What is the excitement in belts?

[charyuop]

I would love for someone that has high level belts to explain me the excitement in it.
I don't know if in Tai Chi there are belts, but for sure not where I study it. They give out certificate when you learn and pass a test per each form (8-24-48-long-sword...and so on).
The other day my teacher asked me if I wanted him to set a day for me to take a test with the Master. I guess I kinda disappointed him when I said it didn't matter to me. I am there to learn and what I learn is in my head and muscles, I really don't care about having a piece of paper saying that I know what I know.

So...am I missing something in here? Do I have a wrong attitude about the whole belt thing?

 

[terryl965]

No you feel like your training speaks for itself. Nothing wrong in that, in western civilazation we need to be given something to prove that we are achieving the goals for us. I myself so no wrong in not needing a belt so why worry over it.

 

[Flying Crane]

It's refreshing to see this attitude. A lot (A LOT!!!) of people get really hung up over belts and ranks and seniority and authority and I think in many ways it's a bunch of nonsense. Belts can be useful, but can get in the way, or be abused, very very easily. I sometimes think it would be good to simply get rid of them altogether. Not all arts use them. It's good to see your attitude about this.

 

[Xue Sheng]

No you feel like your training speaks for itself. Nothing wrong in that, in western civilazation we need to be given something to prove that we are achieving the goals for us. I myself so no wrong in not needing a belt so why worry over it.

What he said.

There are CMA styles that have rank/belts/sashes, and there is nothing wrong with that, but I have only been at one CMA school that has any visible rank awarded and that was YMAA.

None of the other CMA schools I have been at have had rank other than beginner intermediate and advanced. But there was no way of telling just by looking at a person standing there.

 

[matt.m]

You know it used to be white and black. Belts get dirty. I look at belts as a level of achievement, there is nothing wrong with that. It is like grades on a report card.

I had spent many years in athletics and competition, so to me a belt shows a level of achieve like a high school diploma or a college degree. I understand where you are coming from.

However, it helps the new guys understand hierarchy etc. Who to look at for help, that sort of thing.

Your teacher must think that you are doing well and deserve a chance at showing your improvement to your master instructor.

Look at it as a good thing.

 

[donna]

I like having the belt system as it gives me a goal to aim for, it helps to motivate me to strive for the next level. It dosnt mean that because I have a certain belt level that I am better or worse than the next person as you cant compare belt levels from one art to the next. To me it is more a personal tool I use to know that I am improoving.

 

[still learning]

Hello, There is always a purpose for most things in life, like belts. We use it to show individual progress, each color represents a step of your learning progress. When in a Seminar or training with others this helps the Instructors with what they are teaching. White belts you know you will have to teach a little more differently than with brown/black belts.

Americans always like to see improvements, this is one of the ways, by giving a different color belt.

Yes! People do get hang-up's on belts, there is so many Black belts and no rules for promotions...we see or lots of people notice NOT all Black belts are equal!

Getting a black belt to beginner is there goal....when you get there...you realize our training is just beginning!

Having two black belts in two different styles...doesn't mean much when learning JUDO. A white belt here....getting thrown and toss all over the place............Aloha

 

[bushidomartialarts]

personally, i think the addition of more belt ranks is one of the real improvements the West has put into the practice of martial arts.

it's a clear fact (in modern culture at least -- there's no observable evidence for past cultures) that people acheive more when they have simple, clear, attainable goals. it's also been shown that people lose sight if they have to work more than two or three months to achieve a goal.

the best way to help any human achieve something glorious is to break it up into 2-3 month chunks.

and darned if the current range of belts hasn't gone and done just that.

a brand new yellow belt has done something worth celebrating and i, for one, am first in line with the cake and streamers. honestly, i get pretty hacked when somebody tries to belittle that accomplishment.

it comes down to why we train. if you view martial arts as a way to help everybody in the world become a better person and, by extension, make the world a better place -- then YAY belts! the more the merrier. if, on the other hand, you view martial arts as an exclusive club for only the 'deserving', then we should probably go back to the 'wear one belt til it's black with sweat and blood' days....

