my belt

[T.Durden]

I started my martial arts training when I was seven off and on until I was 17 in tae kwon do. My teacher at the time was, well, pretty greedy and cared more about payments and contracts than actual training. So when I was 17 I tested for what I thought was my black belt. Well he said I wasnt old enough ( had to be 18 ) to jump into my black belt test and all that, so he tested me for 150 bucks for the 'probationary black belt' which is an amalglamated red and black belt- which i received. He then told me to retest 2 weeks later for the real test and then I'd have to pay him another 350 and then he'd get my id card and all that..well I kind of felt ripped off since both tests were exactly the same, only he would have made 500 dollars off of me; not to mention I was teaching all of his classes for him.

so the delima is this. I have moved on to different martial arts and different structures, but it really bothers me that I never really got my solid black. Did I actually make the rank or fall short? He told me when I got my solid black, it was goign to be a second degree, but who can trust him? If I didnt make the grade, is there some way around this to turn in my proof of training somewhere to get my actual certificate? I really dont want to see this guy anymore so thats out..

 

[TX_BB]

From the information you have given it's hard to say. This is probably one of the benefits of belonging to a large organization ITF, KKK ....etc. Hopefully your training was good.

 

[thesensei]

Well, if you have moved on to different schools and especially different arts, you're probably going to have to start from the beginning anyway. So from that perspective it doesn't really matter. If you have the skills, it doesn't matter what color your belt is! And, if your instructor was truly more concerned with money than quality training, then do you REALLY want your black belt certificate signed by him?

Bottom line - don't let it bother you. I'm sure you learned some great lessons from him - both things to do and NOT to do! It's what you know that's important, not the belt. Train hard, and the opportunity will come again, and when you look back, you will see that the journey's been worth it (although I hope it's not over yet)!

Good luck in your training and welcome to the board.

 

[Andrew Green]

Rank isn't standardized, so really, if you aren't training in that organization anymore your rank is irrelevant, but I suspect you knew that and it's just a personal curiosity?

Kinda like doing all the course work at University but never filling in the "I want to graduate now" form. You where a black belt, but now you are whatever you are in the current school.

Belts are just there to confuse people and inflate ego's anyways, thinking about them will just make your head hurt

 

[Last Fearner]

...so he tested me for 150 bucks for the 'probationary black belt' which is an amalglamated red and black belt- which i received...

All belt tests under "1st Dan" are strictly school/organization authorized, and are temporary, which means they can be revoked, and you can be dropped in rank. The 1st Dan is the first permanent rank, but a "probationary Black Belt," "Recommended Black Belt," "Deputy Black Belt," or "Black Belt Candidate," are not the permanent 1st Dan.

...He then told me to retest 2 weeks later for the real test and then I'd have to pay him another 350 and then he'd get my id card and all that..well I kind of felt ripped off since both tests were exactly the same, only he would have made 500 dollars off of me..

If you took the second test (you said they were both the same) then why didn't he issue the Black Belt? You said, "he would have made 500 dollars off me." Does this mean you did not pay him the additional 350? If you did pay, did you fail the test? If not, then he owes you a belt (which you will likely never see, and might not really want).

The best thing to do is to chalk that episode up to experience, and move on.

...Did I actually make the rank or fall short?..

If you did not receive the Dan Certificate, then you did not officially make the rank, but I would not say that you "fell short." Your skills are the criteria that qualifies you for the Black Belt. To make it official, though, you have an option if you want to put the years of training to work obtaining proper credentials.

...If I didnt make the grade, is there some way around this to turn in my proof of training somewhere to get my actual certificate?

If you find a Taekwondo instructor who teaches very similar to how you trained before, and explain your background history, they might be willing to train you for a very short time (1 - 6 months), and prepare you for an official "Kukkiwon" Dan test for a nominal fee (maybe $75.00, or $100.00). Then you can continue to train in whatever you want, be it Taekwondo, or another system. Or, you can let the whole thing go, and concentrate on a new path toward a different Black Belt Certificate. It's all up to you.

Good Luck!
CM D. J. Eisenhart

 

[T.Durden]

75.00 - 100 bucks would be reasonable. This guy convinced me to pay 150 for the first test, then after i passed it pressured me into trying to take the second test, which he layed out was the very same information and forms, for 350 2 weeks later. I was upset and my attitude went into the wrong direction because I asked the same thing - why not just get it right the first time? so i left the school. I have the skills and abilitiys i needed at the time, but it's just like the poster said above that it feels like a personal thing to complete!

 

[matt.m]

That absolutely sucks, however I have an interesting tale. Two brothers in St. Louis run two different tae kwon do academies. Each brother thinks his to be better and they don't get along very well. (End backstory).

