Twin Fist
Grandmaster
thats a wild accusation.
9/11--Was it an inside job?
- Thread starter Sensei Payne
- Start date
Even Churchill allegedly did something very similar, for very pragmatic reasons, during the Second World War (to conceal the fact that we'd broken the Enigma code).
If you don't think your government would do such a thing when it suited their foreign policy purposes, John, then there is no real way to convince you and I wouldn't even try to do so. I go so far as to give them the benefit of the doubt that they didn't expect the Twin Towers to fall but that's about as much leeway as I'd give the Machiavellian bastards.
You have to keep in mind all the time that the PM/President, for all the pomp, is just a figurehead for the machine of government and that that machine really doesn't care whose in the 'big chair' or what nominal political wing that person represents. That's why nothing ever really changes, fundamentally, after an election.
If you don't think your government would do such a thing when it suited their foreign policy purposes, John, then there is no real way to convince you and I wouldn't even try to do so. I go so far as to give them the benefit of the doubt that they didn't expect the Twin Towers to fall but that's about as much leeway as I'd give the Machiavellian bastards.
You have to keep in mind all the time that the PM/President, for all the pomp, is just a figurehead for the machine of government and that that machine really doesn't care whose in the 'big chair' or what nominal political wing that person represents. That's why nothing ever really changes, fundamentally, after an election.
You said wild... the word is nutso, iirc...
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
I am not gonna call the site owner "nutso" Don.............
No, not the person, the accusation.
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
still....red lights going off in my head mean time to back up.....
one site makes some interesting claims
http://911proof.com/index
with tons and tons of links, etc.
It all can't be BS.
The laws of probability say so. The US hadn't seen more than 1 hijacking in 20 years, all of a sudden -4- planes get nailed in 1 day? Highly improbable unless there was some level of cooperation.
Since terrorists haven't been able to follow up with anything near that level in 10 years....that also makes 9/11 a highly improbable event as a 1-off.
The truth is not what we were told.
It's also not what most of the nutters out there spew.
But, a simple question:
[FONT="]"What was President Bush doing sitting in a classroom for half an hour after he was told that the country was under attack? Why didn’t the Secret Service rush him away from where everyone knew he was, unless they knew he wasn’t a target? If they knew that, how?"[/FONT]
But. If the question is, do I believe that the Bush Administration was capable of a False Flag event, the answer is Yes. Their proven contempt for the US Constitution and numerous illegal actions prove there were members capable of anything.
http://911proof.com/index
with tons and tons of links, etc.
It all can't be BS.
The laws of probability say so. The US hadn't seen more than 1 hijacking in 20 years, all of a sudden -4- planes get nailed in 1 day? Highly improbable unless there was some level of cooperation.
Since terrorists haven't been able to follow up with anything near that level in 10 years....that also makes 9/11 a highly improbable event as a 1-off.
The truth is not what we were told.
It's also not what most of the nutters out there spew.
But, a simple question:
[FONT="]"What was President Bush doing sitting in a classroom for half an hour after he was told that the country was under attack? Why didn’t the Secret Service rush him away from where everyone knew he was, unless they knew he wasn’t a target? If they knew that, how?"[/FONT]
But. If the question is, do I believe that the Bush Administration was capable of a False Flag event, the answer is Yes. Their proven contempt for the US Constitution and numerous illegal actions prove there were members capable of anything.
Archangel M
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[yt]TPMS6tGOACo[/yt]
Archangel M
Senior Master
- Joined
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I just cant understand how people can reconcile a belief in government ineptitude on one hand and believe that this same government could pull off an operation of the scale, complexity, and sheer immensity (and still nobody has blabbed) of a 9/11 on the other.
The belief that all those buildings could have been wired for demolition under the noses of all those thousands of people alone illustrates an ignorance of demolitions at the best or a willful belief in movieland fantasy about slapping a few blocks of C4 with LED timers by hot CIA operatives at the worst.
Blech....