 

[Touch Of Death]

I would love for someone that has high level belts to explain me the excitement in it.
I don't know if in Tai Chi there are belts, but for sure not where I study it. They give out certificate when you learn and pass a test per each form (8-24-48-long-sword...and so on).
The other day my teacher asked me if I wanted him to set a day for me to take a test with the Master. I guess I kinda disappointed him when I said it didn't matter to me. I am there to learn and what I learn is in my head and muscles, I really don't care about having a piece of paper saying that I know what I know.

So...am I missing something in here? Do I have a wrong attitude about the whole belt thing?

Western thought deals in absolutes. Its why kids always have best friends or favorite songs. We want something that is ours and shows for the work we have done, not to mention the basic idea of goal setting.
Sean

 

[chris_มวยไทย]

I would love for someone that has high level belts to explain me the excitement in it.
I don't know if in Tai Chi there are belts, but for sure not where I study it. They give out certificate when you learn and pass a test per each form (8-24-48-long-sword...and so on).
The other day my teacher asked me if I wanted him to set a day for me to take a test with the Master. I guess I kinda disappointed him when I said it didn't matter to me. I am there to learn and what I learn is in my head and muscles, I really don't care about having a piece of paper saying that I know what I know.

So...am I missing something in here? Do I have a wrong attitude about the whole belt thing?

i think a lot of people use their belts to make them look better , possibly why a lot of poeple ive known have left the MA they did when they got their black belt , i agree that blats are so the student has something to aim for , motivation , but i also think you have the right attitude to learning and dont need a belt or sectiface to show how much you know

 

[MBuzzy]

Belts are great to motivate people and show levels of achievement....but I think there are some ways that they can hurt us too. The thing that makes me much less excited about the belt system is that it restricts learning. What you learn should be based on what you know and what you have mastered, not in the color of your belt. Some people just learn faster.

 

[Ping898]

I don't know if there is a universal answer to this question. I think in a way it is a matter of pride of being able to mark the "distance" you've come. I admit it, I have a belt rack and hang my belts from white to brown on my wall with my college diplomas cause I am proud of both of those accomplishments. Plus I think it is a way of being able to have people not in MA be able to relate to your training and able to understand what you've done and what you've accomplished.

 

[searcher]

The belts give the student a wonderful sense of accomplishment. The students work their butts off and the reward is that colorful new belt.

 

[Kacey]

As has been said, belts/ranks/syllabi provide clear goals and expectations, for the student and the instructor - the student knows what is coming, and the instructor is provided with a framework to keep him/herself on track and consistent with instruction.

As a color belt, increasing rank gave me a goal to reach for; as a black belt, increasing rank is a sign that I have met an external standard, and am therefore able to learn still more.

As an instructor, testing for rank helps me provide motivation for my students. In addition, since we require someone other than the instructor to test students, it provides me with invaluable feedback on my instruction and ways to improve it.

It's wonderful that you want to learn for the sake of learning - you have already learned a great deal. Enjoy the continuing journey!

 

[cfr]

I see nothing wrong with them, as they obviously mean a lot to folks. For me, I train in two garages right now. I will never have a belt/ cert/ sash/ etc. or anything else tangible to mark my progress. However, we video taped our sparring a few months back. I saw several things I was doing wrong. We video taped again tonight. The things I was doing wrong a few months back I am no longer doing.... now I am doing different stuff wrong.... hence, I see my progress.

 

[morph4me]

I can see why some people feel the need to have colored belts as a gauge to measure their progress, or give their self image a boost, but I'm from the "show me what you can do" school of thought. Belts don't impress me, skill and demeanor do. I tend to put most practitioners into one of three catagories. Those that will never be as good as they think they are, Those that don't realize how good they are, and those that have a realistic self image.

