Photograph Police, Go To Jail

[Bob Hubbard]

Raising the dead here to add a few more links.

Two students and Kernel photo adviser arrested at RNC
September 2, 2008

Arrested Photographer's Photo Shows Police Using Knee On Protester's Neck
MINNEAPOLIS, MN (September 2, 2008)


Amy Goodman Arrested at RNC
Follow ups:

 

[Archangel M]

The kneeling on the upper back thing is a common and valid technique for immobilizing a suspect for cuffing..its hyperbole from a writer with an agenda. With the riot visor and kneepads on he may be a little high on the back but there is daylight showing through the area of the throat and the ground so obviously there isn't pressure being applied to the trachea etc.

The other story about the press getting OC sprayed and hit with crowd control devices...when you are IN the crowd thats the risk you run.

“I think it’s important to acknowledge the police do have a job to do and we don’t condone the destruction of property,” Kirtley said, “but the point is journalists have a job to do and that they should not be impeded from doing that work. Their First Amendment rights should be respected.”

So its "control the crowds officer..its your job..just take your time and be sure you dont hit our reporters in the crowd.." Bah!

 

[Bob Hubbard]

That's kinda my take on these too. The only thing is, while I understand that in some situations there simply isn't time to be gentle and check every ID (it's a riot, not a tea party), in at least the Goodman case, it looks that she was pulled across the line, stripped of her ID and arrested. Stripped of the ID by someone (Secret Service) who could have on the spot validated it, and handled the matter better. The fact that all charges against her and her 2 coworkers were dropped a couple weeks later would indicate their innocence.

 

[punisher73]

Yeah, it's a shame that it comes to this. BUT, you only look at this side of the story from a professional photographers point of view.

Now, let's look at the other side of things. Police are investigating something and you have people out their photographing them. Seems simple enough. Take it a step further (true accounts, not hypothetical)...those photographs are used by gangbangers to log and build intelligence files on the police. They also use those same photgraphs to put hits out on the police.

There are website out there FOR FREE, that all you need is a name and I can get back your spouse's name, address, phone number etc. For a little bit more money it will even give you financial info.

I would have to know the whole story before judging why someone was arrested for ONLY taking a picture. Usually there is a lot more to it than what is reported.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I do understand that, however the police are not an anonymous group, and people in the US at least, are constitutionally protected. To be clear, if you are a cop, and I walk by and take you picture, you have zero legal right to stop me, no right to demand my camera no right to detain me, no right to insist that I erase that photo, and no right to lay a hand on me, nor sieze my equipment, nor destroy my equipment. None.

What I as a photograher may do with that photo is however restricted by copyright and use laws. I can't sell it, without your permission (release needed). I can't usually display it without permission either. Journalistic needs are allowed, however I may be guilty of other offenses depending on how/if it's captioned.

If I cross the tape as it were, I am breaking various laws, however I can still photograph as long as there is no expectation of privacy. So, if there's 50,60+ people gathered around, I can take the picture. I can't follow him into the john however.

If I am interferring with an investigation, if I am compromising the scene, if I am accessing areas I shouldn't be, if I am getting in their face, shoving them, spitting on them and the like, I should be taken to task. If I choose to place myslf in the middle of a mob, I should expect possible damage due to the fluid nature of the event, and the fact that a cop can't be expected to take the time to check all my ID's while others are tossing rocks at him.

But, standing on the side taking photos of an event, is perfectly legal.

 

[zeeberex]

You're full of it!!!!

Are you serious?

 

[zeeberex]

I see your a leo drac. I just want you to know I mean no offence with my previous post. It's just a sad truth, and it's a shame good cops have to be looked at in a bad way when one of their own starts turning dirty.

Drac's free pass, denied. A cop I've known for years just got caught with kiddie porn on his pc at work, and I thought I knew the guy. Don't you dare condescend to tell that you guys (Cops) don't cover for each other. happens every day and you damn well know it.

 

[Drac]

Drac's free pass, denied. A cop I've known for years just got caught with kiddie porn on his pc at work, and I thought I knew the guy. Don't you dare condescend to tell that you guys (Cops) don't cover for each other. happens every day and you damn well know it.

