Yeah, Bruce Tegner... reflections on his books...

[Bill Mattocks]

So I got some books for a couple bucks from eBay; I was looking for one and got the rest in the deal. Couple of them were written by Bruce Tegner. I remember reading some of his books when I was a kid and thought I could teach Karate or Judo or something to myself.

I put them aside for awhile, but then I actually sat and looked at them. I was kind of expecting to see poor technique, bad footwork, foolish moves or something out of fantasy and the movies. Instead, I found it's actually quite reasonable. Seriously, there's nothing wrong with what he's describing, and the photos are fine.

What *is* missing is all the nuance you get from an instructor in a dojo. And that's a *lot*. So no, I don't think anyone can teach themselves martial arts from Tegner's books. But the techniques are fine, there's nothing wrong with them. I'm not advocating that anyone try to teach themselves martial arts from a book. Just noting that by golly, the photos and descriptions are actually quite good, once you already know what you're looking at.

What a shame that when you have been training for a few years, you can see the application; but before then, the pictures and descriptions are not that useful because they necessarily leave out so much!

It's kind of like reading a book about how to balance on a bicycle. After you learn to ride a bike, you look at the description and think "Yeah, that's right, that's how it's done." But before you learn to ride a bicycle, you can look at pictures of people and read descriptions and it doesn't help at all.

Anyway, kind of fun leafing through these old 'instruction' manuals.

 

[JohnEdward]

Speaking from a Jujutsu perspective, on his jujitsu book. I was never a big fan of Tenger. I gave him credit for the introduction he provided. I found the books lacking in many areas. For one, I think that is due to his books not being very sophisticated and well thought out in terms of instruction and technique choice. His books seem to have used a template from Russ St. Hilaire's book. I am saying Tenger's books are more of a survey of basic jujutsu than an instructional textbook. The design of the book's results for the novice to be able to gleaned some simple waza that will generally work with little study. It is a good intro, and creates interest to the art of Jujitsu.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Bruce Tegner is the reason I became interested in the martial arts. I remember distinctly reading an old, dog-eared BT paperback that I got at a garage sale for a quarter while in the back of my grandparents pick up truck at a flea market. I was hooked! I remember trying to 'do the moves' as a kid. Yes, the books are fairly simple and straight-forward, but that's kinda the beauty of them. Both of his parents were Judo teachers and I think he began at the age of about 4 or so and then had the opportunity to train in lots of different things as he grew older. At one time he was sorta black balled by many experts of the day because he tried very hard to take out the mystique of the arts and present them as something useable by anyone.

I have gotten a bunch of the old paperbacks over the years off of Amazon as sorta a keep sake. There is a BT preservation society on the net that has his books available as well. I don't have the addy at the moment.

Fond memories

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Judoka1, a member here was a student of BT. If you do a search you'll see Judoka1 provide some first-hand info on BT. From everything I've every read, BT was top-shelf and a class act.

 

[frank raud]

Judoka1, a member here was a student of BT. If you do a search you'll see Judoka1 provide some first-hand info on BT. From everything I've every read, BT was top-shelf and a class act.

Bob Rosenbaum,who can be seen in several of Tegner's books, goes by Jukado1, not judoka1. Just correcting the typo.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Bob Rosenbaum,who can be seen in several of Tegner's books, goes by Jukado1, not judoka1. Just correcting the typo.

Thank you for the correction Frank. I'm coming off of three back-to-back 12 hours shifts...I'm lucky I can type at all :uhyeah:

 

[seasoned]

I went down in the cellar when I read his name on the OP. I knew I had a book of his somewhere. Dusted off a few and found "Defense Tactics for Law Enforcement". I have had the book for a long time, and found it to be relavent then, and worth looking at again. It's like finding an old friend.

 

[frank raud]

His books seem to have used a template from Russ St. Hilaire's book.

I am only aware of Russ St Hilaire's book Pioneers of American Jiu jitsu, published in 2004. Is there another book by him that you are referring to?

 

[JohnEdward]

I am only aware of Russ St Hilaire's book Pioneers of American Jiu jitsu, published in 2004. Is there another book by him that you are referring to?

Nope. That is the book am referring to. A wonderful book full of traditional kihon jujutsu waza and information, interpreted by Westerners and some of whom also published their own books in the early part of the last century. Why you ask, you have a question, or just curious?

 

[frank raud]

Nope. That is the book am referring to. A wonderful book full of traditional kihon jujutsu waza and information, interpreted by Westerners and some of whom also published their own books in the early part of the last century. Why you ask, you have a question, or just curious?