I have a friend who was taking courses from one brothers school. Had a personality conflict with an instructor, went to the other brothers school and was told he had to begin again at green belt. At the time he was black belt (red stripe). I would consider it a red belt considering he was dan promotable.

The one thing I have noticed about a majority of the schools in St. Louis is that you have to set up a bank eft, sign a three year contract for 100 a month and that only covers the class periods. If you want to participate in sparring classes - you pay extra, etc.

At one time I talked with an instructor and he told me 36 months, 100 a month, and we test you for your dan on your 36th month. I just said thank you and walked away.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

75.00 - 100 bucks would be reasonable. This guy convinced me to pay 150 for the first test, then after i passed it pressured me into trying to take the second test, which he layed out was the very same information and forms, for 350 2 weeks later. I was upset and my attitude went into the wrong direction because I asked the same thing - why not just get it right the first time? so i left the school. I have the skills and abilitiys i needed at the time, but it's just like the poster said above that it feels like a personal thing to complete!

Did the owner/instructor tell you that it was a two stage process, and that two fees would be involved?

 

[T.Durden]

no. he set it up as if it were two totally different tests; one was to get me out of the red belt group and into the 'preliminary black belt' and then my final test within the school for my solid black belt.
I was under the impression that it was different forms, different requirements..nope. all he did tell me to do was come back with the money and redo the last 3 forms - which i did for the red/black belt - and i had a few more board breaks. I felt pretty dumb. especially when I was running his classes and helping with the younger kids

 

[Miles]

Welcome to MT!

Chalk it up to experience. If you learned good martial arts, great, otherwise it was at least a good life-lesson.

Miles

 

[Gemini]

This is a great example of why I won't train at an independant school. Yes, there are many good ones out there, but then you get one like this and he's holding the cards. You could (and may well be) a great practitioner and you have to put up with someone elses agenda. I understand about wanting to get what you feel you've earned. No, the belt shouldn't matter, only the experience. But to walk away is difficult even if it "shouldn't" matter. As Last Ferner stated, you can start in another school (choose wisely) and the chances are you'll promote quickly. I think most instructors will just want to get a feel for you and see what you can do. Whatever you decide, good luck!

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

no. he set it up as if it were two totally different tests; one was to get me out of the red belt group and into the 'preliminary black belt' and then my final test within the school for my solid black belt.
I was under the impression that it was different forms, different requirements..nope. all he did tell me to do was come back with the money and redo the last 3 forms - which i did for the red/black belt - and i had a few more board breaks. I felt pretty dumb. especially when I was running his classes and helping with the younger kids

Dang, that sucks. I hate to hear stories of instructors taking advantage of their students. I guess I've been fortunate because I've been training with the same Sabumnim for years now and he's always treated his students respectfully and will go the extra mile for us. Because of this, we reciprecate in kind for him and our dojang.

 

[trueaspirer]

The main thing is the training you got - if that's good, anyplace should take you. And any place that doesn't take you soley because you don't have technical rank - you don't want to go to.
But in terms of what it means to you, theres always another chance at the belt. The guy was probably just ripping you off, he didn't care about whether you got the belt or not, or your success, he was only gonna give you the rank because he felt it would make you stay and pay him more money along the way. Don't worry about it, its his problem, not yours.

 

[IcemanSK]

I started my martial arts training when I was seven off and on until I was 17 in tae kwon do. My teacher at the time was, well, pretty greedy and cared more about payments and contracts than actual training. So when I was 17 I tested for what I thought was my black belt. Well he said I wasnt old enough ( had to be 18 ) to jump into my black belt test and all that, so he tested me for 150 bucks for the 'probationary black belt' which is an amalglamated red and black belt- which i received. He then told me to retest 2 weeks later for the real test and then I'd have to pay him another 350 and then he'd get my id card and all that..well I kind of felt ripped off since both tests were exactly the same, only he would have made 500 dollars off of me; not to mention I was teaching all of his classes for him.

so the delima is this. I have moved on to different martial arts and different structures, but it really bothers me that I never really got my solid black. Did I actually make the rank or fall short? He told me when I got my solid black, it was goign to be a second degree, but who can trust him? If I didnt make the grade, is there some way around this to turn in my proof of training somewhere to get my actual certificate? I really dont want to see this guy anymore so thats out..

I'd encourage you to go to another school that has a good reputation (I'd suggest a school affliated with the Kukkiwon....If you can find a reputable one ) & explain your situation.

If you live anywhere near Master Stoker, Master Eisenhart, Gemini, or Mr Miles (to only name a few on here) I'd suggest you look to them. Or go to uscdka.com & look for "a school near you" & see if there's a school near you. Stories like yours are (sadly) more common than one would think. Don't let this sour you on TKD.