The belief that all those buildings could have been wired for demolition under the noses of all those thousands of people alone illustrates an ignorance of demolitions at the best or a willful belief in movieland fantasy about slapping a few blocks of C4 with LED timers by hot CIA operatives at the worst.
Blech....
See, I don't buy the 'demo' argument. Alot of the 'tinfoil' arguments...well they fall into fantasy and you really really have to reach for it.
Don, I wouldn't trust Dubya to tie his own shoes without help.
But I'd be ok hunting with him.
Cheney on the other hand....well...he does have a lot of Sith in him....
But I'd be ok hunting with him.
Cheney on the other hand....well...he does have a lot of Sith in him....
OP
Sensei Payne
Black Belt
- Thread Starter
- #33
What happened after 9/11?
We went to Iraq...and we well know Osama wasn't there....so what was the point?
Profitand Power!
And we never would have been able to go to "War" without 9/11
Not to mention the enfringement on basic freedoms with the Patriot Act, scaring the adverage citizen into submission.
9/11 was the excuse for our government to move more toward a totalitarian system, keeping to poor, poorer, and the rich, richer.
And how are they able to keep all of this up?
They keep us in a perpetual state of fear. With underwear bombers, TSA pat downs, and so called "home grown" Terrorists.
So really, 9/11 worked more in the favor of our government, more so than any other event in history...it gave them the control they want.
Our Constitution is slowly being dissolved due to the events on 9/11...
Demanding a real investigation of the September 11th crimes isn't just a patriotic duty, but a matter of survival
If the government wants to satisfy everyone that it was NOT an inside job then why are the videos of the plane crashing into the Pentagon still under lock and key? The security and surveillance cameras that were all around and functioning outside the grounds of the building, from banks to gas-stations and whatever... all those vids have still not been released.
Having been to the Pentagon and all that... obviously the powers that be see something so top-secret that I can't see when I'm looking at the outside of the building, so this is why they can't release the videos... unaltered preferably of course, because we might see something that blows something so top-secret and billions of dollars will have to be spent to re-do it or come up with something more.
Show the videos... c'mon.
Having been to the Pentagon and all that... obviously the powers that be see something so top-secret that I can't see when I'm looking at the outside of the building, so this is why they can't release the videos... unaltered preferably of course, because we might see something that blows something so top-secret and billions of dollars will have to be spent to re-do it or come up with something more.
Show the videos... c'mon.
yorkshirelad
Master Black Belt
Didn't you see the videos? I did. I saw planes flying into buildings. I saw people jumping to there deaths. I saw home video footage of people running away from the collapse. I saw a lot of footage. If you want the videos from the local Chevron station then go and ask them......But they'll probably refuse to show you it.
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
the gas stations film WAS released, for the Padilla trial
it sowed nothing, wrong angle.
it sowed nothing, wrong angle.
I've been talking about this since 2002 and finally, I stepped back and asked myself why was I attracted to this position about 9/11, because I knew that it wasn't entirely rational.
Without going into too many personal details, I simply don't trust the people in power to do the right thing. It's a deep seated issue with authority that I deal with and now, because of this personal reflection, I have to force myself to consider that people in the government really are telling the truth and that it all happened the way they say they did.
When I look at the story with that lens, it simply does not explain all of the evidence. AND there is no way that anyone can independently verify this version of events because evidence has either been destroyed or classified.
Therefore, in the rational corner of my mind, the one that uses logic, the one that I consciously attempt to separate from my underlying bias, I can understand how people can be skeptical of the government and the official story of 9/11...and even give them the benefit of the doubt.
For all practical purposes, we could simply just be looking at the single biggest cluster**** in American History. Even that needs to be weighed on the evidence and after a point, it becomes too difficult to explain all of the coincidences and all of the simultaneous failures that had to occur for it to be the giant Charlie Foxtrot the government says it was. It's preposterous, really, because if the government could screw up this badly, they couldn't even be trusted to tie their own shoes. Maybe that really was the case, but the probability of that is pretty low considering how well the government does other things, like blowing things up on massive scales.
