Is this allowed in MMA?

[Tez3]

This is that suplex I mentioned. We were watching that fight on TV. Everyone gasped, thought he might have broken his neck. But it's a legal move.

Probably because he wasn't really meant to land on his neck, precision can be difficult in an actual fight. Also that is Pride and they had a different rule set. When you say 'is it allowed in MMA' it's probably better to specify which promotion rather than just MMA.

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

This is that suplex I mentioned. We were watching that fight on TV. Everyone gasped, thought he might have broken his neck. But it's a legal move.

First of all, a big fat OUCH! Fair play to him for taking that and coming back.

Secondly it's a good job it happened on canvas and not concrete.

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

I'm not sure if you mean all MMA or UFC. In UFC you can't strike straight downward with the point of the elbow or strike the back of the head, or the spine.

I just meant MMA in general, I'm given to understand the rules can vary between franchises.

 

[Tez3]

I just meant MMA in general, I'm given to understand the rules can vary between franchises.

We don't have franchises in the UK or Europe. The rules can be very different between the promotions so saying MMA won't get you the answers you want. MMA is a general term anyway.

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

I think its more important to understand why Jimmy attempted to do the DLT in the first place; The guy he was trading blows with was larger than he was, and was messing him up pretty badly. Its a sound strategy in that situation, because the alternative is getting knocked out.

More important than what?

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

We don't have franchises in the UK or Europe. The rules can be very different between the promotions so saying MMA won't get you the answers you want. MMA is a general term anyway.

Question: How do you know which answers I want?

I didn't want to limit it to just one franchise, e.g. UFC, and I'm actually quite satisfied with the answers so far.

I take your point regarding the general nature of the term MMA though, perhaps I should have said reputable MMA competitions that I'm likely to come across on mainstream TV or YT.

 

[Hanzou]

Just because those were the circumstances in this particular instance, it doesn't necessarily follow that it will only work if all of those conditions are met.

True, but it was the example you used while seemingly ignoring the major factors at work.

In the end, there's more reliable takedown counters.

 

[Tez3]

Question: How do you know which answers I want?

I didn't want to limit it to just one franchise, e.g. UFC, and I'm actually quite satisfied with the answers so far.

I take your point regarding the general nature of the term MMA though, perhaps I should have said reputable MMA competitions that I'm likely to come across on mainstream TV or YT.

Why do you call them franchises?

How do I know the answers you want? I don't but when the question is vague how do WE know what answers you want?

There are no governing bodies for MMA as there are in TMA, there aren't any organisations than oversee or run MMA. There is the UFC which is a business (not a governing body) which because it's in America gets overseen by State bodies. Elsewhere there is nothing, when you say MMA how are we to know which promotions you mean. I can give you more than a dozen different promotions just off the top of my head which will all have different rules, that's in England, I can give you half a dozen more in Scotland and Wales. Northern Ireland, it's illegal. In Europe I can cite as many as a hundred maybe more, all with different rules, many are on mainstream television.
If I posted up and said 'is this move legal in martial arts' would you see the difficulty in answering? As for reputable, that's subjective, many think that the UFC is disreputable in the way it treats fighters, it's attitude to the drug cheats etc. The UFC is the subject of a good many debates but it is a business, making money for it's owners and if it has any stockholders. The rules on their fights will be those which they hope will produce the most entertaining fights to sell tickets, it has little to do with actual MMA, it's business.

 

[Transk53]

Why do you call them franchises?

How do I know the answers you want? I don't but when the question is vague how do WE know what answers you want?

There are no governing bodies for MMA as there are in TMA, there aren't any organisations than oversee or run MMA. There is the UFC which is a business (not a governing body) which because it's in America gets overseen by State bodies. Elsewhere there is nothing, when you say MMA how are we to know which promotions you mean. I can give you more than a dozen different promotions just off the top of my head which will all have different rules, that's in England, I can give you half a dozen more in Scotland and Wales. Northern Ireland, it's illegal. In Europe I can cite as many as a hundred maybe more, all with different rules, many are on mainstream television.
If I posted up and said 'is this move legal in martial arts' would you see the difficulty in answering? As for reputable, that's subjective, many think that the UFC is disreputable in the way it treats fighters, it's attitude to the drug cheats etc. The UFC is the subject of a good many debates but it is a business, making money for it's owners and if it has any stockholders. The rules on their fights will be those which they hope will produce the most entertaining fights to sell tickets, it has little to do with actual MMA, it's business.

Well said! Cung Le is now the obvious example. HGH, yeah whatever. The UFC are a disgrace of the up most profanity. It is always picking on the non commercial guy. Well I cannot back that up, just the way I feel about this.

 

[Tez3]

The UFC would change the rules in a second if they thought it would be entertaining enough to sell more tickets. The downward elbow would be allowed as would the soccer kick and the stomp.
The difference between what's allowed for entertainment sake and what's allowed for safety bear no resemblance to each other. It suit the UFC to say there are moves too dangerous to be used because it's hypes up the fights as being far more dangerous than they are. It also appeases any authorities concerned about the 'brutality', they can tell them they have taken the most dangerous moves out. Win, win for business.

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

Why do you call them franchises?

How do I know the answers you want? I don't but when the question is vague how do WE know what answers you want?

There are no governing bodies for MMA as there are in TMA, there aren't any organisations than oversee or run MMA. There is the UFC which is a business (not a governing body) which because it's in America gets overseen by State bodies. Elsewhere there is nothing, when you say MMA how are we to know which promotions you mean. I can give you more than a dozen different promotions just off the top of my head which will all have different rules, that's in England, I can give you half a dozen more in Scotland and Wales. Northern Ireland, it's illegal. In Europe I can cite as many as a hundred maybe more, all with different rules, many are on mainstream television.
If I posted up and said 'is this move legal in martial arts' would you see the difficulty in answering? As for reputable, that's subjective, many think that the UFC is disreputable in the way it treats fighters, it's attitude to the drug cheats etc. The UFC is the subject of a good many debates but it is a business, making money for it's owners and if it has any stockholders. The rules on their fights will be those which they hope will produce the most entertaining fights to sell tickets, it has little to do with actual MMA, it's business.

