Reason for all the high kicks and ariel techniques

[Dirty Dog]

All the high kicking is mostly WTF practioners. ITF schools don't neccesarily put that much emphasis on high kicking, or for that matter aerial kicks in general. I have trained ITF since august 2014, and haven't been taught any aerial kicks, outside of flying side kick (which is a nice kick) and the jumping back kick. Lots of handstrikes, heavy emphasis on patterns, conditioning.

Not true in the least. You're extrapolating from your own extremely limited and short term training and assuming that it's true elsewhere. Or even that what you've been taught, as a very new student, applies to what more advanced students have been taught. A generally foolish notion. Students at your level are not taught complicated kicks in our school, either.

I learned far more about fancy aerial kicks in the ITF schools I trained at than the KKW schools. But I'm quite willing to believe that this is because my ITF training was when I was young, and thought triple back flips with a double twist kicks were cool, while my KKW and MDK training has been as an adult who is more interested in practicality than flash.

And your use of "WTF practitioners" is still incorrect, as has been amply proven. You mean KKW, so it would be smarter to simply SAY KKW in the first place.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Uh he went to touch gives after the bell rang?
They allready touched gloves
If you look at the close up slow mo you can see his hands were guarding.

He very clearly extends his left hand to toich gloves

It does look like he was extending his hand to touch gloves. But it's also true that they'd already touched and the bell had rung to start the round.
Extended to touch or whatever, he clearly wasn't guarding.
And that's a phenomenally stupid thing to do after the bell rings.
We had a few students a while back who started touching gloves after the start. I put a stop to it. While sparring with one of them, I extended my hands part way like I wanted to touch, and when they mirrored me, I put my foot against their temple. Not with power, but the point was made.
Start means start.

 

[The_Awesome_User]

It does look like he was extending his hand to touch gloves. But it's also true that they'd already touched and the bell had rung to start the round.
Extended to touch or whatever, he clearly wasn't guarding.
And that's a phenomenally stupid thing to do after the bell rings.
We had a few students a while back who started touching gloves after the start. I put a stop to it. While sparring with one of them, I extended my hands part way like I wanted to touch, and when they mirrored me, I put my foot against their temple. Not with power, but the point was made.
Start means start.

Hmm it looks to me like he put his guard up around his body and didn't realize it would be a high kick until too late or not at all

 

[Laplace_demon]

Not true in the least. You're extrapolating from your own extremely limited and short term training and assuming that it's true elsewhere. Or even that what you've been taught, as a very new student, applies to what more advanced students have been taught. A generally foolish notion. Students at your level are not taught complicated kicks in our school, either.

I learned far more about fancy aerial kicks in the ITF schools I trained at than the KKW schools. But I'm quite willing to believe that this is because my ITF training was when I was young, and thought triple back flips with a double twist kicks were cool, while my KKW and MDK training has been as an adult who is more interested in practicality than flash.

And your use of "WTF practitioners" is still incorrect, as has been amply proven. You mean KKW, so it would be smarter to simply SAY KKW in the first place.

I will bet you I will never come close to the number of aerials performed by KKW. And my dobok is labelled ITF, that's right, ITF. So keep on living in your dream world of "there are no ITF schools". My grading certificate has the international Taekwon-do logo, and is written: "certified in accordance with the rules and regulations of the International TaeKwon-Do federation".

 

[Laplace_demon]

Not true in the least. You're extrapolating from your own extremely limited and short term training and assuming that it's true elsewhere. Or even that what you've been taught, as a very new student, applies to what more advanced students have been taught. A generally foolish notion. Students at your level are not taught complicated kicks in our school, either.

Well, if an 8th dan instructor isn't legitimate, I don't know who is. And we train with the black belts all the time. It's a small club. Whatever applies to them, also applies to us.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Not true in the least. You're extrapolating from your own extremely limited and short term training and assuming that it's true elsewhere. Or even that what you've been taught, as a very new student, applies to what more advanced students have been taught. A generally foolish notion. Students at your level are not taught complicated kicks in our school, either.

Well, if an 8th dan instructor isn't legitimate, I don't know who is. And we train with the black belts all the time. It's a small club. Whatever applies to them, also applies to us.

