More vs Less Training Time

[PhotonGuy]

So if someone chooses to train more than once a week they're impatient?....hmm well that's a...unique way of looking at it

That's a really extreme way of looking at it but the point is, if a student trains more hours per week instead of less hours per week, does that make the student impatient? After all, in most cases training more hours a week will enable you to improve your skill in fewer weeks than if you train less hours a week.

 

[AndreaLola]

I wouldnt think it would make them impatient if they are doing it because they genuinely feel that they are enjoying themselves.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Mitlov]

In my experience, once per week just keeps the rust off, twice is necessary for slow progression, and three or more is necessary for fast progression. There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to train three days per week if that's an option.

 

[Mitlov]

I really think mathematically so much stuff would be easier if weeks were 6 days long rather than 7

I'll bet you're one of those jerks who "uses the metric system" too

 

[donald1]

I like training four times a week. Monday, Wednesday, friday, and Saturday. Atleast 1 hour.

Personally I like doing atleast a little every day. Basic stretches and excersizes and maybe some tai chi. Nothing too strenuous.

 

[PhotonGuy]

it may seem counter intuitive, but sometimes, quite a lot of the time less is more, theres no guarantee that three times a week is better than two, or twice is better 5han once, so therefore no guarantee that three is better than one. it depends on an awful lot of factors both personal and how the class is structured.

I find once a week, then a few lots of 10 mins scattered through the rest of the week to cement/ practise what iv3 learnt to be optimum. and just about tops out my boredom threshold

any more than that and the extra times is negated by the fact I'd rather be somewhere else doing something a lit less repetitive and general involving women. then I come back refreshed and keen the week after. that and it interferes with my fitness program

I was using small numbers because I wanted to avoid what you're describing, about excessive training resulting in less improvement. Training only one hour a week or only three hours a week, you're not going to experience diminishing returns in most cases. If you were, say, training forty hours a week, 8 hours a day, then you would most likely be experiencing diminishing returns and you would want to cut back, otherwise you will most likely burn yourself out and not progress at all and you could very likely hurt yourself. But most people can handle three hours a week, there might be some exceptions such as people with certain medical conditions or people who are really out of shape but the vast majority of people can train three hours a week and not hurt themselves or have diminishing returns.

Of course, how the class is structured and how your training is structured also plays a role. Doing one solid hour is going to produce better results than doing ten minutes here and there for a total of one hour. Doing five hours straight, unless you haven't worked up to it, is not a good idea and will very likely burn you out.

 

[PhotonGuy]

1 hour vs. 3 hours a week, it's kind of hard to see that distinction. I don't know of many that train 1 hour a week, and the one I have that does, it is really hard to learn things in because you have a week to forget it. I've found 3 hours to be the sweet spot for improving. Even if someone trains more, I don't think they are "impatient", but I do think they will burn out. I've seen it happen more often than not.

Of course, I may not be the best person to ask. I've been told I'm impatient because I ask too many questions.

Depending on the week, I will sometimes only do 1 hour a week of Goju Ryu Karate. That is because I am also training in Gracie Jiu Jitsu and I already have a big background in a different style of Karate and I also go to the gym and lift weights. The Goju Ryu I just do to add more to my knowledge and to adopt some of their techniques to my style. For instance, from my experience Goju Ryu has some of the best blocks and a really solid defense.

As for somebody burning out, that can be a problem if you really train to an excessive amount but one hour a week or three hours a week will not burn out most people. That's why Im using small numbers as I explained in post #26.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Three hours a week is actually not much training. In the beginning that may be fine, but as one progresses and has more to work on, it won’t be enough for actual progress.

Is is possible to overtrain and suffer from burnout, or to simply have diminishing returns due to exhaustion and needing rest time and time to mentally process the training. We have discussed that issue in the past. But three hours a week is a long way from that threshold.

No three hours is not much, at least its not much for somebody when they get more advanced, but as I said in previous posts, the reason why Im using small numbers for the training hours is to avoid getting into too much discussion about burnout. There is a point where more is less but for most people it would not be three hours a week.

If you were to train six hours a week, in say, three days a week for two hours each time, that might not be a good idea for a beginner or somebody out of shape.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Mon/Wed/Fri is perfect, or any other variant where there's a similar spread (Mon/Wed/Sat or Tue/Thur/Sat). I think 3 days a week is the point for most people at which they do less re-learning of the forgotten material. I noticed a big difference going from 2 to 3 days, not much going from 3 to 4 or 4 to 6. You will build muscle memory faster the more you train, but 3 days seems to be the "sweet spot" where you get the biggest benefit by increasing your days.

Keep in mind that theoretically you should be practicing still on your off days. That prevents having to relearn the material. I've been going only about once a week the last few months, but I practice every night, so I'm not having to relearn anything and still see progress.

Granted, I think you work mostly with kids/teens, so I'd be shocked if their actually practicing when they're not there (I know I claimed to do that but would skip out more than my share fair as a lad).

 

[skribs]

Keep in mind that theoretically you should be practicing still on your off days. That prevents having to relearn the material. I've been going only about once a week the last few months, but I practice every night, so I'm not having to relearn anything and still see progress.

Granted, I think you work mostly with kids/teens, so I'd be shocked if their actually practicing when they're not there (I know I claimed to do that but would skip out more than my share fair as a lad).

While true, you can only remember so much at a time to go home and practice. It's a lot easier when you go through it all again while it's fresh in your memory.