 

[MJS]

I would love for someone that has high level belts to explain me the excitement in it.
I don't know if in Tai Chi there are belts, but for sure not where I study it. They give out certificate when you learn and pass a test per each form (8-24-48-long-sword...and so on).
The other day my teacher asked me if I wanted him to set a day for me to take a test with the Master. I guess I kinda disappointed him when I said it didn't matter to me. I am there to learn and what I learn is in my head and muscles, I really don't care about having a piece of paper saying that I know what I know.

So...am I missing something in here? Do I have a wrong attitude about the whole belt thing?

When I first began my training, of course I was excited for each promotion. As time went on though, I began to see more of an importance in the constant learning experience, rather than the thrill of a new belt. IMHO, its the knowledge that is going to help me in a SD situation, not the color of the belt.

Would I like to test again? Sure, when it happens, it happens. I don't set a timetable for my rank. When my teacher feels I'm ready, then I'll test. Until then, I'm content with continuing my learning.

Mike

 

[charyuop]

When I first began my training, of course I was excited for each promotion. As time went on though, I began to see more of an importance in the constant learning experience, rather than the thrill of a new belt. IMHO, its the knowledge that is going to help me in a SD situation, not the color of the belt.


Mike

That is exactly my point. I see belts as a show off, what matters is in your head. I make an example...
I could take the first test (8 form) and I am sure I would get the certificate because in overall I think I do it good. Would I be satisfied? No.
I know there are parts that come out not really good where if I keep training and working out I could improve...like lowering more a stance or getting a kick higher.
My point is everyone should be aware of his/her limits and fight hard to reach them. Once you reach a point where you feel you can't really go past it then you can be satisfied. Why should you feel the need to receive something saying "you did well so far here's the reward" when you know that you still have alot to work to reach that point that really will give you an inner satisfaction?
Today I practiced the stance that gives more problems (snake creeps down) and I noticed I was going a tiny bit lower than I used to. I stopped the form training and I started jumping all over my den for the happiness...a recognition for doing good from someone who cannot actually know what is really good for me can't make me happy.

Of course this is just my point of view and I don't intend to put down or offend all MAists who have and are proud of their belts. I do respect them because I do know that behind those belts there is always a hard work and straggle to reach one's limits.

 

[Fuzzy Foot]

This may be a little off topic but I'll chime in anyway. Belts have their uses as a training, motivation and teaching tool as previously mentioned. But what some students miss is that TESTS for belts are as much for the instructor as for the student. As a teacher it lets me see where students need more work or maybe what points or concepts are not getting across or is it the individual student that is maybe not practicing enough for whatever reason, etc. Yes I can tell these things by observing in class. But tests put the student and their knowledge and skills under pressure to perform up to a standard of the school and rank and the mental and physical pressure of a rank test will either be handled well because of good training ...or not. You're under pressure to perform in real fights and this doesn't duplicate the real thing but is more demanding than typical class time. As a side, the pressure comes from caring about how you perform for yourself, in front of your peers, and instructor. If you don't care, it doesn't matter ... no pressure. I've yet to see the student who puts their heart and soul into their art and not care what their instructor thinks about them. Their award of belt rank is a reflection of what the instructor thinks about them as a student of the art. Just another thought.

 

[Kacey]

I would also like to add something I forgot earlier - in addition to providing students with motivation and helping instructors see where their students are strong and weak, like tournament competition, testing is a deliberately (if very artificial) stressful situation. As an instructor, I see things at testing that have never occurred in class... and then never see them again. If students cannot perform under the artificial stressor of testing, then they are even less likely to perform under the real stress of needing to defend themselves. For those who are about to chime in and say one doesn't relate to the other - I realize that actually being attacked (and yes, I have been) is much worse that testing or competition - but other than sending unknown attackers after students on a periodic basis (a somewhat problematic scenario), testing and tournament competition are the next best option for creating stressful situations and seeing how students react.