I agree with Dirty Dog and say you are mistaken. FWIW My cert from 2002 is #A-7-10

 

[Laplace_demon]

I agree with Dirty Dog and say you are mistaken. FWIW My cert from 2002 is #A-7-10

Oh, really? How many of these aerial kicks do you master, then?

- tornado reverse side;
-- flying reverse side;
-- assisted jumping roundhouse;
-- 360- 540- 720 crescent and roundhouses, etc
-- double jumping front kick
-- flying scissors kick
-- triple (or quad) flying front kick(s)
-- flip-back double-jumping front kick

 

[Dirty Dog]

I will bet you I will never come close to the number of aerials performed by KKW. And my dobok is labelled ITF, that's right, ITF. So keep on living in your dream world of "there are no ITF schools". My grading certificate has the international Taekwon-do logo, and is written: "certified in accordance with the rules and regulations of the International TaeKwon-Do federation".

You might want to go re-read what I wrote. Pay close attention. Ask for help if you need it.
Then you might realize why your reply looks so silly.


Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Oh, really? How many of these aerial kicks do you master, then?

- tornado reverse side;
-- flying reverse side;
-- assisted jumping roundhouse;
-- 360- 540- 720 crescent and roundhouses, etc
-- double jumping front kick
-- flying scissors kick
-- triple (or quad) flying front kick(s)
-- flip-back double-jumping front kick

The man you're addressing, as has been mentioned to you before, is an ITF 8th Dan. If that's the way students in your school are taught to speak to someone who is (vastly) their senior, then I am saddened.
What's your instructors name again? I think it's a safe bet Master Weiss knows them.

 

[Laplace_demon]

The man you're addressing, as has been mentioned to you before, is an ITF 8th Dan. If that's the way students in your school are taught to speak to someone who is (vastly) their senior, then I am saddened.
What's your instructors name again? I think it's a safe bet Master Weiss knows them.

Why dance around the question? Master Weiss challenged my statement that the kicking arsenal differs . This would help clarify the issue once and for all. I already know the answer, and this is most likely why I was left with no response.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Why dance around the question? Master Weiss challenged my statement that the kicking arsenal differs . This would help clarify the issue once and for all. I already know the answer, and this is most likely why I was left with no response.

Speaking of dancing around the question... you didn't answer mine.
What is your instructors name?
And an additional question. Do you think your instructor would approve of the tone you take towards your seniors?

 

[Laplace_demon]

Speaking of dancing around the question... you didn't answer mine.
What is your instructors name?
And an additional question. Do you think your instructor would approve of the tone you take towards your seniors?

You already know his name, since I mentioned it earlier: Yeo Chin-Huat. He's my instructor in taekwon-do, that's it.

You have repeatedly questioned my training, when I have reported (accurately) that throws are a non existent part of our training, and that the aerial kicks are nowhere near what WTF practitioners train on a daily basis. This is well known fact, in comparing different taekwondo systems. I don't know why anyone would seriously dispute it. Sure, we have more aerials than Shotokan, but that isn't really saying much, is it?

 

[Drose427]

Why dance around the question? Master Weiss challenged my statement that the kicking arsenal differs . This would help clarify the issue once and for all. I already know the answer, and this is most likely why I was left with no response.

You think you know the answer, with only a year of training.

2 highly ranked and well versed practitioners have told you otherwise. Other than your own ego or arrogance, you have zero reason to think you know better than either of them or to regard them with such disrespect.

 

[Laplace_demon]

You think you know the answer, with only a year of training.

2 highly ranked and well versed practitioners have told you otherwise. Other than your own ego or arrogance, you have zero reason to think you know better than either of them or to regard them with such disrespect.

You don't think I am well informed through various internet sources, discussion forums, and the fact that the black belts in this club are simply not aerial kickers. I have trained WTF, including their sparring, and the black belts in ITF are not capable of doing advanced aerials, since I've seen them perform rather basic ones. Some can't even perform flying side kick. This is highly indicative that aerial kicking is not as emphasised. The WTF guys were far more fluent in this regard.

 

[Dirty Dog]

You already know his name, since I mentioned it earlier: Yeo Chin-Huat. He's my instructor in taekwon-do, that's it.

I don't recall you ever actually answering the question before. If you did, and I overlooked it, I apologize.
Now, how about part two of the question? What do you think Master Yeo would think about the tone you take with seniors?

