Good point...In the good old days of law enforcement a punch or a kick was acceptable for almost any situation..As technology advanced cops found themselves under more scrutiny..Joint locks and pressure ponts if caught on camera don't look bad..
Joint Locks and Pressure Points
- Thread starter MJS
- Start date
Good point...In the good old days of law enforcement a punch or a kick was acceptable for almost any situation..As technology advanced cops found themselves under more scrutiny..Joint locks and pressure ponts if caught on camera don't look bad..
Kwan Jang
Purple Belt
I like both as options in my tool box. They give me options for stun and run, as well as for control so that I don't need to move up the ladder of force. Legal defense is an important consideration; You may think those six guys with the AK-47's are scary? You should see their lawyers. LOL.
In all seriousness, one poster did raise a good point about complex movements/fine motor skills being compromised under adrenal stress. This is why when I teach these skills in a tactical class, I stick to techniques that use movements that are already ingrained in peoples' muscle memory since they resemble common movements.
With my martial art students, though I do introduce these at lower levels, I put a higher emphasis on them at advanced levels. I teach more kickboxing-ish skills first, then progress to submission grappling. With my advanced (healthy) students, I move them on to NHB on one end of the spectrum and kyusho/tuite and SCJJ on the other. I feel this syntax in the cirriculum gives them a strong base that they can really use with confidence and competence fairly quickly and build their options from there.
In all seriousness, one poster did raise a good point about complex movements/fine motor skills being compromised under adrenal stress. This is why when I teach these skills in a tactical class, I stick to techniques that use movements that are already ingrained in peoples' muscle memory since they resemble common movements.
With my martial art students, though I do introduce these at lower levels, I put a higher emphasis on them at advanced levels. I teach more kickboxing-ish skills first, then progress to submission grappling. With my advanced (healthy) students, I move them on to NHB on one end of the spectrum and kyusho/tuite and SCJJ on the other. I feel this syntax in the cirriculum gives them a strong base that they can really use with confidence and competence fairly quickly and build their options from there.
Keikai
Rest In Peace
Part fo the definition that we use for a lock is that there is no escape. The only time it is possible to escape from a lock is 1) While in the process of putting the lock on the attacker is not unbalanced and so can resist. 2) The lock is not being applied correctly. A well applied lock will result in leeway for escape.
Our system trains a full grading on a person resisting applied locks and the defender is then required to re-unbalance the attacker and apply a new lock. We have nine (9) basic arm and wrist locks and you must be able to change from one to the other against a resisting attacker. At times two or three changes are necessary. The same same is done for locks to throws, throws to locks and throws to throws. Things don't always go as planned so you need to develop the skills to adapt to the new situation is our philosophy.
As I have outlined above why limit yourself to just a strike? That is just one tool to use against resisting attacker.
As for pressure points. Some are useful, particuarly when grabbed or held. Some work well IF you manage to hit the right spot in the right way. As the exact position and effect is different for everyone I wor one would never rely on pressure points to defend myself.
Greg Palmer
Tsutsumi Ryu Ju Jutsu
pstarr
Master Black Belt
They're an absolute must. The "no touch" stuff is just so much grabage, but the real thing is priceless.
Explorer
Blue Belt
I like to apply them as the attacker reaches out to grab or push ... so he can steady me for his ballistic assault. Heck, I LET 'em grab me ... it just one more thing that won't be flying at my head or nether regions!
I use the pressure points on the arm, torso and legs to move the attackers body into a position from which I can throw him. After that I clear the danger zone.
I use the pressure points on the arm, torso and legs to move the attackers body into a position from which I can throw him. After that I clear the danger zone.
As Grandmaster Pellegrini of the Combat Hapkido Federation says "He just gave you something to play with"...Like you I use it OFTEN...
Yes, if they are going to give you something to work with then it would almost be criminal not to oblige their request. Myself I am just trying to be neighborly at that point.:rofl:
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I've even had my wrist grabbed on a couple of ocassions. Talk about wristlocks 101!
HAHAHA Exactly! People always seem to give things to play with. Like Brian said, it is almost criminal not to be polite and accept the gift.
One thing people always seem to give away are fingers! Also, they always seem to find them most painful! :EG:
HAHAHA Exactly! People always seem to give things to play with. Like Brian said, it is almost criminal not to be polite and accept the gift.
One thing people always seem to give away are fingers! Also, they always seem to find them most painful! :EG:
LOL...Yes, fingers are a lot of fun to "play with"
Haha. My teacher says the same thing. He likely picked it up from Mr. P. Those tend to be the days we have to shake the arms out a little more and I think about getting the ice packs out of the freezer.
Having been the Uke for GMP a number of times I must agree..
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
On the subject of fingers, I have told many a person I do not care how much weight they can lift, I bet their little finger bends easy.
I once was doing push hands with someone that I would call both a Tai Chi and Qinna master. WOW!!! talk about cotton covered steal that very quickly went into a pressure point that ended as a joint lock.... By the way I was the pressure pointed and the joint locked. It was incredibly painful and yet so very impressive.
I once was doing push hands with someone that I would call both a Tai Chi and Qinna master. WOW!!! talk about cotton covered steal that very quickly went into a pressure point that ended as a joint lock.... By the way I was the pressure pointed and the joint locked. It was incredibly painful and yet so very impressive.
Loaded Luke
Yellow Belt
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Loaded Luke
Yellow Belt
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lol! I remember when I was grappling with this kid n he tried to submit me by extending my fingers. Was quite humerous. Was grappling with someone friday n he tried to get he in a wristlock submission (the bugger got it locked on as well) but it didnt do much, just only made me angry n I slammed him down n choked him.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #39
My appologies for not responding to this thread a bit sooner.
Yes, I agree. Its amazing how many locks, pressure point hits there are in forms. Of course, sometimes people don't see this because they don't understand the kata. Personally, whenever I teach a kata, I always like to give at least one other example, aside from the basic movement, of an application.
Mike