I'm confused, more than anything. Tegner's book is from 1977, St.Hilaire's is from 2004. Tegner's book is an instructional book of jujitsu waza with a little historical background. St. Hilaire's book is a series of biographies, with almost nothing on specific techniques. I'm having trouble understanding the connection, or how a book written 27 years after Tegner's book could be considered the template for it?

 

[JohnEdward]

Frank, I know we are talking books, but Tegner's video of him and his mother doing jujutsu waza. Here is that video. And of two older demonstration of jujutsu, during the early jujutsu craze in the US. I think you will enjoy these.

 

[JohnEdward]

I'm confused, more than anything. Tegner's book is from 1977, St.Hilaire's is from 2004. Tegner's book is an instructional book of jujitsu waza with a little historical background. St. Hilaire's book is a series of biographies, with almost nothing on specific techniques. I'm having trouble understanding the connection, or how a book written 27 years after Tegner's book could be considered the template for it?

It is as Tegner templated St. Hilare's book, that was implied, specifically chapters that discuss jujutsu at the start of the last century. in many aspects, for some it can be difficult to understand, agreed, to wrap your head around an unfamiliar phrasing not accustom to as a result of me being playfully witty. St. Hilaire's book is a story, a history book not a instructional book, and Tegner's is instructional book, is what you are probably thinking, and thus confusing you. I am specifically looking at similar aspects of the books while being, again, being a bit playful at the same time. I think Tegner's book on jujutsu is ok, as I said earlier, but I don't see them any different in presented material and how that material is presented than what is present in earlier book's, like John J. O'Brien's book on jujutsu. And Tegner does have a knowledge that can be reflected in the fine book by St. Hilaire's. It's all good.

 

[frank raud]

It is as Tegner templated St. Hilare's book, that was implied, specifically chapters that discuss jujutsu at the start of the last century. in many aspects, for some it can be understand it is difficult to wrap your head around an unfamiliar phrasing not accustom to. St. Hilaire's book is a story, a history book not a instructional book, and Tegner's is instructional book, is what you are probably thinking and thus confusing you. I am specifically looking at similar aspects of the books while being a bit playful at the same time.

I have both books in front of me, the only thing I see them having in common is the subject matter(broadly) and many of the same books in the bibliography.

 

[tshadowchaser]

I remember reading and then trying to practice what Tegner wrote on Karate and Judo way back in the mid 60's.
At that time they where the only books I could find in my area.
I know that they inspired myslef and at least one other person form those days to continue studying the arts.
The books may not have been the most technical but they where an introduction for me.

 

[JohnEdward]

I remember reading and then trying to practice what Tegner wrote on Karate and Judo way back in the mid 60's.
At that time they where the only books I could find in my area.
I know that they inspired myslef and at least one other person form those days to continue studying the arts.
The books may not have been the most technical but they where an introduction for me.​

I can't agree more. I think Tegner kept the interest in jujutsu alive with his book. There wasn't a whole lot of jujutsu books out there when Tegner published his. I think they provided, like his video, the book is simple and technically digestible waza that could be easily explained and picked up. Though in my opinion, his book isn't a the bible of jujutsu- not that anyone is calling it that, it is a primer. I don't know how his other books weight in.​

 

[JohnEdward]

I have both books in front of me, the only thing I see them having in common is the subject matter(broadly) and many of the same books in the bibliography.

Since I am not at a place where I can access those books right now, could you tell me if John J. O'Brien is referenced in Tegner's book? Or other authors of the early last century? That would be a great help, thanks.

 

[frank raud]

Since I am not at a place where I can access those books right now, could you tell me if John J. O'Brien is referenced in Tegner's book? Or other authors of the early last century? That would be a great help, thanks.

No mention of O'Brien in the bibliography, there are numerous references to other early authors in the bibliography. Jigoro Kano is the only person referenced in the introduction.

 

[JohnEdward]

No mention of O'Brien in the bibliography, there are numerous references to other early authors in the bibliography. Jigoro Kano is the only person referenced in the introduction.

Thanks, I was just wondering if Tegner did. It is unlikely, as I believe O'Brien's book was out of print at that time I think. By that time, it could have been public domain as well, not sure though. I don't have any doubt Tegner cited Jirgo Kano, and probably Irving Hancock too. Kano's original judo book in it's time was fabulous in many respects, that is for another thread.