The Kenponet

[Guiseppe Betri]

What in the world is happening with the Kenponet? I use to post there regularly, but I haven't done so in months. I guess I don't want to be a part of what is now taking place. I still read whats posted but I just don't want my name on that forum anymore. Any ideas to get that board returned to the positive?

 

[Kirk]

Josh needs to give mod capabilities to someone else on the
board. The 2 of them aren't able to be on board, and sometimes
negative posts run their course before being deleted.

 

[MJS]

Whats happening is that some of us are simply trying to show people that there are holes in some of the things in Kenpo. By taking off, rather than reading the posts, is doing nothing more than keeping the blinders on. You want to take off a negative post? The post isn't negative, it's simply stating a fact..a fact that some people dont want to listne to because they already think that they know everything. I'm not saying that I do, but considering I've trained for 17 yrs, reached 3rd degree black, and have had the chance to train in other arts, I have noticed the gaps and improvements that need to be made.

MS

 

[rmcrobertson]

I think, actually, that the "negative," means the repeated sarcastic attacks on folks like Mr. Tatum, the repeated personal insults (calling people, "homos," now seems to be in vogue), the mean-spirited anonymous posting, etc.

There is nothing to be done about it, other than to note that it is a real pity that so many people studying martial arts have gotten by without learning respect, courtesy, or even basic good manners.

Fortunately, these sorts of folks have very short attention spans.

 

[MJS]

Originally posted by rmcrobertson
I think, actually, that the "negative," means the repeated sarcastic attacks on folks like Mr. Tatum, the repeated personal insults (calling people, "homos," now seems to be in vogue), the mean-spirited anonymous posting, etc.

There is nothing to be done about it, other than to note that it is a real pity that so many people studying martial arts have gotten by without learning respect, courtesy, or even basic good manners.

Fortunately, these sorts of folks have very short attention spans.

Well, here it is once again....Putting words into other peoples mouths!! I, and I'm only speaking for myself, have never called anyone any bad names. The only thing I'm guilty of is saying that some people are VERY closed minded and not willing to look outside of their little world. I have met Mr. Tatum when he was in CT. conducting a seminar, and was very impressed by his skill. I'm not saying he is a bad MA, so stop saying it! I'm saying that Kenpo is not the perfect art. It does not address the various combat aspects as in depth as other styles, and am only trying to show people the gaps, only as to hope that maybe they will too.

MS

 

[rmcrobertson]

Oh, for cryin' out loud.

Mike, I DID NOT MEAN YOU. I WAS NOT REFERRING TO POSTS ABOUT ACTUAL ISSUES IN KENPO. I was trying to explain that Kirk was simply referring to the recent flood of anonymous personal insults.

That is all I meant.

If I inadvertently somehow gave offense, my apologies, but I'm having a hard time seeing how what I wrote could have referred to your perfectly-legitimate ideas about kenpo.

 

[Touch Of Death]

MJS,
Chill out. Robert was only trying to point out that your opinions about Kenpo are not the problem; its the personal attacks and threats on the Kenpo net that are the problem. Yes the Mod may erease somthing based on his bias that cause the name calling and threats in the first place, but thats life... deal with it. This isnt junior high. I'm not saying you were the one that did it but Robert was only clarifying, not misinterpreting.

 

[MJS]

Originally posted by rmcrobertson
Oh, for cryin' out loud.

Mike, I DID NOT MEAN YOU. I WAS NOT REFERRING TO POSTS ABOUT ACTUAL ISSUES IN KENPO. I was trying to explain that Kirk was simply referring to the recent flood of anonymous personal insults.

That is all I meant.

If I inadvertently somehow gave offense, my apologies, but I'm having a hard time seeing how what I wrote could have referred to your perfectly-legitimate ideas about kenpo.

Well, this was not the first time I've had an attack directed to me, so I assumed it was just another one. Sorry if I offended you!

My ideas are not perfect and I NEVER SAID THEY WERE. There is always a better way of doing something. The training ideas that I do to improve my Kenpo are based solely on my own experiences, therefore I cant speak for everybody. I'm just offering a suggestion on ways to make an improvement to an art, that according to some people, think its perfect!

MS

 

[Guiseppe Betri]

I have noticed the several posts that are so negative, or derogatory in nature. But why is there so much of it? One thing is said and several people jump up to respond and defend what the person that was attacked. Why? I also read about someone calling someone a "homo." But I guess I was a little concerned because this other person asked what he/she was wearing. That was by "Dougie" I think, and that was most certainly out of line. I think there are several people on that specific forum that need to grow up and knock it off. Robert, I don't know you, you seem to have a good head on your shoulders, but you have fueled the fire a bit yourself. No?

 

[rmcrobertson]

No, actually.

Do I argue? yes.
Do I present my view and stick to it? yes.
Do I try and remain polite? yes.
Do I ever screw up? yes.
Do I sometimes hang on to a point after it's clearly hopeless? yes.
Do I call people names and post anonymously? no.
Do I understand--and accept, and respect--that other folks think differently, believe differently, experience differently? sure.

Others can answer those questions for themelves, I guess.