 

[pdg]

No three hours is not much, at least its not much for somebody when they get more advanced,

3 hours is not much for a beginner either, at least not if it's spread out.


Where are you getting this thing about it making someone impatient anyway?

Impatient implies wanting to move 'up' quicker than you are able - training more (within your limits) is more a sign of dedication and enthusiasm.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

While true, you can only remember so much at a time to go home and practice. It's a lot easier when you go through it all again while it's fresh in your memory.

I think this also depends on how long you've been training for. As a beginner, you need to be getting guidance on everything, so not a whole lot can be done by yourself. By the time you're more experienced, you should be able to do most of the solo forms/drills/techs by yourself, without losing it. If not the new stuff (if there even is new stuff that you learned..sometimes there's not), then at the very least improving on your fundamentals.

If you spend an hour a night just going over fundamentals (and only fundamentals outside class), no matter how experienced you are, you're going to see some improvement.

 

[drop bear]

I know some top fighters.

And they all dedicate real time and effort in to third training.

 

[Danny T]

Lets say a student of the martial arts goes to class three times a week for an hour each time. That would be three hours a week. If that same student were to go only once a week for an hour that would of course be one hour a week. For a student who is able to go three hours a week, they will no doubt progress further in their art in a week if they do train for three hours a week instead of just one hour a week.

Anyway, there can be all sorts of reasons why a student might only train one hour a week instead of three. Maybe their schedule only allows one hour a week, maybe they are only doing it for fun and feel one hour a week is adequate. But the fact remains that they will go further in a week's time if they do three hours a week instead of just one. In one week they will have learned what they would've learned in three weeks if they were to do only one hour a week.

So anyway, is a student being impatient by choosing to train three hours a week instead of just one?

LOL...
I've got people who train Everyday...Everyday.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Where are you getting this thing about it making someone impatient anyway?

I believe it goes back to some earlier threads where he was talking about training more in order to progress faster and someone (I don’t remember who) was making comments about that indicating a lack of patience. They were probably weren’t talking about 1 vs 3 hours of practice though.

At my current level, 3 hours per week is just enough to keep the rust off. With 6 hours per week I can make a bit of progress. I feel like I do my best with 8-12 hours per week. I have a hard time maintaining any more than that without getting overly sore and burned out.

 

[skribs]

I believe it goes back to some earlier threads where he was talking about training more in order to progress faster and someone (I don’t remember who) was making comments about that indicating a lack of patience. They were probably weren’t talking about 1 vs 3 hours of practice though.

At my current level, 3 hours per week is just enough to keep the rust off. With 6 hours per week I can make a bit of progress. I feel like I do my best with 8-12 hours per week. I have a hard time maintaining any more than that without getting overly sore and burned out.

I recently had to cut back, for a different reason. I'm down from teaching 17 hours/week to teaching 5, because I kept getting sick.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

That's a really extreme way of looking at it but the point is, if a student trains more hours per week instead of less hours per week, does that make the student impatient? After all, in most cases training more hours a week will enable you to improve your skill in fewer weeks than if you train less hours a week.

In most cases - in my experience - someone training more hours simply has more enthusiasm and/or dedication. Their training is a higher priority, which is a neutral statement in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Keep in mind that theoretically you should be practicing still on your off days. That prevents having to relearn the material. I've been going only about once a week the last few months, but I practice every night, so I'm not having to relearn anything and still see progress.

Granted, I think you work mostly with kids/teens, so I'd be shocked if their actually practicing when they're not there (I know I claimed to do that but would skip out more than my share fair as a lad).

Most adults don't seem to do any training outside of class, either. With grappling, I can kind of understand it, but I find it true of strikes and all other drills, as well.

 

[jobo]

I was using small numbers because I wanted to avoid what you're describing, about excessive training resulting in less improvement. Training only one hour a week or only three hours a week, you're not going to experience diminishing returns in most cases. If you were, say, training forty hours a week, 8 hours a day, then you would most likely be experiencing diminishing returns and you would want to cut back, otherwise you will most likely burn yourself out and not progress at all and you could very likely hurt yourself. But most people can handle three hours a week, there might be some exceptions such as people with certain medical conditions or people who are really out of shape but the vast majority of people can train three hours a week and not hurt themselves or have diminishing returns.

Of course, how the class is structured and how your training is structured also plays a role. Doing one solid hour is going to produce better results than doing ten minutes here and there for a total of one hour. Doing five hours straight, unless you haven't worked up to it, is not a good idea and will very likely burn you out.

hmm, how are you measuring improvement? if you mean kata, then maybe, if your talking g about punching or kicking power, speed of reactions co ordination and other important things then it's a, ot less tied to hours of practise and much more a progression that cant really be hurried , they require Neurological and physical changes that take their own sweet time, to that extent then 10 mins here and there to keep the adaptations happening are quite ,likely optimal and certainly no worse as only a few minutes of your hour class five times a week are making any differance. so at best you e waisted 3 hours of your week,

added to which if you have sufficient free time to donate five nights a week to ma training, there is something distinctly missing in your life and you need to work on your people skills rather than conce trzting on how to hurt them

 

[Gerry Seymour]

NOTICE TO ALL USERS:

Insults and baiting are contrary to the MartialTalk user guidelines. Keep it civil and moderately on-topic.

----------
Gerry Seymour
MartialTalk Moderator
@gpseymour