So what happened to the copper with the kiddie porn??? I don't know about where YOU LIVE but here the only covering I have ever heard of or participated in is covering a shift so someone can have the night off...

 

[Archangel M]

Dont bother Drac. That guy is the quickest "ignore lister" Ive come across since visiting here. Obviously has LEO "issues".

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

Drac's free pass, denied. A cop I've known for years just got caught with kiddie porn on his pc at work, and I thought I knew the guy. Don't you dare condescend to tell that you guys (Cops) don't cover for each other. happens every day and you damn well know it.

So your evidence that cops cover for each other is that a cop that you have known for just got caught for having child porn on his pc.

Question: Who caught him?

Probable answer: Other cops. And the reason that you know about it is that those cops turned him in.

Question: Who do you think administers discipline when the police are convicted of administrative/criminal inquiries.

Answer: Other cops, which include the sworn administrative members of the department.

Just by way of asuaging your assumptions about the police covering for one another:

In my department, over the last year or two, we have fired about 15 officers for various indescretions: having sex with prostitutes, DUI, etc. They were fired by the Chief of Police, a sworn police officer. They were investigated by members of Internal Affairs, sworn police officers.

If all cops cover for one another, how would any cop, barring a media blitz of video showing obvious criminal behavior, ever be fired.

I am afraid that your ignorance of what actually goes on behind the scenes in a police department leaves alot to be desired.

 

[Cryozombie]

Not to be a dick, (like thats a stretch latley)

But I find it funny in this thread all the LEO memebers of the board are sticking up for one another and their kind in general when it comes to them doing somthing "not quite legal" (with regards to the photography issue) while claiming they don't all cover for each other.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

Not to be a dick, (like thats a stretch latley)

But I find it funny in this thread all the LEO memebers of the board are sticking up for one another and their kind in general when it comes to them doing somthing "not quite legal" (with regards to the photography issue) while claiming they don't all cover for each other.

Wow, thats funny, because I have not stuck up for anyone in this thread. Just pointing out some obvious holes in the logic.

 

[zeeberex]

Wow, thats funny, because I have not stuck up for anyone in this thread. Just pointing out some obvious holes in the logic.

regardless, it's not illegal, and cops DO cover each other, maybe not every time but don't tell us it doesn't happen.

 

[zeeberex]

Always has and always will..

Thats sadly where the ratings come from.

 

[zeeberex]

So what happened to the copper with the kiddie porn??? I don't know about where YOU LIVE but here the only covering I have ever heard of or participated in is covering a shift so someone can have the night off...

It was found on his work pc where he's a cop and i believe on his pc where he was a dispatcher one town over. He was fired and brought humiliation to his family given that he was a well known cop in a smallish town for years, as was his brother who is his twin. Given that, the price being paid should be obvious. The fired him but there was an effort to keep it quiet, maybe for the sake of his family but then you're delving into hearsay.

 

[Archangel M]

Not to be a dick, (like thats a stretch latley)

But I find it funny in this thread all the LEO memebers of the board are sticking up for one another and their kind in general when it comes to them doing somthing "not quite legal" (with regards to the photography issue) while claiming they don't all cover for each other.

Example?

I dont see anybody here really discussing the photography issue. Just that the kneeling on the back is no biggie and that photographers in the middle of a mob are probably going to be treated like the mob. Where is there an example of an LEO "supporting" something "not quite legal"? I think you are projecting.

 

[Cryozombie]

Go back and re read the thread Arc. Howsabout the "Well, the photographers always come in late" and "How would you like it if it were you" and the "You arent looking at this from a LEO's point of veiw" stuff?

And if we arent discussing the photography issue, then we are off topic and should return, hmmm?

 

[Archangel M]

Sorry. Still dont see it.

 

[Cryozombie]

Sorry. Still dont see it.

Shocking.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

regardless, it's not illegal, and cops DO cover each other, maybe not every time but don't tell us it doesn't happen.

What is not illegal?

And of course it happens. What I resent is people making the vast police conspiracy theory that all cops stand up for one another come hell or high water. Thats just not true.