Jeff Speakman speaks...and speaks....and speaks...

[Doc]

I've seen this trend for a long time in my own dealings with the Kenpo crowd. I have no doubts it extends beyond my own geographic area. Having left and seen the light in other styles that really train, it really makes me laugh.

Looking at some of the 5.0 clips on his site and YouTube, it looks as though those guys are really thumping. It almost takes on, dare I say, a realistic look to it. I wish there was a group out here to investigate...

I've stated before, I appreciate what jeff is doing with his Kenpo. Although some of the techniues are questionable, I applaud their willing to address issues and the physical toughness in some of the students I've seen. Good for him.

 

[terryl965]

Every person is intitle to there opinion of events, I'm not a Kenpo person by any means but, he will believe the way he believes.

 

[SL4Drew]

One thing Mr. Speakman did that I thought very highly of was the first few AKKS camps. I don't know if he meant it to be this way, but you could go from room to room and judge the instructors and what they were teaching. It was kind of a Kenpo marketplace.

Although some of the instructors they left me lukewarm, there were other people that thought they were the greatest thing since sliced bread. And a few (as far as I am still concerned) were outright duds. But at the least you got to get a sense of what some seniors were doing with Mr. Parker during their time with him and/or since his death. And there was something for just about everyone. It was eye opening for me.

But I am proud and unashamed to say the Doc blew the doors off and out. I remember everyone on the first day of that first camp going "who is this Chapel guy?" After his first seminar everyone KNEW who the Chap'el guy was. Plus, the sound of the hotel changed--what with all the slapchecking going on.

 

[Doc]

One thing Mr. Speakman did that I thought very highly of was the first few AKKS camps. I don't know if he meant it to be this way, but you could go from room to room and judge the instructors and what they were teaching. It was kind of a Kenpo marketplace.

Although some of the instructors they left me lukewarm, there were other people that thought they were the greatest thing since sliced bread. And a few (as far as I am still concerned) were outright duds. But at the least you got to get a sense of what some seniors were doing with Mr. Parker during their time with him and/or since his death. And there was something for just about everyone. It was eye opening for me.

But I am proud and unashamed to say the Doc blew the doors off and out. I remember everyone on the first day of that first camp going "who is this Chapel guy?" After his first seminar everyone KNEW who the Chap'el guy was. Plus, the sound of the hotel changed--what with all the slapchecking going on.

Yes, and the first camp in Baltimore was a great experience and everyone loved the experience. The first in Vegas were good too, although politics reared its ugly head and were a forcast to come. He's a master manipulator until he can't help himself.

 

[Carol]

Yes, and the first camp in Baltimore was a great experience and everyone loved the experience. The first in Vegas were good too, although politics reared its ugly head and were a forcast to come.

On that note...

Kenpo belt tests measure "doing" and "making". They don't necessarily measure "teaching".

The art is passed on by teachers, moreso than performers...in my view. But what concerns me is that the consistency of teaching in Kenpo is...not consistent at all.

Does Mr. Speakman have this concern about the teaching of Kenpo?

 

[Touch Of Death]

Mr. Jeff Speakman addresses a crowd of BB's in Santiago de Chile and presses a lot of hot buttons when he does it.


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Please, keep the discussion civil.

Everytime Kenpo is going straight to hell I am in the wrong camp.:angel:
Sean

 

[Doc]

On that note...

Kenpo belt tests measure "doing" and "making". They don't necessarily measure "teaching".

The art is passed on by teachers, moreso than performers...in my view. But what concerns me is that the consistency of teaching in Kenpo is...not consistent at all.

Does Mr. Speakman have this concern about the teaching of Kenpo?

I really don't know, but the inconsistency in the commercial art is part of its non-traditional design.

 

[SL4Drew]

Yes, and the first camp in Baltimore was a great experience and everyone loved the experience. The first in Vegas were good too, although politics reared its ugly head and were a forcast to come. He's a master manipulator until he can't help himself.

Yeah I remember. But I still liked the concept of the camp; it was great for the briefest of moments.

 

[LawDog]

I think that we in Kempo/Kenpo community should show what we, as a group, really know, what we can do and how well we can do it instead we tend to point a finger at each other and degrade.
The poor image of Kempo / Kenpo in general has been created by ourselves.
Doc is great at this, Speakman is excellant at this, Parker was the man. Is this really hard to do?
Just my view point on all of this.
:asian:

 

[IWishToLearn]

Interesting.

 

[Karatedrifter7]

I think he's good, If I was gonna switch Kenpo's it'd be his Kenpo 5.0.
Who doesnt have an ego? My instructor makes him look like the "Quiet Man"

Dave,

 

[Hand Sword]

I think any of the Parker trained seniors would be a good choice. All are valid.

 

[Doc_Jude]

Very interesting thread! Thank you.

Hey, you kenpo guys got it easy. Coming from the Bujinkan... hey, it's refreshing to actually have someone speak out against mega-dans in public, even if it takes him 40min :uhyeah:

That's kinda why I like my current Silat instructor. A guy asked him what his rank was, what were his qualifications? "Well, I don't know. Why don't you come over here and hit me?" "Hit you!?! How?" "However you like."
The guy left 5 minutes later and never came back.


