What do you expect from a first degree black belt/shodan/ildan/eqivalent?

[Daniel Sullivan]

After a fairly long discussion on belt progress, I thought about something that came up during the exchanges.

The idea that a black belt represents proficiency in the art is fairly accepted by most of us when discussing the topic, but what are the expectations of a black belt or equivalent (not all arts use belts) outside of just proficiency in the art within the school?

And how do those expectations factor into promotions prior to the black belt and a student's candidacy for the rank?

 

[lklawson]

After a fairly long discussion on belt progress, I thought about something that came up during the exchanges.

The idea that a black belt represents proficiency in the art is fairly accepted by most of us when discussing the topic, but what are the expectations of a black belt or equivalent (not all arts use belts) outside of just proficiency in the art within the school?

And how do those expectations factor into promotions prior to the black belt and a student's candidacy for the rank?

I'm not sure what you're asking. Every art/instructor defines their own art and their own grading system so, in that sense, no one but practitioners from within that system and affiliated schools can "expect" anything. It's not their business what one instructor, outside of their affiliation, decides his standards are. A Taekyon student doesn't have the right to judge what standards of skill and knowledge an Iaido "Black Belt" should be held to.

However, it kinda sounds like you're asking about standards of behavior, etiquette, and certain less tangible aspects outside of demonstrated proficiency within the given system. Some schools/systems require a Background check similar to what is required by "public" organizations (such as a local Park & Rec. program). Some require Community Service hours or a Community Service Project. It's quite common to require some sort of written Theme paper, subject relevant to the candidate's art.

Personally, when I look at some other system's "Black Belt," I, quite literally, expect NOTHING. I've seen too many "Black Belts" who were incompetent at what I think they should know of their own martial art, incapable of "fighting" on any level, and just plain poor representations of humanity. If they evidence something greater than that then I am pleasantly surprised but I still muse "evaluate" them based upon my own standards for my own purposes. I don't question whether or not they have earned or deserve the right to wear a Black Belt from within their own system. I expect them to do the same of me as well.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[J W]

I agree with lklawson. All schools define what a black belt or any other rank means for them. There is no consistency between schools, nor should there be any expectation that there will be. You can't place expectations on a black belt outside of the school/system where that rank is actually being used to represent something.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

After a fairly long discussion on belt progress, I thought about something that came up during the exchanges.

The idea that a black belt represents proficiency in the art is fairly accepted by most of us when discussing the topic, but what are the expectations of a black belt or equivalent (not all arts use belts) outside of just proficiency in the art within the school?

And how do those expectations factor into promotions prior to the black belt and a student's candidacy for the rank?

Specific requirements of course will vary from art to art. But I think a generally acceptable expectation is that they have developed a very good working knowledge of whatever the material is up to that point. I would not say that 'mastering' the material is necessary, but one should be able to look at them from another art and (if the arts are similar enough) see a level of performance/skill demonstrated. Although not everyone is inclined to teach, or has that talent, they should also, at least, be able to explain the concepts of the art, the goals and to demonstrate these to someone.

Speaking only for our school, I would not promote a person to the level of a BB if I would not feel comfortable with them as my back up. This isn't just physical skill or experience but also maturity, wisdom and restraint. I believe those are also, imo, traits of someone reaching a Dan level. Obviously, not everyone is qualified physically (skill) or emotionally (maturity, wisdom, restraint). Sometimes these things can be gained with time and training. And time and training should be the only justifiers of whether or not one reaches BB level. Certainly a financial incentive should have nothing to do with it.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I'm not sure what you're asking. Every art/instructor defines their own art and their own grading system so, in that sense, no one but practitioners from within that system and affiliated schools can "expect" anything. It's not their business what one instructor, outside of their affiliation, decides his standards are. A Taekyon student doesn't have the right to judge what standards of skill and knowledge an Iaido "Black Belt" should be held to.

Not that kind of discussion.

However, it kinda sounds like you're asking about standards of behavior, etiquette, and certain less tangible aspects outside of demonstrated proficiency within the given system. Some schools/systems require a Background check similar to what is required by "public" organizations (such as a local Park & Rec. program). Some require Community Service hours or a Community Service Project. It's quite common to require some sort of written Theme paper, subject relevant to the candidate's art.

Along those lines, though I specified within the school, so I was looking at it in the small picture rather than the big picture.

Personally, when I look at some other system's "Black Belt," I, quite literally, expect NOTHING. I've seen too many "Black Belts" who were incompetent at what I think they should know of their own martial art, incapable of "fighting" on any level, and just plain poor representations of humanity. If they evidence something greater than that then I am pleasantly surprised but I still muse "evaluate" them based upon my own standards for my own purposes. I don't question whether or not they have earned or deserve the right to wear a Black Belt from within their own system. I expect them to do the same of me as well.

