Why so many?

[shesulsa]

I just thought I'd put a little note here that in reviewing an old journal entry I found I had promised a veteran I'd remember all the young men and women who are giving their lives in the war in Iraq. I've been lax about posting them from my state, so I found a listing and posted a memorial thread for each of them tonight.

It's easy to become numb and forget that there are people dying in the middle east.

:asian:

 

[Cryozombie]

There are people dying senslessly all over, War, Poverty, Natural Disastres like the Tsunami, and the Earthquake... the death toll in China is freaking catastrophic right now...

I've been trying to make sense of it all, all night and I just can't understand it more than saying "It's the way of all things to die"... and even that is a hollow, hollow answer.

 

[Tez3]

I remember when women were given equal ops in the military and the opponents of it were saying that the first time a female was brought home in a body bag there'd be a national outcry. We've had women killed out there and to be honest the nation doesn't actually seem to care much, we had to have a national newspaper campaign to get the hearses of soldiers killed escorted by the police after landing at Brize Norton. They showed Canadians standing at the kerbs saluting their fallen as they drove past escorted by police outriders, ours were shown stuck in a traffic jam. We are having to fundraise for medical care for wounded service people.
I watched CSI the other night, they'd gone down to the evidence room to pick something up and were dealt with a police officer with one arm, they asked how, she answered Iraq and then they said "Thank you for your service" I've seen it on other programmes and on here, I've never heard it said over here not even on a fictional programme. In fact when dealt with in fiction it's usually a squaddie running amok because he's got PTSD.
I've seen on here too all the freebies, things you can do for your forces and the support they get from the general public and I get so mad that it isn't the same here.
The British Legion is busting a gut to do all it can but then it's made up of ex service personnel, the Princes William and Harry are also trying to help but we just don't have the same appreciation here of the sacrifices service people are making for this country. We don't even have anyone from the government to meet the bodies when they arrive in the UK. Soldiers are told to change into civvies after arriving back as they are being insulted. They changed on the runway.
Sorry better stop now, I can literally rant for Great Britain on this subject.

Shesulsa, it's such a good thought. We shouldn't forget.

 

[Brian King]

Shesulsa wrote:

I just thought I'd put a little note here that in reviewing an old journal entry I found I had promised a veteran I'd remember all the young men and women who are giving their lives in the war in Iraq. I've been lax about posting them from my state, so I found a listing and posted a memorial thread for each of them tonight.
It's easy to become numb and forget that there are people dying in the middle east.

Shesulsa,
Thanks for taking the time to make all those posts and to take the time to remember those service members. Besides showing deserved honor to those members it also shows honor to you and to our country. Thank You.

It is important for us as a society to honor those that are serving and especially those killed or maimed while performing services in our name. As a veteran my opinion is, that while it is important for us as a society to honor those that are killed or maimed while performing services in our name, it is even more important to honor the sacrifices made by the families of our service members. While in the service (and even while out of the service) service members and ex-service members willingly make sacrifices while carrying out their duties. For the United States service member sacrifices are part of the job, not work done for rewards, freebies or recognition, all service members heard the calling and volunteered. The external rewards are nice but cannot compare to the internal rewards.

The families on the other hand often did not volunteer, children missing or losing their parents, parents losing their children reversing the natural cycle, spouses losing their loved ones. The long days of loneliness, of worry and of uncertainness that families have to routinely serve and endure. A casual mean remark made on the television/radio/blog/forum, or on the street corner can drive like a blade to a family member facing those and more sacrifices when understanding and grace are so easy to give. When people talk down about service members (I am thinking those code pink types and those people that protest funerals and even those that hold conversations at the coffee shop and complain about the war debt (for example) with obvious contempt in the voice and body) they often have no idea of the damage that they can be doing to that child or adult (of any age) that just happens to be within hearing range. I encourage folks that it is ok to complain, but, with each complaint as well as with each nod of respect to or about the service members, take at least equal time to acknowledge those others around us that are silently making extreme sacrifices each and every day.

Tez3 wrote:

I remember when women were given equal ops in the military and the opponents of it were saying that the first time a female was brought home in a body bag there'd be a national outcry. We've had women killed out there and to be honest the nation doesn't actually seem to care much, we had to have a national newspaper campaign to get the hearses of soldiers killed escorted by the police after landing at Brize Norton. They showed Canadians standing at the kerbs saluting their fallen as they drove past escorted by police outriders, ours were shown stuck in a traffic jam. We are having to fundraise for medical care for wounded service people.
I watched CSI the other night, they'd gone down to the evidence room to pick something up and were dealt with a police officer with one arm, they asked how, she answered Iraq and then they said "Thank you for your service" I've seen it on other programmes and on here, I've never heard it said over here not even on a fictional programme. In fact when dealt with in fiction it's usually a squaddie running amok because he's got PTSD.
I've seen on here too all the freebies, things you can do for your forces and the support they get from the general public and I get so mad that it isn't the same here.
The British Legion is busting a gut to do all it can but then it's made up of ex service personnel, the Princes William and Harry are also trying to help but we just don't have the same appreciation here of the sacrifices service people are making for this country. We don't even have anyone from the government to meet the bodies when they arrive in the UK. Soldiers are told to change into civvies after arriving back as they are being insulted. They changed on the runway.
Sorry better stop now, I can literally rant for Great Britain on this subject.

