UFC 193

[JowGaWolf]

I don't think a quick return to fighting after suffering a defeat like that (arguably for the first time), is a good idea. She has some soul searching to do after last weekend because not only did the better opponent on the night win, her self belief in her striking ability, the fight strategy and preparation was wrong. That means what she was being told by her team was incorrect and therefore it seems like some changes need to be made

I personally wouldn't and don't. When someone gets the best of me it's time to give training and strategy some real heavy thought. I bury myself in many hours of video analysis no so much to see what I was doing wrong but to better understand my opponent and why my strategy didn't work. I looked for missed opportunities and ask myself why I didn't see or why I was unaware of the opportunity.

A one size fits all fight strategy is rarely possible. The what if's have to be accounted for and there needs to be more than one plan of attack. Questions like, "What is the plan if I can't close the gap without eating heavy punches" should always have an viable answer or at a minimum a process that will allow an answer to be found during battle. Rousey would have given herself some analytical time if she didn't press so much. She also has to learn how to kick. If her kicking ability is so terrible then they will need to figure something out. Legs often have a longer reach than the opponents arms and from what I saw in the video there were lots of opportunities to throw some low kicks to the back of the leg. Knot up the calf muscle and the opponent will move less.

 

[drop bear]

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As a businessman.... Jackson is the BEST in MMA. But then he's lauded as being Mr, Nice Guy for everyone.... I've seen the same BS in my current karate org.... Promotion of the top echelon is rampant over the students. The great character trait about Ja Gow is that he readily fesses up to his ego.... that's someone prospective students should value.....


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Well thanks for the input.... I really don't follow Jackson closely.... I'm a traditional karate guy who Greg Jackson wouldn't want a guest appearance from me... The way to outstrike Holly Holm or Jon Jones is traditional karate... the kind I have posted on. Ja Gow might give them a run for the money....
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I have literally shocked the so-called tough guys at my current dojo; as well as elsewhere.... But with all the 'disagrees' and 'dislikes' I get like here; who is willing to train to traditional karate standards...???
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In closing, Jackson DOES run the best MMA coaching business... With only Holly Holm & Jone Jones in the gym though, his income statement would be pretty bleak with out the regulars.... My dojo same commercial realization....

I am sure he is open to the concept. We have karate guys make guest apearances in our gym from time to time.

I think you shoud go train at jacksons gym. You have a method that is too good to not be shared

 

[paitingman]

I think this fight was just very well prepared for and executed by Holm.

They knew there were holes in Ronda's game that they could exploit.

1. the main one being:
She has shown little to no WRESTLING skills.
her judo is world class, but her ability to fight for position outside of clinching and grip fighting is pretty absent.
you never see her execute leg takedowns or shoot. something that could've been a big help when getting
outboxed.

Holm knew she had the superior footwork and striking, and clearly Ronda and her camp thought she could compete with her in those areas, but no.

Rousey is an amazing athlete and should branch out and be exposed to more MMA focused coaching and really working on showcasing some wrestling skills

 

[Dinkydoo]

I personally wouldn't and don't. When someone gets the best of me it's time to give training and strategy some real heavy thought. I bury myself in many hours of video analysis no so much to see what I was doing wrong but to better understand my opponent and why my strategy didn't work. I looked for missed opportunities and ask myself why I didn't see or why I was unaware of the opportunity.

This is similar to my approach, although I usually don't have the video evidence to look back over I try to examine why I struggled to get inside, I was hit hard there AGAIN and what techniques I just wasn't getting off. I then try to incorporate solo drills into my training plan to remedy these issues before getting involved in heavy sparring again.

A one size fits all fight strategy is rarely possible. The what if's have to be accounted for and there needs to be more than one plan of attack. Questions like, "What is the plan if I can't close the gap without eating heavy punches" should always have an viable answer or at a minimum a process that will allow an answer to be found during battle. Rousey would have given herself some analytical time if she didn't press so much. She also has to learn how to kick. If her kicking ability is so terrible then they will need to figure something out. Legs often have a longer reach than the opponents arms and from what I saw in the video there were lots of opportunities to throw some low kicks to the back of the leg. Knot up the calf muscle and the opponent will move less.

Funnily enough my MMA coach mentioned Rousey might have had more luck attacking the legs too, but from a takedown perspective rather than low kicking. Unfortunately for RR she either didn't prepare any other strategies or she was waiting for the nod from her head coach to change things up, which didn't happen.

I hope we see her fight in the UFC again. I had a feeling that she might retire if she'd beaten Holms at the weekend and go fulltime into movies or WWE. Maybe the nature of this defeat will influence her decision one way or the other.