I used franchises because I thought Id heard ppl refer to UFC & Bellator as such, I'll switch to promotions though if that's the commonly accepted term?

I wanted to leave it open for people to answer on whichever promotions they chose to and not limit it to just one.

I admitted my ignorance on the subject in the OP, so as far as I knew the answer could have been any one of it's allowed everywhere, nowhere, or somewhere.

Perhaps renowned would have been a more appropriate word in that post than reputable. Or popular.

 

[Tez3]

I used franchises because I thought Id heard ppl refer to UFC & Bellator as such, I'll switch to promotions though if that's the commonly accepted term?

I wanted to leave it open for people to answer on whichever promotions they chose to and not limit it to just one.

I admitted my ignorance on the subject in the OP, so as far as I knew the answer could have been any one of it's allowed everywhere, nowhere, or somewhere.

Perhaps renowned would have been a more appropriate word in that post than reputable. Or popular.

Notorious?

It may be that Americans use the word 'franchise' differently from us? A franchise here is where a big business sells someone a licence to sell that big business's stuff.

MMA rules are decided by market forces not martial arts, fighters, coaches or gyms.

Talking about MMA rules is a bit like plaiting fog or rounding up cats I'm afraid, for every 'yes' it's allowed you will get a 'no', sorry!

 

[drop bear]

There's a rule in place that disallows purposely "spiking" your opponent to the canvas on his head or neck. But I've never seen it enforced. And I'm not sure what the details of "spiking" would be.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Basically picking them up and dropping them on the top of their head or anything that can lead to a broken neck ( like the scrum in rugby) I've never seen anyone attempt to do it in an MMA comp, it's actually more difficult than it seems besides despite what fighters may say when hyping their fights up they don't actually intent to hurt their opponent that much.

UFC 16: Frank Shamrock vs Igor Zinoviev. Shamrock picked Zinoviev up and basically tried to drive him head first through the canvas. A normal human being with an actual neck probably would have been killed. I believe they added the "no spiking" rule after that incident.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

UFC 16: Frank Shamrock vs Igor Zinoviev. Shamrock picked Zinoviev up and basically tried to drive him head first through the canvas. A normal human being with an actual neck probably would have been killed. I believe they added the "no spiking" rule after that incident.

BTW, you can watch the entire match on YouTube. Zinoviev suffered a broken collarbone and a fractured vertebrae. He never fought again.

 

[Transk53]

The UFC would change the rules in a second if they thought it would be entertaining enough to sell more tickets. The downward elbow would be allowed as would the soccer kick and the stomp.
The difference between what's allowed for entertainment sake and what's allowed for safety bear no resemblance to each other. It suit the UFC to say there are moves too dangerous to be used because it's hypes up the fights as being far more dangerous than they are. It also appeases any authorities concerned about the 'brutality', they can tell them they have taken the most dangerous moves out. Win, win for business.

Yeah. The amazing thing for is the hype surrounding UFC. The fighters are obviously skilled and put a lot in, but a good lot of the bouts I have seen, just go straight to submission. Trying to remember that Irish fella from a lower weight division. He wants to stand up and have a scrap, most do not that I have seen.

 

[Tez3]

Yeah. The amazing thing for is the hype surrounding UFC. The fighters are obviously skilled and put a lot in, but a good lot of the bouts I have seen, just go straight to submission. Trying to remember that Irish fella from a lower weight division. He wants to stand up and have a scrap, most do not that I have seen.

Cathal Pendred? From Eire, he's one of John Kavanagh's lads, very good at BJJ and stand up. John is a cracking coach.

 

[RTKDCMB]

This is that suplex I mentioned. We were watching that fight on TV. Everyone gasped, thought he might have broken his neck. But it's a legal move.

That could have turned out worse. That is one way professional wrestling (WWE) is a risky endeavor, It just takes one person to mess up once and its all over.

 

[Tez3]

That could have turned out worse. That is one way professional wrestling (WWE) is a risky endeavor, It just takes one person to mess up once and its all over.

I watched a documentary on professional wrestling, how it's choreographed, how they practice etc and for all that there are still moves that go wrong. I believe one chap broke his neck when something went askew. If it goes wrong with two guys working together how much more wrong can it go when two guys are actually fighting.

PS hope I didn't give away that pro wrestling isn't real lol.

 

[Reedone816]

imho spiking in mma contex is more like vertical movement like pile driver, so they think suplex is not in that criteria.
while downward elbow, only for 12 to 6 elbow that is banned, while 11 to 7 is permissible...
99 facts for the diehard MMA fan, Part 4 - Mixed Martial Arts News

393. UFC 28 - The New Jersey Athletic Control Board sanctions its first UFC event, using the newly developed Unified Rules of Mixed Martial Arts. Major changes to the UFC's rules included barring knee strikes to the head of a downed opponent, and elbow strikes to the spine and neck. Limits on permissible ring attire, stringent medical requirements, and regulatory oversight were also introduced. A new weight class system was also introduced. This new set of rules is currently the de facto standard for MMA events held in the USA and is still in use by the UFC.

btw. from one fc website rules, there is nowhere mentioned that biting is illegal, only spitting is...

Illegal Techniques:

Stomps to the head Head Butting Hair Pulling Eye Gouging

Orifice Insertion Spitting Grabbing onto the cage fence