Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
No I was on my back and he had complete control so I stopped my attempt at escape and tapped repeatedly. He waited about three seconds.
Tried BJJ for the first time last night…….
- Thread starter Yokozuna514
- Start date
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
Are you engaging in victim blaming? That might hurt my sensitive feelers.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Just checking.
I can't make this random blue belt stop neck cranking you. I might be able to stop him wanting to.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
Not quite that. He was up on me higher and more parallel with more weight on my chest. Yes it’s not comfortable under there.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
I might not have the right language yet, but yes it was a combination of me failing to escape and getting my head turned backwards while being crushed under a thick 240 lbs blue gi. If that is top pressure then yes. His position was different. he is 6’3” and 242 lbs. he told me. I’m 6’2” 210lbs. Thing is nobody was telling me what to do or not do. Is that normal? Same when I was with a white belt later. He just laid the guard and I tried to pass it which wasn’t too hard but nobody said do this or that. The blue belt had me start in the guard which he immediately passed and folded me as previously described.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
It is normal to not give instruction while rolling especially with lower belts.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Just kinda sucks to know you’ve got someone in the school you need to avoid. Territorial dominance, toxic masculinity. That can poison a training environment.
So was it an actual neck crank or was it just heavy shoulder pressure from side control? Either way he should have let go immediately once you tapped, but if it was the second he might not have realized you were tapping right away because he wasn’t deliberately applying a submission and so wasn’t expecting the tap.
If it was an honest mistake because he wasn’t expecting the tap, I would just give him feedback to let him know that he held it too long. In that case the correct response from him would be an apology and an attempt to do better in the future.
if he realized you were tapping but didn’t release immediately because he thought you shouldn’t be tapping to top pressure (or for any other reason) then you should avoid rolling with him in the future and observe carefully to make sure there aren’t any other red flags in the school.
If he was actually applying a neck crank, then it’s kind of a double-dick move. The tap should always be respected (especially for neck attacks), but also he shouldn’t be neck-cranking white belts In the first place.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
It’s not something I would tolerate in my class but hey I’m the beginner there. I can accept some hazing, I’m not trippin if they don’t actually injure me. My concern is that the instructor may not come to the rescue if I’m tapping and someone doesn’t release. I don’t want to wake up with pee pee pants.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Well, you can evaluate for yourself the level of danger here, I am sure. I guess I simply find myself unable to tolerate hazing, especially when it involves something dangerous like that. It simply shows, in my opinion, an inability to trust them with your safety. If I have to be hazed, particularly in that manner, then I won’t be in the club. That’s just me.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
It isn’t really hazing. (Sort of. I mean mabye it is. But it may not have been)
BJJ is hard for a reason. And that reason is to develop resilience. So you really should try not to tap to top pressure.
(There are other social dynamics. Like if he went full noise when he was on top. But tapping when he wound up on the bottom. That is pretty disrespectful)
When people say it's the individual. This is what they miss. The hard process that created that individual.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
I’m ok to a point. That point is actual or intentional injury. I’m quite willing to yield my ego to learn something.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
Thats a chicken and egg parable. Either way, I am willing. I tapped because I didn’t have answer for my position. I thought that was the correct thing to do, am I incorrect? I mean, it felt like continuing wasn’t really in my best interest.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
By the way. Feel free to talk to the guy. A lot of these things are unspoken agreements that you may not know.
The downside of this resilience building is they are not going to tell you. They are just going to put it back on you if you put it on them.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
No. It was technically incorrect. I have sat under fatties for entire rounds. It is a very useful skill in BJJ.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
Oh I did, I thanked him for the lesson, and asked that he be more gentle with my neck In future. Its all good man, I doubt he is out to kill me. I’m not that worried about it. They teach Muay thai and Kung fu San Soo there too. I’ve been to the Kung fu class a couple times, it’s nothing even resembling what or how I teach. I’m going to check out the Muay Thai class at some point.
Wing Woo Gar
Senior Master
Ok, thank you. Good to know. He was shoving my neck backwards and increasing pressure so I thought submission was best rather than risk injury.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Yeah there is a subtle difference between a neck crank and a cross face. So a tap in that case is probably advisable when you start.