 

[ShotoNoob]

That's true. But I do have a specific person that I'm targeted. Not in a bad way. He trains at a Sanda school and they say he's really fast. I want to see just how fast he is.

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We are really on the same wavelength.... My feeling was that stepping into the shoes (proverbially speaking) as a sparring partner... now this WAS the time to do a little reality testing.... I think you felt the same way....
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HEY. Rather that listen to me pontificate here about generalized thoughts.... Why don't you and Tony D., for instance, start a thread on Ronda Rousey's fortunes post-UFC 193. Namely, what would be your & Tony's tactical breakdowns of specifically where HOnda should take her UFC competition strategy. Mull it over....

 

[ShotoNoob]

Ronda's coach did not prepare her for Holm. Not one little bit. Ronda showed no clue in how to cut down the ring or move her head off center line. The only thing she did well was block with her face.

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This is where you east coast guys fall off the wagon.... Why wait 'til the hidden tiger (Holm), to prepare? And on your last sentence.... that's typical for MMA competitors.... [the smiley isn't for you... it's for the MMA conventions we see in the UFC, etc.]
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YOu guys have gone on & on when I criticized the Tarverdyan method (focus mitts, etc.) .... which you all said was standard striking training.... works inthe 'real' world you all said.... unlike kihon karate.... Ya'll said you used the focus pad approach... which has been universally accepted in boxing, karate and so on & so on....

 

[ShotoNoob]

Your statement about training hard is what got me the most because we see it on a non professional level where good people train hard in low quality schools or in fake martial arts. Hard training is useless without correct training.

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RE: Just what's being said about Honda & Coach Tarverdyan re the Holm Championship bout....

 

[ShotoNoob]

Rousey is an amazing athlete and should branch out and be exposed to more MMA focused coaching and really working on showcasing some wrestling skills

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The cross training in wrestling is always one for consideration. Especially since the venue is MMA. That could be developed...
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Why not, though, do Judo the way traditional sets out, requires? A skilled judoka should be able to penetrate Holm's footwork. The whole per-requisite for enacting a Judo throw is to be able to enter. Again, I got pounded by youse guys about the issue of how keeping the Gracie's, the skilled BJJ players @ bay - was nigh impossible.... how i was a fool & a troll.
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Now, we see really good boxing tactics destroy a 'world class' judoka... in your words... Ya'll got caught in your own trap of contradicting yourselves by posting conversationally. Ronda, a world class grappler - destroyed by a (ugh) striker. Told you I had mental discipline....
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Remember the Matt Bryers / BJJ discussions when I was relatively new here @ MT?

 

[ShotoNoob]

The interest here @ Martial Talk is about appealing to a variety of styles... I understand. I find it both puzzling & irritating though... that there is this tenancy to categorize Judo as insufficient to address a skilled striker.... when BJJ (a relatively new martial phenomena) is literally blasted as the answer to self defense against strikers.... we have a number of loyal BJJ practitioners here... I know.
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Why is BJJ so problematic for strikers... when Judo is now labeled ineffective in ability to clinch or for grip fighting (as paitingman says)?

 

[ShotoNoob]

Here's UFC 192 Open Workout preview.

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Here's Honda in her demo.

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Looks like decent MMA striking to me... what Honda is doing. Looks precisely in line with what all the other UFC superstars are doing.... and what ya'll affirmed when I signed on....
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Note Honda hits hard... something Holm has been criticized about... no real power in strikes... particularly hands.... though some highlight reel KOs Holm has shown.
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Now here is Shotonoob in female form (so apropos) training 1-step kumite to beat either Honda or Holm... My Kaitlynn Jenner transformation -ha ha...ha.

Yep boys, that's how it's done (in principle). Ya'll have panned & banned this kind of kumite training from BJJ ,whatever you-all do, MMA... the MMA world outright rejects it too.... see the YT vids (above) of UFC Greats doing what they do.
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So what's the gameplan on striking for Honda / Holm rematch? Honda has a minimum of 6 months.... likely a year or more... for you guys to get her act together... now that ya''ll have fired dear Edmond... poor Edmund,,, he's now in with Shotonoob.... in the garbage can....
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Postnote: Hey, see Hendricks doing the boxing version of kata. Shadowboxing = kata, ya know....

 

[ShotoNoob]

Questions, questions, questions... fodder for a new strategy for Honda thead....
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Bye & bye... Ronda striking form is better in her demos compared to what she actually performs in large in the Octagon. Proper 1-step kumite would take the demo-highlight Honda out in seconds... not 6 minutes like Holm did so spectacularly... That's the power of traditional karate. But too hard to do... to hard to train....
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So it's up to you'se guys now....