You have repeatedly questioned my training,

Well, no, your training is still at the baby-steps stage, so what I've questioned is how you think you know so much. Especially since so much of what you've stated is actually incorrect.

when I have reported (accurately) that throws are a non existent part of our training,

No, you have claimed - incorrectly - that your extremely short training is representative of all ITF schools. If you're saying there are no throws taught at your school, that's fine. But it absolutely is NOT true of the ITF in general.

and that the aerial kicks are nowhere near what WTF practitioners train on a daily basis.

Again, you are making claims about the ITF and KKW in general (there are no WTF practitioners, as you know, since it says so right on the WTF site) based on your tiny little bit of training. You are wrong. And while my own ITF rank is a mere Samdan, you've also been told by a man who is an ITF 8th Dan that you are incorrect.
The school you attend is, clearly, not representative of the ITF in general.

This is well known fact, in comparing different taekwondo systems.

You must be using a non-standard definition of the word "fact"...

I don't know why anyone would seriously dispute it.

Ummmm, maybe because you're wrong, and people with more training and experience in both the ITF and other taekwondo systems know that you're wrong?
Just an idea...

 

[Dirty Dog]

You don't think I am well informed through various internet sources, discussion forums, and the fact that the black belts in this club are simply not aerial kickers. I have trained WTF, including their sparring, and the black belts in ITF are not capable of doing advanced aerials, since I've seen them perform rather basic ones. Some can't even perform flying side kick. This is highly indicative that aerial kicking is not as emphasised. The WTF guys were far more fluent in this regard.

You need to learn what qualifies as a relevant sample...

 

[Laplace_demon]

I don't recall you ever actually answering the question before. If you did, and I overlooked it, I apologize.
Now, how about part two of the question? What do you think Master Yeo would think about the tone you take with seniors?



Well, no, your training is still at the baby-steps stage, so what I've questioned is how you think you know so much. Especially since so much of what you've stated is actually incorrect.



No, you have claimed - incorrectly - that your extremely short training is representative of all ITF schools. If you're saying there are no throws taught at your school, that's fine. But it absolutely is NOT true of the ITF in general.



Again, you are making claims about the ITF and KKW in general (there are no WTF practitioners, as you know, since it says so right on the WTF site) based on your tiny little bit of training. You are wrong. And while my own ITF rank is a mere Samdan, you've also been told by a man who is an ITF 8th Dan that you are incorrect.
The school you attend is, clearly, not representative of the ITF in general.



You must be using a non-standard definition of the word "fact"...



Ummmm, maybe because you're wrong, and people with more training and experience in both the ITF and other taekwondo systems know that you're wrong?
Just an idea...

Once again, my grading certificate is ITF and my dobok has the writing ITF. Please adress how such a school could be "ITF neutral." and that there are no ITF or WTF schools. Did you know that swedish national competitiors in ITF are not allowed to compete in the upcoming olympics (unless they work it out by then)? I don't know the exact politics of it, but that sounds very strange if there is no way to be ITF affiliated.


I am sure other schools put more emphasis on high kicking/aerials, but I stand by this point to my grave, KKW/WTF it is NOT comparable. That is: I am quite certain the reverse is almost never true: less aerial kicking in a random KKW/WTF training school, than ITF school.

 

[Laplace_demon]

You need to learn what qualifies as a relevant sample...

Is a relevant sample, every single posting regarding the difference, that ITFers are slower kickers and that WTFers knows and are more proficient at aerial kicking? How come I've NEVER read the opposite?

 

[Gwai Lo Dan]

My initial thought was that the ITF guys don't do much aerials....then I thought about youtube videos, and recalled that Aaron Gassor has great aerials and he is primarily ITF, although he has KKW 1st dan (as far as I recall).

So I am left to conclude that the biggest difference between ITF and WTF is that the ITF guys practice much more extensively turning kicks with the ball of the foot, and twist kicks. I personally haven't seen these yet at WTF/KKW schools, although I am sure others will chime in and say their school practises these.

 

[Laplace_demon]

My initial thought was that the ITF guys don't do much aerials....then I thought about youtube videos, and recalled that Aaron Gassor has great aerials and he is primarily ITF, although he has KKW 1st dan (as far as I recall).
.

Which makes him instantly disqualified from the discussion.