All fine and good, but in your school, you do expect something from a free scholar, which is the first rank milestone in your system (based on previous posts of yours).

If a student has been a scholar for seven years or so and wants to move to being a free scholar, there are expectations, both within the system and at your particular salle, of what one must do to be awarded the rank of free scholar. An instructor in your system has criterion as to what is expected of a scholar prior to them becoming a free scholar.

I teach kendo independently, so I speak only for my own studio and not of the FIK, AUSKF, or ZNKR. I expect students who are nearing the shodan level to be able to do the following:

• Know and understand the Bokuto ni yoru kendo kihon-waza keiko-ho
• Know and undertand the Nihon kendo kata from ipponme through sanbonme.
• Know and understand the different waza.
• Know the terminology and be able to follow along in class without needing the Japanese terms constantly translated.
• Be able to be a partner for other students in keiko and kata.
• Be able to answer basic questions that a junior student might ask, such as, 'what is nuki waza?'
• Be able to guide a junior student when working with them in a drill.
• Set an example as a senior student by maintaining their kendogi, bogu, and shinai in good working order.
• Set an example as a senior student by maintaining decorum and observing etiquette.
• Be able to participate in shiai so as to improve themselves and their technique and not just to beat their opponent.
• To know and understand the purpose of kendo.
• To know and understand the virtues of kendo as represented in the pleats of the hakama.

Proficiency and ability aside, those are the things that I expect of a student who is ready to challenge shodan.

A student who can spar the pants off of anyone but doesn't know the purpose of kendo (I make that information readily available and discuss it relatively frequently) is not ready for shodan.
A student who asks, "what does that mean?" about the same terms over and over is not ready for shodan.
A student who does not take correction or who constantly makes excuses for inability to perform techniques correctly is not ready for shodan.
A student who cannot be a partner to a junior student in kata or keiko due to not knowing the kata or waza themselves cannot grade for ikkyu or shodan.

None of the above is related to hard work or specific levels of proficiency, but it is related to the expecations that I as the instructor have.

I also teach hapkido and am affiliated with the World Hapkido Association. I have similar expectations in that art as well.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I agree with lklawson. All schools define what a black belt or any other rank means for them. There is no consistency between schools, nor should there be any expectation that there will be. You can't place expectations on a black belt outside of the school/system where that rank is actually being used to represent something.

Okay, but what is expected of someone, aside from just proficiency, in your school?

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Specific requirements of course will vary from art to art. But I think a generally acceptable expectation is that they have developed a very good working knowledge of whatever the material is up to that point. I would not say that 'mastering' the material is necessary, but one should be able to look at them from another art and (if the arts are similar enough) see a level of performance/skill demonstrated. Although not everyone is inclined to teach, or has that talent, they should also, at least, be able to explain the concepts of the art, the goals and to demonstrate these to someone.

Agreed.

Speaking only for our school, I would not promote a person to the level of a BB if I would not feel comfortable with them as my back up. This isn't just physical skill or experience but also maturity, wisdom and restraint. I believe those are also, imo, traits of someone reaching a Dan level. Obviously, not everyone is qualified physically (skill) or emotionally (maturity, wisdom, restraint). Sometimes these things can be gained with time and training. And time and training should be the only justifiers of whether or not one reaches BB level. Certainly a financial incentive should have nothing to do with it.

The bolded part; when I said "within the school," that is what I was getting at. And your explanation is what I was looking for; the expectations that exist within a specific school that are outside of just training. Thank you.

 

[lklawson]

Not that kind of discussion.

Along those lines, though I specified within the school, so I was looking at it in the small picture rather than the big picture.

OK.

All fine and good, but in your school, you do expect something from a free scholar, which is the first rank milestone in your system (based on previous posts of yours).

Actually when I grade in Bowie Knife, I use Bronze, Silver, and Gold gradings. The Bowie Knife material we study is primarily 19th Century and early 20th Century material. During that period the Guild style and Academia style rankings were not typically used in martial arts grading systems (except sometimes "Professor," which was often applied to boxing instructors). The common grading system in use then was the Fencing ranking system, still in use today. I wanted to avoid using that system specifically because it is in use by modern Fencers and Historic Fencing teachers alike and are fairly unique to those two. Using that system of grade designation ("Maestro," &tc.) when teaching a blade art (Bowie Knife) could cause confusion about what skills are being represented, cause confusion about what grade I may or may not hold in other Western systems, and even potentially cause discord with existing Maestros who know that I did not come up through a similar system as they and am not ranked by any Fencing Master. It could, additionally, cause the system that I study and promote, as well as myself and my students, to come under disrepute as well as damage the reputation of the entire area of study even for those not affiliated with me.

