Juko-Kai Ninjutsu?

[Jeff Boler]

Originally posted by Technopunk
Am I just stupid? Doesnt Soke denote the head of an art?

If so, is it possible for an art to have more than one head?

Ah. Mr Sacharnoski is the only head of "his" arts. What he does is recognize people as the head of "their" own arts (with a yearly fee of course.

Mr Sacharnoski is about to have his *ss handed to him though. More information when I'm allowed to release it.

 

[Jay Bell]

I smell a courtroom?

 

[Jeff Boler]

:rofl:

 

[heretic888]

Dear Buddha, this is sad.....

almost as sad as the people that still believe Frank Dux is legit.

*sighs*

 

[Dennis_Mahon]

Mr Sacharnoski is about to have his *ss handed to him though. More information when I'm allowed to release it.

Jeff, you horrible tease :lol:

You know that's going to have everybody hanging on your every post waiting for the other shoe to drop! :boing2:

 

[Jeff Boler]

I know, I know. But I made a promise to keep my mouth shut for another week or two. After that, you will be the first to know.

 

[ABN]

Originally posted by Jeff Boler
Ah. Mr Sacharnoski is the only head of "his" arts. What he does is recognize people as the head of "their" own arts (with a yearly fee of course.

Sounds kind of like Amway......


andy

 

[Kreth]

I heard a rumor out of Japan, and have since confirmed with Don Roley. Hatsumi Sensei has revoked Sacharnoski's honorary judan. Apparently his opinion of "Soke" Sacharnoski has changed...

Jeff

 

[Bujingodai]

Yes but he holds a legit Yondan thru Wilson Shihan from what I have heard. How will that be affected?

 

[Kreth]

Yes but he holds a legit Yondan thru Wilson Shihan from what I have heard. How will that be affected?

I haven't heard anything about it. But, I stand by my previous opinion that Sacharnoski will not sit for a godan test in Japan anytime soon.

Jeff

 

[Bujingodai]

Good.

 

[Jeff Boler]

Good ole Rodney.

So. Rod got his "honorary" dan rank taken from him huh? Out of curiousity, did Hatsumi request the document back? Was Rod notified of the revoke? If not, he will continue to use it as he sees fit, with the "I have the document to prove it" defense lurking in the shadows.

As for the Godan test, Rod never had intentions on taking it (until Willson is allowed to do the test.) He can do everything he wants to do with a fourth dan.

I can only recommend to the person that informed Hatsumi of Rod's mis-deeds, that he keep himself "anonymous." Otherwise, he'll be looking at a defamation suit!

 

[Kreth]

Out of curiousity, did Hatsumi request the document back? Was Rod notified of the revoke? If not, he will continue to use it as he sees fit, with the "I have the document to prove it" defense lurking in the shadows.

I don't have that info, Jeff. I doubt that word has gotten back to Sacharnoski yet, though, as this happened just a few days ago. I just waited long enough to confirm the story before posting it.

Jeff

 

[Jeff Boler]

Well, that's interesting. Very positive move for the Bujinkan, in my opinion.

 

[Kreth]

Well, that's interesting. Very positive move for the Bujinkan, in my opinion.

Mine too. We have enough empire builders and rank chasers. No need to bring in outside quacks...

Jeff

 

[Don Roley]

Good ole Rodney.

So. Rod got his "honorary" dan rank taken from him huh? Out of curiousity, did Hatsumi request the document back? Was Rod notified of the revoke? If not, he will continue to use it as he sees fit, with the "I have the document to prove it" defense lurking in the shadows.

There is no international Bujinkan goon squad to go around and collect the thing. But I am sure there are many Bujinkan members who would jump at the chance to join one. And I think you are right based on the actions of another guy who has had his honorary rank revoked- Testuya Higuchi.

As for the Godan test, Rod never had intentions on taking it (until Willson is allowed to do the test.)

I honestly think the chances of that are less than those for us seeing Ralph Nader win next November. And no I am not going to talk more about it here.

I can only recommend to the person that informed Hatsumi of Rod's mis-deeds, that he keep himself "anonymous." Otherwise, he'll be looking at a defamation suit!

The beauty of the recent win by Cunningham is that Hatsumi can point to it as reason if asked. He does not have to give anyone's name. Rod can't say it was someone making up stories, it is a legal fact that no one can dispute and can be verified by anyone on their own.

 

[Jeff Boler]

There is no international Bujinkan goon squad to go around and collect the thing. But I am sure there are many Bujinkan members who would jump at the chance to join one. And I think you are right based on the actions of another guy who has had his honorary rank revoked- Testuya Higuchi.

I beg to differ. There are several international Bujinkan goon squads. They just call themselves "teachers."