 

[Guiseppe Betri]

Easy howlie. Thats just the way I see it at times I guess. I'm just having a problem with the endless bickering that occurs constantly. By the way Robert what do you do? I'm a management consultant for TC Industries a smaller business located just outside of Minneapolis, MN.

 

[pineapple head]

I cannot even access the forum and i have never had a negative post on there.
Poor old me!!!! :asian:

 

[Dun Ringill]

I think the first thing that one has to look at in determining the validity of the kenponet or any message board is that these forums are not subsitutes for martial arts training, half the time they barely pass for supplements. I've been watching the kenponet and for the past year it has pretty much gone downhill. If you look at the first page of posts you will see a pretty good list of names posting about serious kenpo subjects. Ron Chapel, Sigung Labounty, Bob White, Larry Tatum, Dennis Conaster, etc. and then as time marches on new posters come in and immediately clique up and either support one another posts or get together and launch disrespectful assaults on seniors and people who are trying to take the board seriously. An example of one of these cliques is Wes Idol, clyde t. o'briant, and Billy lear, i've studied and watched them act rude and disrespectful towards people who have 20 years on them in the art. One of those three has been banned from martial talk. This is just one example. Lately there have been some attacks on Larry Tatum and now Mike Pick. Who cares? The more defensive people get over whether or not either of these gentlemen is gay the more I tend to believe that there might be a kernel of truth about it. I think the funny thing is that Wes Idol is screaming for a deletion of the posts when he principally did the same thing not to long ago to Ron Chapel by questioning whether or not he was a real 10th degree. The really funny thing about it this whole kenponet situation is that it is probably a 12 year old purple-belt writing these things and because everybody is getting upset and responding and getting angry he is going to write some more. I think he probably is laughing at me right now because I spent this much time with a written response about it anyway. Oh well...

Oss

Dun Ringill

 

[rmcrobertson]

"The more defensive people get over whether or not either of these gentlemen is gay the more I tend to believe that there might be a kernel of truth about it."

Well, that's the kind of talk that should help.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Originally posted by Dun Ringill
An example of one of these cliques is Wes Idol, clyde t. o'briant, and Billy lear, i've studied and watched them act rude and disrespectful towards people who have 20 years on them in the art. One of those three has been banned from martial talk.

Just a note:
None of those 3 have been banned from MartialTalk. Mr. Lear left of his own accord.

:asian:

 

[Dave Simmons]

Generally speaking I do not post much on Kenponet. I have noticed recently, the last six months or so, the broad base of Kenpo respondents do not represent anything other than only a few. I don't like sexual preference issues because it's personal to say the least!

Unfortunately, what has happened is everything is clique oriented. Very few non EPAK or non AK people will waste the energy to post any longer. Heaven knows I have "ruffled a few feathers" but it brought about discussion and opinion.

It's sad to see Kenponet with these problems.

Dave Simmons
Twin Dragon Kenpo Karate
www.mnkenpo.com

 

[Kirk]

Originally posted by rmcrobertson
I think, actually, that the "negative," means the repeated sarcastic attacks on folks like Mr. Tatum, the repeated personal insults (calling people, "homos," now seems to be in vogue), the mean-spirited anonymous posting, etc.

There is nothing to be done about it, other than to note that it is a real pity that so many people studying martial arts have gotten by without learning respect, courtesy, or even basic good manners.

Fortunately, these sorts of folks have very short attention spans.

That's exactly what I meant, thank you.

 

[Fastmover]

The problem I have with the Kenponet is the anonymous posters.
It does get out of control. Still I would not become upset about attacks toward anyone in particular including Mr. Tatum or any one else. He is just the target of the day and soon it will be someone else. If Mr Tatum were not upseting someone then it would be time to be worried. The quickest way to fail is to pleaze everyone. Otherwise Id say we were all just a bunch of "homers" cheering for the home team!! Me included!!!

Be Good

John

 

[Wes Idol]

Originally posted by Dun Ringill
I think the funny thing is that Wes Idol is screaming for a deletion of the posts when he principally did the same thing not to long ago to Ron Chapel by questioning whether or not he was a real 10th degree.

Clarifying the reality of someone's rank and history is quite a bit different than someone posting sexually inapropriate comments on a public forum.

WI, HI
UKS

 

[Dun Ringill]

Both are disrespectful and both shouldn't be conducted in a public forum. It would have been different if either of these seniors got on the forum and attacked people but they didn't. Ron Chapel was answering history questions about his 40 some odd years in the art and Mike Pick and Larry Tatum didn't really post at all. There is only a slight difference in calling Larry Tatum and MIke PIck "homos" and calling Ron Chapel and illigitamate 10th degree. Both of them produced the same results--the seniors are refusing to post on the kenponet because of the actions of the younger generations of Kenpoists. What did you think you were going to solve by questioning someone's rank on something ilke the kenponet? Just like what did those people that were making fun of Larry Tatum's wife (the jillybean comment) think they were going to accomplish? A divorce for Larry Tatum or Ron Chapel giving his rank to you to hold until you felt he deserved it? I guess it's something to think about for the future if these message boards ever want any of the seniors to come back under their real names and post.

Salute