Thus it seemed best to me to use some other system. In modern knife systems, it's common to use "Expert, Level x" and similar. I'm ranked that way myself. However, after literally years of dodging the issue of ranks/grades entirely, I finally settled on Bronze-Gold. If I say that so-n-so is graded at Bronze level, everyone in the whole world, even non-English speakers, know that this represents the first level of grading as well as expecting it to be a significant achievement and they, equally know that at least two more gradings exist beyond that. It's striking in it's universality and simplicity.

If a student has been a scholar for seven years or so and wants to move to being a free scholar, there are expectations, both within the system and at your particular salle, of what one must do to be awarded the rank of free scholar. An instructor in your system has criterion as to what is expected of a scholar prior to them becoming a free scholar.

I don't actually use a specifically set "minimum time in grade" as part of the grading process. I guess that there is some sort, but it's a rather ephemeral thing for us. I spent well over a decade ignoring the whole thing. But you're right that I have a specific "grading syllabus" that I expect them to know. I also expect a certain level of performance when sparring. Sort of along the BJJ/Judo lines of "you must be able to 'hang with' those of the same level."

I teach kendo independently, so I speak only for my own studio and not of the FIK, AUSKF, or ZNKR. I expect students who are nearing the shodan level to be able to do the following:

• Know and understand the Bokuto ni yoru kendo kihon-waza keiko-ho
• Know and undertand the Nihon kendo kata from ipponme through sanbonme.
• Know and understand the different waza.
• Know the terminology and be able to follow along in class without needing the Japanese terms constantly translated.
• Be able to be a partner for other students in keiko and kata.
• Be able to answer basic questions that a junior student might ask, such as, 'what is nuki waza?'
• Be able to guide a junior student when working with them in a drill.
• Set an example as a senior student by maintaining their kendogi, bogu, and shinai in good working order.
• Set an example as a senior student by maintaining decorum and observing etiquette.
• Be able to participate in shiai so as to improve themselves and their technique and not just to beat their opponent.
• To know and understand the purpose of kendo.
• To know and understand the virtues of kendo as represented in the pleats of the hakama.

Proficiency and ability aside, those are the things that I expect of a student who is ready to challenge shodan.

A student who can spar the pants off of anyone but doesn't know the purpose of kendo (I make that information readily available and discuss it relatively frequently) is not ready for shodan.
A student who asks, "what does that mean?" about the same terms over and over is not ready for shodan.
A student who does not take correction or who constantly makes excuses for inability to perform techniques correctly is not ready for shodan.
A student who cannot be a partner to a junior student in kata or keiko due to not knowing the kata or waza themselves cannot grade for ikkyu or shodan.

None of the above is related to hard work or specific levels of proficiency, but it is related to the expecations that I as the instructor have.

To be honest, I really associate all of those with "demonstrated proficiency within the given system."

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

To be honest, I really associate all of those with "demonstrated proficiency within the given system."

I agree, but at the same time, those are the things that I specifically am looking at as the head of my own school. To clarify, for the purposes of this thread the expectations can apply in the greater system, but I am looking to view it more in light of the student/teacher relationship than the student/system relationship.

 

[James Kovacich]

Specific requirements of course will vary from art to art. But I think a generally acceptable expectation is that they have developed a very good working knowledge of whatever the material is up to that point. I would not say that 'mastering' the material is necessary, but one should be able to look at them from another art and (if the arts are similar enough) see a level of performance/skill demonstrated. Although not everyone is inclined to teach, or has that talent, they should also, at least, be able to explain the concepts of the art, the goals and to demonstrate these to someone.

Speaking only for our school, I would not promote a person to the level of a BB if I would not feel comfortable with them as my back up. This isn't just physical skill or experience but also maturity, wisdom and restraint. I believe those are also, imo, traits of someone reaching a Dan level. Obviously, not everyone is qualified physically (skill) or emotionally (maturity, wisdom, restraint). Sometimes these things can be gained with time and training. And time and training should be the only justifiers of whether or not one reaches BB level. Certainly a financial incentive should have nothing to do with it.

We are on the same page my friend!

 

[RTKDCMB]

I can not comment on what other schools expect but I can say some of the things that I would expect from a first degree within the art I study, in no particular order.

To be emotionally mature.
To have a good attitude.
Be willing and capable to help lower ranked students when needed.
To be able to spar effectively with the adult students (not be too passive, keep hands up,even when tired, good defence, good range of techniques, good distancing etc).
To have good technique.
To be able to perform the adult breaking techniques at their grading, for example have their side kick or turning kick powerful and accurate enough to be able to break 2 3/4" pine boards.
Be able to remember all of their patterns and perform them with good technique, speed and power.
Have a good range of 1 and 3 step sparring techniques and combinations.
To have good control.
To be reasonably able to defend themselves in a real situation.
To set a good example to the other students and positively represent the art as a whole.