I honestly think the chances of that are less than those for us seeing Ralph Nader win next November. And no I am not going to talk more about it here.

You're probably right. But considering some of things I have heard about Willson, I am amazed that he has reached the rank he has. Since most of his previous mis-deeds have gone ignored, what's another rank or honor?

The beauty of the recent win by Cunningham is that Hatsumi can point to it as reason if asked. He does not have to give anyone's name. Rod can't say it was someone making up stories, it is a legal fact that no one can dispute and can be verified by anyone on their own.

Well it's being disputed. Sacharnoski is already attempting to have the judgement vacated. Who knows what will happen from this point. Either way, knowing Sacharnoski, this person can at the very least expect some sort of legal threat, if not a physical one.

 

[Don Roley]

Hi,
Check out the following link.

http://www.budoseek.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5177&page=1

You will see that Ryan Reed has stated what I did not, that Hatsumi has refused to renew Sacharnoski's Shidoshikai membership. Of course, you have to kind of filter out the misdirection and their contention that he does not need it due to being an honorary tenth dan, but he does say that Sacharnoski is not a Shidoshikai member at least until he wins a court case. He has had two go against him so far, I would not hold my breath waiting for him to be re-instated.

For those of you who do not know what that means, real rank is not revoked in the Bujinkan. If you pass the fifth dan test, the fact you had that skill does not go away no matter how vile a thing you may do later on. But all people who teach in the Bujinkan are required to be members of the shidoshikai. You have to renew each year to be a teacher in good standing. If you are not a member, then you can not say you are a Bujinkan teacher. So, Sacharnoski can't teach Bujinkan in good faith- and don't say it Jeff. We are all thinking it anyway.

 

[Jeff Boler]

Well, this is definitely the right move for Hatsumi. And as expected, the Juko Kai rank and file is right there to back up Sacharnoski. Regardless of all the information that is available, they stick behind him. One of the classic traits of any cult.

I find it funny that they keep saying things such as, "This will be reviewed when Sacharnoski's legal matters have been resolved." They have been resolved. The legal case he filed against me and Don Cunningham was dismissed. The case brought on against him by Don Cunningham, he lost. That's two judgments against him.

Now, he is seeking to have the judgment in the harassment / forgery case vacated. However, he has not succeeded in that as of yet. Even if he does have it vacated, it will still go to trial, and the evidence that Don Cunningham has against him is extensive. The previous case took over two years just to get a motion for venue change resolved. Once it was resolved, he never paid the transfer and copy fees. Therefore, it was tossed. So you can expect this latest case to be wrapped up for at least that long.

So the Bujinkan Brotherhood can twist words around however they want. Fact of the matter is that if you go look at the court record (which is what really matters) Sacharnoski has lost two cases, one of those for harassment and forgery. So while the Brotherhood (lovingly referred to as the Collective) continues to go around whining about people lying to Hatsumi about Sacharnoski, the court record speaks for itself. It's not rumors being spread around anymore.

Hopefully, some of the other organizations that Sacharnoski is "associated" with, will look at this information, and make similar decisions.

Hi,
Check out the following link.

http://www.budoseek.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5177&page=1

You will see that Ryan Reed has stated what I did not, that Hatsumi has refused to renew Sacharnoski's Shidoshikai membership. Of course, you have to kind of filter out the misdirection and their contention that he does not need it due to being an honorary tenth dan, but he does say that Sacharnoski is not a Shidoshikai member at least until he wins a court case. He has had two go against him so far, I would not hold my breath waiting for him to be re-instated.

For those of you who do not know what that means, real rank is not revoked in the Bujinkan. If you pass the fifth dan test, the fact you had that skill does not go away no matter how vile a thing you may do later on. But all people who teach in the Bujinkan are required to be members of the shidoshikai. You have to renew each year to be a teacher in good standing. If you are not a member, then you can not say you are a Bujinkan teacher. So, Sacharnoski can't teach Bujinkan in good faith- and don't say it Jeff. We are all thinking it anyway.

 

[Don Roley]

I find it funny that they keep saying things such as, "This will be reviewed when Sacharnoski's legal matters have been resolved."

And what would you have them do? The whole thing is a variation of "the check is in the mail" bit. Put off something as long as you can and demand people treat you as something other than a fraud until this action takes place.

It could be a legal case clearing a person's name, research being conducted, a trip to Japan where the teacher will be revealed, etc. I have seen it all. "Don't treat us according to all the facts availible because some time in the future we will provide something that counters it." The only other option for them is to try to deal with all the facts (or lack of them) and you can't imagine some of them wanting to act that way with all the problems they have on the table.

In other words, I expect a lot of talk from them. But after all the judgements against them I doubt they will not be in a rush to see justice done. I kind of expect that is the reason one of the cases took about two years to be resolved.