PS: Hey Doc, some guys from Cliff Stewart's camp said to say howdy!

 

[HKphooey]

While he did make a lot of good points, I certainly hope that talk went on after the seminar had finished.

I went to several of his classes on the East coast back in the early 90's and he could really move then too.

I wonder if any of the other Kenpo mega-dans would like to comment on how often they achieved a red stipe on their belt though. Would be a nice comparison.

You bring up a vaild point... Does any one have, handy, the rank progression of all the "Seniors" after GM Parker's death and how did they earn/or were awarded that new rank?

 

[michaeledward]

That would be an interesting new thread.

 

[thetruth]

I don't know about Jeff's theories on traditional arts though. He presses the point that he has tested for every rank and that each rank in traditional systems take roughly an year for each dan level. 1+2+3+4+5+6+7=28. I'll use judo as an example. My old instructor graded to 7th dan about 3 or 4 years ago after 50 something years in the art. I don't mind him grading to 7th as it certainly has no effect on me but he should even suggest in the round about way he does that his grading period or method is even remotely similar. Plus the years of dan thing is wrong. Also after 5th dan in most traditional Japanese arts people are graded with regards to what they have given back to the art, the quality of students and time. I guarentee there would be more than 8 years between 7th and 8th dan. I also don't understand how people can grade in front of a panel consisting almost entirely of people from other arts. It seems odd to me.

Cheers
Sam:asian:

 

[amylong]

He presses the point that he has tested for every rank and that each rank in traditional systems take roughly an year for each dan level. 1+2+3+4+5+6+7=28.

Cheers
Sam:asian:

He told me he started when he was 21. I remember that he'd been in the art about a year longer than me. So, according to his time in rank, he got his black belt in roughly a year. I don't think he has been in rank as long as he claims for each level, but he has been in longer than since 85, at least according to what he told me. Maybe he was studying two kinds at once. I don't know.

--Amy

 

[HKphooey]

He told me he started when he was 21. I remember that he'd been in the art about a year longer than me. So, according to his time in rank, he got his black belt in roughly a year. I don't think he has been in rank as long as he claims for each level, but he has been in longer than since 85, at least according to what he told me. Maybe he was studying two kinds at once. I don't know.

--Amy

I beleive he started his MA training in 1978 while attending college.

 

[vishalshukla]

Like a lot of other people, I watched the YouTube interview with Mr. Speakman. There was something that I want to clarify. In the interview Mr. Speakman talks about how Mr. White’s students tried to surprise him with a promotion to 10th degree and he declined. That is a bit misleading. Here is what happened.

In 2003 one of Mr. White’s students, who has his own school and doesn’t train at BWKS anymore, arranged a tribute dinner for Mr. White and Mr. Bob Mitchell. This was to be a celebration to honor these two long time Kenpoists. As we got closer to the event Mr. White got a hunch that the student hosting the dinner was going to try and present him with a 10th. Mr. White made it very clear that he would not accept a 10th.

The dinner was going along nicely. Several guests like Mr. Speakman, Mr. Trejo and Mr. Dye were in attendance. Finally the host tried to present Mr. White a 10th. Mr. White politely and emphatically declined and the matter was dropped.

Mr. White’s current, loyal and active students know exactly how he feels about wearing a 10th. None of us were in support of the surprise promotion. We all agree that students don’t promote instructors, especially instructors who have made their feelings clear. When Mr. Speakman said that Mr. White’s students tried to promote him, that was not the case. It was one (former) student who was doing it for his own reasons.

In addition, since we are on the topic of the Speakman interview and the discussions related to it, I need to speak for all of us at BWKS and Mr. White himself. One Kenponet poster (DV Kenpo) made some comments that came off as negative towards Mr. LaBounty. He claimed that Mr. LaBounty’s Kenpo is not all Parkers Kenpo. He then made a later statement about how none of the real Kenpo Seniors would sign Mr. Speakman’s certificate.

If Sigung Steve LaBounty is not a real Senior, then nobody is. I don’t know of anybody who has worked harder and for longer to keep the Flame burning than Sigung LaBounty. Mr. White has often said that if anybody deserves to wear a 10th it is Mr. LaBounty but Sigung has too much respect for the art and Mr. Parker’s memory to ever put on a 10th. Instead he keeps teaching and producing top notch students. If you look at the Kenpo family tree a lot of very well known people got their start under Mr. LaBounty.

As far as claims that Mr. LaBounty doesn’t know the Parker system, if you don’t think his Kenpo is real and works, you are very wrong. A good Steve LaBounty body punch will help you a lot more than knowing the latest version of the extension to Locking Horns when the ***** hits the fan.

Speaking once again for all of us at BWKS, we are very proud to train under Mr. White and be affiliated with Mr. LaBounty. I can think of no finer representatives of our art than these two men.

Respectfully yours,
Vishal Shukla

 

[Brian Jones]

Wow!

Mr. Speakman managed to insult just about every senior (directly or by inference) in one interview. Pretty amazing.

Brian Jones