The Geriatric's Right To Die?

[Bill Mattocks]

And while you gave a good overlook as to the how, you still did not give a good reason for 'why' it has a stigma.

Because that's what many Christians believe. I don't, and I won't be put in the position of trying to defend something I don't believe in; but I recognize that it exists. Sorry, if you want to fight over it, go find someone who believes that stuff; I don't.

 

[granfire]

Because that's what many Christians believe. I don't, and I won't be put in the position of trying to defend something I don't believe in; but I recognize that it exists. Sorry, if you want to fight over it, go find someone who believes that stuff; I don't.

Not fighting.
Discussing
Picking your brain

 

[cdunn]

And while you gave a good overlook as to the how, you still did not give a good reason for 'why' it has a stigma.

I suppose it's in the 'be fruitful and multiply' when a small band of people crossed inhospitable terrain in search of a home...but 6 1/2 billion people later?

Funny thing is... There's not much actually in the Christian holy texts one way or the other - other than a couple people effectively committing suicide during some of the old testament stories. There is a tradition, though. However, I expect that one could follow this logic: Your life does NOT belong to you, it belongs to God. Only He can bring you in, only He can take you out, and only He can punish or reward you in this life or a theoretical next.

Socialogically, I wouldn't be surprised much to see RP be close to right. It's a defense mechanism against population depletion, if nothing else at all.

 

[WC_lun]

Living wills are strongly encouraged by hospitals here. Though a patient's family can override the patient's wishes in many cases. Last year I fell into a coma after a anestesiaologist failed to pay attention to what he was doing. Even though I had a living will, my wife's decisions are what the hospital asked for and followed. Fortunately my wife and I had talked about that eventuality and she followed all my wishes. Patients have rights, but too often they are over-ridden when they cannot fight for them personally. The cynic in me says this happens more often when a patient's money or insurance has not run out...though I have no proof of this.

As far as assisted suicide, there is living life and then there is upon occasion suffering through life hour to hour wishing for death. They are not close to being the same. If a person of sound mind decides how they want to die, I feel that should be respected. At some point we should give the same respect and love to our elderley, terminally ill, or those suffering dibilitating pain the same love and rspect we give our pets.

 

[Blade96]

irony tastes nice to a pro lifer who believes everyone has a right to be born but rails against the suffering of that same someone who wants to end it cause 'life is precious'

 

[Tez3]

Suicide was decriminalised here a long while back but aiding a suicide is illegal which is why a lot of people are going to Switzerland to kill themsleves. It should remain illegal and the circumstances of an assisted suicide should always be investigated by the police. This will be upsetting to the relatives in genuine cases when they are already grieving but it's necessary to ensure that the suicide is just that and not a murder. often because assisting a suicide is illegal the person who helped their loved one to die will be charged and taken to court, they are most often given a prison sentence for a few years but it is always suspended so justice is actually done. They took a life but because there are mitigating circumstances and it wasn't murder the sentence is light as the court understands that the person will be suffering enough. If of course its someone who has bumped off a relative for the money or whatever and says it was that relative's wish to die it means that can really be brought to account for what they have done. So suicide legal, assisting not, it's the fairest way to go.

A Rabbi I know told this story ' there was a Rabbi who was collared at a do by a man who was boasting to him and sneering that he had broken every Commandment ( bear in mind we have an awful lot more than Christians!) there was, he was a nasty evil man and when finally he stopped to take a breath the Rabbi very calmly said 'well, you haven't committed every Commandment, there's still one left......'

 

[Dirty Dog]

The sad reality of living wills and DNR orders is that they can be over ridden by your next of kin the minute you become incapable of making your own decisions. I've seen it happen many times.

I belive it is a persons right to decide the quality vs quantity issue. And the laws should be changed to prevent families from reversing decisions patients have already made.

My personal view:
I have cancer. It is incurable. It's slow growing, but the 5 year survival is 50%. 10 year is about 10%. It's metastatic carcinoid. Although it generally starts by the appendix, it has a real affinity for the liver (80%) and the heart (40%). So far, other than recovery time after surgery, it's had very little impact on my quality of life. I still work full time. I still Jeep. I still SCUBA. I still train 60-90 minutes a day at home and 2-3 hours 3 x week at the dojang. But when my quality of life reaches a certain point, I'll have a nice party, tell my family and friends that I love them, and check out.

 

[MA-Caver]

The sad reality of living wills and DNR orders is that they can be over ridden by your next of kin the minute you become incapable of making your own decisions. I've seen it happen many times.

I belive it is a persons right to decide the quality vs quantity issue. And the laws should be changed to prevent families from reversing decisions patients have already made.

My personal view:
I have cancer. It is incurable. It's slow growing, but the 5 year survival is 50%. 10 year is about 10%. It's metastatic carcinoid. Although it generally starts by the appendix, it has a real affinity for the liver (80%) and the heart (40%). So far, other than recovery time after surgery, it's had very little impact on my quality of life. I still work full time. I still Jeep. I still SCUBA. I still train 60-90 minutes a day at home and 2-3 hours 3 x week at the dojang. But when my quality of life reaches a certain point, I'll have a nice party, tell my family and friends that I love them, and check out.

I've a friend who died from cancer (dunno the specific type), he hung on for as long as he could. I got to say goodbye best as I may and within a short while he was gone. Sorry to hear of your present condition. But glad to see your bravery towards it and acknowledge your fate. Hopefully no-one will interfere with your "checking out". Hope you found a way that will be painless and simple, for yourself and your loved ones.