style doesn't compete with other MA systems, and also doesn't compete within it's own system, there is some missing training there.

No matter how much partner training that you may have, you still need to test it. I have seen people who has trained the wrestling art for 6 years. On the mat, he still doesn't know how to use his hip throw.

- In partner training, your opponent will give you that opportunity.
- In sparring, your opponent won't give you that opportunity.

 

[drop bear]

The answer, like other arts, is it varies by individual. Many do not. Some do.

I know some folks in Aikido who are deep into the philosophy of peace and would be bothered by a student competing - a very closed-minded view of competition. I know others in Aikido who have no issue with it.

How is that view inconsistent with competing?

I mean a BJJ is a pretty cruisey event.

 

[Martial D]

If a MA style doesn't compete with other MA systems, and also doesn't compete within it's own system, there is some missing training there.

No matter how much partner training that you may have, you still need to test it. I have seen people who has trained the wrestling art for 6 years. On the mat, he still doesn't know how to use his hip throw.

- In partner training, your opponent will give you that opportunity.
- In sparring, your opponent won't give you that opportunity.

Exactly this. Alive training teaches you to make your own opportunities. It doesn't matter what you train; if everything you do requires a cooperative partner, you won't have the first idea what to do when he isn't.