Tez3, I cannot speak for Britain or her citizens. The British service members that I have had the opportunity to meet and work with were all top notch and I look forward to further opportunities. I am sorry to hear that they have to change out of their service uniform due to political angers and impolite doings. I was in the service (US) in the very early 80’s and it was the same here, you would never wear your uniform while out in the ‘economy’ and that was both abroad and here at home. It has changed and these things go thru in cycles. I can say that one thank you or other kindness makes up for much disrespect. It is easy to see how, as those that are disrespectful always show disrespect to not only the service member but to their own parents who raised them and to their teachers that ‘educated’ them and to their country/society that tolerates and excuses them and their behavior. These people while they might be many in numbers (ignorance breeds ignorance and then multiples) their individual weight of opinion to one that has been tempered with sacrifice is so very slight as to be meaningless, while on the other hand an encouraging word spoken by somebody with grace and understanding has the weight of decent society behind it and is easily felt.

Worrying about your nation is OK as there is a lot wrong and needing repair to your and to all nations and it is never ending work. But do not overly worry or anger about those that complain and hurl insults at the troops as they do not matter to the troops more than as surface irritants not really worth the time and energy to mock or swat (such is the pity as a swatting might knock some sense into them) and do not overly worry about your troops, consider that for every person hurling insult and taunt to the British soldier, there are many good people world wide saying thank you and praying for your service members and their families and nation and I am one.

Regards
Brian King

 

[exile]

I remember when women were given equal ops in the military and the opponents of it were saying that the first time a female was brought home in a body bag there'd be a national outcry. We've had women killed out there and to be honest the nation doesn't actually seem to care much, we had to have a national newspaper campaign to get the hearses of soldiers killed escorted by the police after landing at Brize Norton. They showed Canadians standing at the kerbs saluting their fallen as they drove past escorted by police outriders, ours were shown stuck in a traffic jam. We are having to fundraise for medical care for wounded service people.
I watched CSI the other night, they'd gone down to the evidence room to pick something up and were dealt with a police officer with one arm, they asked how, she answered Iraq and then they said "Thank you for your service" I've seen it on other programmes and on here, I've never heard it said over here not even on a fictional programme. In fact when dealt with in fiction it's usually a squaddie running amok because he's got PTSD.
I've seen on here too all the freebies, things you can do for your forces and the support they get from the general public and I get so mad that it isn't the same here.
The British Legion is busting a gut to do all it can but then it's made up of ex service personnel, the Princes William and Harry are also trying to help but we just don't have the same appreciation here of the sacrifices service people are making for this country. We don't even have anyone from the government to meet the bodies when they arrive in the UK. Soldiers are told to change into civvies after arriving back as they are being insulted. They changed on the runway.
Sorry better stop now, I can literally rant for Great Britain on this subject.

Shesulsa, it's such a good thought. We shouldn't forget.

Twas ever thus in the UK, Tez. Remember Rudyard Kipling's great, immensely bitter poem 'Tommy'?

I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o' beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here."
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:
O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play.

I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls,
But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside";
But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide,
The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide.

Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap;
An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.
Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, 'ow's yer soul?"
But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.

We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints,
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;
While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind",
But it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind,
There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
O it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind.

You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires, an' all:
We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!"
But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot;
An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool -- you bet that Tommy sees!​

True then and, alas, still true, from what you say.... Tommy's answer has been given to him: the Widow's Uniform is the soldier-man's disgrace, so you'll be changing out of it now, please...on the runway, if need be.

 

[Sukerkin]

I share Irene's quiet frustration and anger on this subject.

I can fully understand those that object to the wars being carried out in their name which are in fact for the benefit of other 'interests' but that does not excuse or even explain the disservice being given to our countrymen who serve in uniform. I am at a loss to explain it.

Yes, our military is being used to effect real politik that I actually disagree with but that does not undermine my respect for those in the firing line. They don't make the decisions that put them there and they do the best they can under the circumstances - so why blame them? I get pretty darned worked up about this, so I'll bite my tongue somewhat before I break my leash .

I've mentioned it a couple of times here but I have no shame in doing so again. The series Ross Kemp did about what's going on in Afghanistan is on sale now. Some of the price-tag goes to help the injured soldiers and the families of the fallen; so I urge everyone who can find it to buy a copy. That apart, like I said in another post in another thread, it was a real 'watershed' for me because it de-abstracted the conflcit for me and helped me split apart my political opinions from my human ones. Well worth watching (just not with your kids - there's a reason for the phrase "swears like a trooper" and the subject matter is a harrowing as you'd imagine).

 

[Langenschwert]

"It's the way of all things to die"... and even that is a hollow, hollow answer.

It may seem hollow, but at its essence it is correct. There are those risking their lives for our safety as I write this. Some of them will fall in the line of duty. But when it comes down to it, our end will be the same as theirs. Knowing this, I think that it behooves us to live without fear and emulate the courage of those who sacrifice on our behalf in our more ordinary, sheltered lives. Get out and face life unflinching. Stand up for yourself, stand up for your community. Go after that new job, ask that girl out you've been too shy to... whatever it is that seems too big for you. Go out and tackle it. Some of these things sound trite, but we've all gotta start somewhere.

After all, if we don't live with courage, all those sacrifices made by those braver than us don't benefit the world as they should.

Best regards,

-Mark