In the end, none of us know what really happened. No one has seen the evidence for themselves and we must trust the stories that other people say about it. When these stories claim extraordinary things, they should be bringing an extraordinary amount of evidence to prove it and they should prove it to anyone who wants to look...or no one should believe it.
This is a huge problem because one of the biggest changes we've had in our culture in over a hundred years is occurring right now and we really don't know what happened in the event that is supposed to have precipitated these changes.
If I have to watch my children be virtually strip searched and/or groped before getting on a plane or going to the mall or a sporting event, I want to be convinced beyond all doubt that it is necessary. 9/11 is changing what it means to be an American and I believe that our society deserves a consensus on this issue before we bankrupt ourselves with war and destroy our founding documents.
Anyone here who is claiming they KNOW what happened needs to take a hard look at themselves and ask themselves why they really think that. I don't know and you don't know and god dammit we need to get our heads together and figure this **** out quick or our society WILL change for generations.
Without going into too many personal details, I simply don't trust the people in power to do the right thing. It's a deep seated issue with authority that I deal with and now, because of this personal reflection, I have to force myself to consider that people in the government really are telling the truth and that it all happened the way they say they did.
When I look at the story with that lens, it simply does not explain all of the evidence. AND there is no way that anyone can independently verify this version of events because evidence has either been destroyed or classified.
Therefore, in the rational corner of my mind, the one that uses logic, the one that I consciously attempt to separate from my underlying bias, I can understand how people can be skeptical of the government and the official story of 9/11...and even give them the benefit of the doubt.
For all practical purposes, we could simply just be looking at the single biggest cluster**** in American History. Even that needs to be weighed on the evidence and after a point, it becomes too difficult to explain all of the coincidences and all of the simultaneous failures that had to occur for it to be the giant Charlie Foxtrot the government says it was. It's preposterous, really, because if the government could screw up this badly, they couldn't even be trusted to tie their own shoes. Maybe that really was the case, but the probability of that is pretty low considering how well the government does other things, like blowing things up on massive scales.
In the end, none of us know what really happened. No one has seen the evidence for themselves and we must trust the stories that other people say about it. When these stories claim extraordinary things, they should be bringing an extraordinary amount of evidence to prove it and they should prove it to anyone who wants to look...or no one should believe it.
This is a huge problem because one of the biggest changes we've had in our culture in over a hundred years is occurring right now and we really don't know what happened in the event that is supposed to have precipitated these changes.
If I have to watch my children be virtually strip searched and/or groped before getting on a plane or going to the mall or a sporting event, I want to be convinced beyond all doubt that it is necessary. 9/11 is changing what it means to be an American and I believe that our society deserves a consensus on this issue before we bankrupt ourselves with war and destroy our founding documents.
Anyone here who is claiming they KNOW what happened needs to take a hard look at themselves and ask themselves why they really think that. I don't know and you don't know and god dammit we need to get our heads together and figure this **** out quick or our society WILL change for generations.
I was going to stay out of this.
If you're going to bring up the Pentagon and imply it wasn't a plane, then you're telling me that several people I know are liars because they saw, with their own eyes, a plane hit the Pentagon.
Was September 11th an inside job? I don't think in any deliberate fashion. It was the culmination of years of planning, as well as years of neglect and complacence at multiple levels of government and society. It's that simple, and that complex at the same time. Folks... until September 11th, 2001, "terrorism" was something that happened "over there" for way too many people. Even today, most people don't understand what terrorism is, or how terrorists really work.
Archangel M
Senior Master
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QFT..for some reason, some people find it easier to believe in a gvt cover-up than they can in a gvt ****-up. Even though the gvt has proven over and over again that its better at the latter than the former.
Maybe the government covered up a **** up?
What people need to keep in mind is that even the people who were commissioned by the government said they were lied to, denied evidence, the investigation was grossly underfunded, political theater and essentially wrong. While these people are not saying in was an inside job by any means, they ARE saying that we don't know what happened.
So, if you think you know what happened, you don't. It's that simple...and that complex.
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