Requiring Patience For The Black Belt And For Rank Advancement In General

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

No you're the one who's wrong because you missed my point, you need to admit you were wrong for missing my point. This is exactly what Im talking about when I say that people miss my points.

People understand your points and disagree. That doesn't mean they miss them.

 

[PhotonGuy]

People understand your points and disagree. That doesn't mean they miss them.

Yes I know there's a difference between getting a point and disagreeing with it and missing a point altogether, but the thing is people do miss my points altogether, at least some of the people on this forum do.

 

[Taiji Rebel]

Sometimes a student can possess the skillset, but lack the correct mindset to be honored with a blackbelt. Martial arts chains and McDojos can be less concerned with the overall quality of their students. Pay your money and they will award the belt. A lot of us have come across such schools and their students, blackbelts who do not deserve the recognition or grade. And then you have instructors and schools who require their students to uphold the honor, respect and characteristics of the original martial artists. A white uniform and blackbelt are not necessary requirements in order to be a martial artist of the highest caliber, the real treasures of martial arts go much deeper than that.

 

[HighKick]

Yes I know there's a difference between getting a point and disagreeing with it and missing a point altogether, but the thing is people do miss my points altogether, at least some of the people on this forum do.

 

[HighKick]

Yes I know there's a difference between getting a point and disagreeing with it and missing a point altogether, but the thing is people do miss my points altogether, at least some of the people on this forum do.

That is Your opinion, and No One Else. This forum and beyond.

 

[PhotonGuy]

That is Your opinion, and No One Else. This forum and beyond.

You've missed my point you just won't admit it.

 

[HighKick]

You've missed my point you just won't admit it.

Okay, make your point.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Sometimes a student can possess the skillset, but lack the correct mindset to be honored with a blackbelt.

That depends on the dojo, some dojos only require skillset but not mindset for a blackbelt, some dojos might require mindset as well, and some dojos might require other stuff. It all depends on what your dojo requires.

Martial arts chains and McDojos can be less concerned with the overall quality of their students. Pay your money and they will award the belt.

Depends on what you define as a McDojo. Based on your post, what you define as a McDojo is a dojo that will hand you a blackbelt when all you've got to do is pay them enough money, I would agree with you on that and I would not waste my time at such a dojo.

A lot of us have come across such schools and their students, blackbelts who do not deserve the recognition or grade.

In your opinion they don't deserve it.

And then you have instructors and schools who require their students to uphold the honor, respect and characteristics of the original martial artists.

And if you prefer such dojos you can go to them, and if you set up your own dojo you can run it that way.

A white uniform and blackbelt are not necessary requirements in order to be a martial artist of the highest caliber, the real treasures of martial arts go much deeper than that.

Exactly what is required to be a martial artist of the highest caliber is a matter of opinion, what do you hope to get out of the martial arts? What are your goals? I would agree with you though about the real treasures of the martial arts going much deeper than that but that's just me.

 

[Prince_Alarming]

 

[Taiji Rebel]

That depends on the dojo, some dojos only require skillset but not mindset for a blackbelt, some dojos might require mindset as well, and some dojos might require other stuff. It all depends on what your dojo requires.

How about your dojo? What does your school expect in order to award a blackbelt?

 

[HighKick]

How about your dojo? What does your school expect in order to award a blackbelt?

I imagine Youtube-Fu is rather flexible on the requirements.

 

[Prince_Alarming]

Yes but like clackledockling the test is the hardest thing

 

[PhotonGuy]

Okay, make your point.

My point is that I never claimed that tests are for acquiring skill, I did not make that claim in post #40 or in any other post in this thread.

In post #40 I said "No you also need skill, but that's what the test is for, to see if you've got the skill." You ignored the part that I have in boldface and acted like you thought I was saying that tests are for acquiring skill when in fact that is not what I said and that is not what I meant, not when you take into account the part I have in boldface.

I tried setting it straight in post #50 by explaining what I really meant in post #40 but you responded by telling me to just let it go and admit I was wrong, that I was wrong for making a claim which I never did make.

So that is my point, that I never made the claim that tests are for acquiring skill and if you would read and take into account everything I say in post #40, especially the part I have in boldface above, you would know that.

 

[PhotonGuy]

How about your dojo? What does your school expect in order to award a blackbelt?

At the Goju Ryu dojo I go to now, to get a black belt at the very least you have to be able to perform the katas Gekisai Dai Ichi, Gekisai Dai Ni, Saifa, Seiyunchin, and Sanseiru and you have to be able to perform them with a certain degree of proficiency that the sensei deems adequate for the black belt.

Aside from that there are other requirements but they can sometimes change. For me, in addition to the katas mentioned above I also had to run three miles in under 45 minutes, break two bricks, spar with the sensei until he said to stop, teach some applications of parts of katas to other students, (explain what certain movements in the katas would be used for in real life confrontations and watch as students practice them with training partners and correct as necessary), identify three vital points on the body and explain how to strike them and the effects of striking them, be able to perform various defenses against being grabbed, struck, ect. and attend a two day seminar. You also have to be a student at the dojo for at least five years before you're eligible for the black belt.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

By time in grade requirements I take it you mean a minimal amount of time a student has to hold their current rank before they're eligible for promotion. For instance, before you can be a black belt you have to be a brown belt for a certain x length of time and only after you've been a brown belt for that length of time are you eligible for the black belt no matter how skilled you might be, minimum time requirements aren't uncommon and those I can understand as long as the minimum time requirement is within reason but as to the student I was referring to in my original post, Im not quite sure that's how it was done at his dojo.

The impression I got was that at his dojo you had to wait indefinitely to promote because the sensei wanted you to be patient. For instance if you were a brown belt working on getting a black belt you would have to wait indefinitely before you could test for the black belt no matter how skilled you might be, all in the name of patience. I could be wrong with my impression but that was just the impression I got from the description he gave.

Anyway, that's what Im against, having to wait indefinitely just because your sensei wants you to be patient. If your sensei does have reasonable minimum time requirements then you should be able to test once you've met those requirements, so if you've been a brown belt for as long as you need to be in order to fulfill the minimum time requirement then you should be eligible to test for the black belt. It's having to wait indefinitely that Im against.

It sounds to me like this instructor had determined patience would be a valuable life skill to develop, and made it part of his curriculum. Just as I made being able to talk to a group part of mine (because I think most folks benefit greatly from improving this skill). Most folks will never need the real "martial" parts of their MA training. So I worked to build some pieces into my curriculum to build other skills, including some basic physical abilities that should serve them well as they aged.