 

[Tez3]

I understand. I find it both puzzling & irritating though... that there is this tenancy to categorize Judo as insufficient to address a skilled striker.... )

I didn't realise we'd moved into discussing renting houses and apartments?

Shotonoob, I'm afraid you're ranting and not a lot of it makes sense, either in the writing of it or the having a go at the posters on here. I've seen a lot of stuff about Rousey posted up and none of them call her 'Honda', why not just give her the courtesy of using her given name.
One step 'kumite'? nonsense. Just as a matter of interest how many pro MMA fighters have you trained or even amateur fighters or any fighters in anything?

 

[JowGaWolf]

Here's UFC 192 Open Workout preview.

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Here's Honda in her demo.

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Looks like decent MMA striking to me... what Honda is doing. Looks precisely in line with what all the other UFC superstars are doing.... and what ya'll affirmed when I signed on....
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Note Honda hits hard... something Holm has been criticized about... no real power in strikes... particularly hands.... though some highlight reel KOs Holm has shown.
\
Now here is Shotonoob in female form (so apropos) training 1-step kumite to beat either Honda or Holm... My Kaitlynn Jenner transformation -ha ha...ha.

Yep boys, that's how it's done (in principle). Ya'll have panned & banned this kind of kumite training from BJJ ,whatever you-all do, MMA... the MMA world outright rejects it too.... see the YT vids (above) of UFC Greats doing what they do.
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So what's the gameplan on striking for Honda / Holm rematch? Honda has a minimum of 6 months.... likely a year or more... for you guys to get her act together... now that ya''ll have fired dear Edmond... poor Edmund,,, he's now in with Shotonoob.... in the garbage can....
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Postnote: Hey, see Hendricks doing the boxing version of kata. Shadowboxing = kata, ya know....

One steps were never meant for fighting with. The only purpose of one steps is to train movement so you don't have to think about what comes next in a real fight. One steps train muscle memory not fighting.

 

[elder999]

One steps were never meant for fighting with. The only purpose of one steps is to train movement so you don't have to think about what comes next in a real fight. One steps train muscle memory not fighting.

Actually, one steps are really about training ma-ai......

 

[JowGaWolf]

Actually, one steps are really about training ma-ai......

I'll take your word on it. The information that I found about ma-ai spoke of distance and timing and I'm not sure how one-steps fit into that since distance and timing are not constant. You may know something that I'm not aware of, so I'll take your word on it.

 

[Tez3]

Dear lord, I wish all the American commentators, fan boys etc etc would stop saying Rousey is bummed! it has us rolling around laughing until we cry. What it means in American is really not what it means elsewhere and puts a whole different complexion on why she'd hiding her face and staying quiet!!

 

[Danny T]

Who is Honda you keep referring to?

As to Ronda's striking skills, they have some power but her fundamentals are not very good. (as many of the grapplers turned strikers).
Ronda has done very well because she pressured and played her game. Grappling.
In this past fight the opponent was able to withstand the pressure with her footwork and distancing control exposing Rhonda's lack of striking defense and timing control. Ronda is a competitor; she will either learn from this, make changes and return better or she will loose again.

 

[Dinkydoo]

Dear lord, I wish all the American commentators, fan boys etc etc would stop saying Rousey is bummed! it has us rolling around laughing until we cry. What it means in American is really not what it means elsewhere and puts a whole different complexion on why she'd hiding her face and staying quiet!!

Oh man, a knockout followed by a bumming!?!?! RR's Saturday night was even worse than I thought

 

[paitingman]

Why is BJJ so problematic for strikers... when Judo is now labeled ineffective in ability to clinch or for grip fighting (as paitingman says)?

you should read my post again. i think you misunderstood me. what I said was clinching and grip fighting are where her judo shines most...
and OUTSIDE of those two areas (clinching/grip fighting) her ability to fight for position hasn't been shown to be too effective.

 

[Hanzou]

Who is Honda you keep referring to?

As to Ronda's striking skills, they have some power but her fundamentals are not very good. (as many of the grapplers turned strikers).
Ronda has done very well because she pressured and played her game. Grappling.
In this past fight the opponent was able to withstand the pressure with her footwork and distancing control exposing Rhonda's lack of striking defense and timing control. Ronda is a competitor; she will either learn from this, make changes and return better or she will loose again.

Hopefully she fires her boxing coach.