I wish World Taekwondo didn't allow knockout kicks

[Jared Traveler]

It just sounds like a really strange situation, unless for example your kicks were on them when they were already out of bounds, or you were not kicking in the target area, or you were in a low-contact bracket and so high contact was not allowed. In my experience, there's plenty of mis-judging that goes on, but if you got such a blatant strike, then the two most likely explanations are that you didn't have a legal strike (something that you should have known going into the match) or that the judges were corrupt.

As an example, I've seen first-hand people DQ'd from TKD competitions because they grabbed the other person's chestguard and punched them in the face. Which is something they should have known when they signed up.

It's unexplainable to me. I was a decent kicker at that time. I was an 18 year old construction worker, pretty fit, flexible and accurate enough. I was probably a blue belt at the time. It was a solid kick just below his chest. They acted like it didn't even happen. I wasn't raised to question authority much, so I didn't ask or say anything.

But one thing was clear to me, that opponent had zero chance of beating me in any real fight, yet he won. That just didn't make sense to me, and my interest dropped in TKD.

 

[windwalker099]

Some may be to young to know, or not remember
back in the day,,,

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I was landing solid kicks and not getting points awarded.

In those point system tournament, in order to get your point, when you kick/punch, you have to:

1. pull back your kick/punch as fast as you can.
2. scream as loud as you can.
3. turn your head to look at the judge right way.

1 is the most import. the fast that you can pull back your kick/punch, the more power that judge may think that you have delivered.

I hate no face contact tournament.

- You throw a punch and pull back just 1 inch away from your opponent's face.
- Your opponent turns his face around, bites his lip, and draws blood.
- You get disqualified.

I still remember that no matter how hard that you may land your hammer fist on top of your opponent's head, you won't get any point. Also the MT shin bone roundhouse kick won't get you any point.

 

[tkdroamer]

This was exactly why I got out of TKD. I was landing solid kicks and not getting points awarded. Once I literally side kicked someone on their butt and he slid out of the contest area and no point. Then he touched a kick on me and got a point. I transitioned to judo/Sambo. The tap outs didn't lie.

Point tournaments are all about speed and accuracy. The people who win a lot have learned how to exploit the rules. What that means is they practice techniques to manipulate the match to their advantage, not so much for what would be 'real world' effective.
In the WT environment, there are three things required to be a point. The first, and usually most difficult, is a clear and unimpeded kick/strike to a legally defined area. If the technique is brushed or redirected at all, it is not a point. I suspect this is where your frustration emanated from. The same conditions apply to the second & third kind of points which are knockdowns and knockouts. But the speed and dynamics usually involved in these techniques could 'blur' things to the point it is hard for the human eye to register what is happening in real time.
In the days before the e-hogu, there were some theatrics. Some simply from raw emotions (which used to be frowned upon but not illegal), some to highlight a strike in the hope to draw a point. You still see this today. Contestants will become animated after a strike, even when the calculation for points is mostly taken out of human decision making.
A kick to the butt has never been a legal point in any TKD tournament I am aware of.

 

[skribs]

Point tournaments are all about speed and accuracy. The people who win a lot have learned how to exploit the rules. What that means is they practice techniques to manipulate the match to their advantage, not so much for what would be 'real world' effective.
In the WT environment, there are three things required to be a point. The first, and usually most difficult, is a clear and unimpeded kick/strike to a legally defined area. If the technique is brushed or redirected at all, it is not a point. I suspect this is where your frustration emanated from. The same conditions apply to the second & third kind of points which are knockdowns and knockouts. But the speed and dynamics usually involved in these techniques could 'blur' things to the point it is hard for the human eye to register what is happening in real time.
In the days before the e-hogu, there were some theatrics. Some simply from raw emotions (which used to be frowned upon but not illegal), some to highlight a strike in the hope to draw a point. You still see this today. Contestants will become animated after a strike, even when the calculation for points is mostly taken out of human decision making.
A kick to the butt has never been a legal point in any TKD tournament I am aware of.

I took it to mean he side kicked them, and that side kick put them on their butt (as in made them fall over).

 

[Dirty Dog]

This was exactly why I got out of TKD. I was landing solid kicks and not getting points awarded. Once I literally side kicked someone on their butt and he slid out of the contest area and no point. Then he touched a kick on me and got a point. I transitioned to judo/Sambo. The tap outs didn't lie.

If your concern is winning a contest, then I can see why that mattered to you.

 

[Jared Traveler]

If your concern is winning a contest, then I can see why that mattered to you.

Help me understand this comment in light of my previous explanation of my mindset, reaction and motives?

 

[skribs]

Help me understand this comment in light of my previous explanation of my mindset, reaction and motives?

I think the idea is that you said you don't care about winning, but yet the fact you didn't win seemed to push you to another art means that winning does matter.

I think I get your point, though. It's like in video games. It's one thing to die because you made a mistake. It's another thing to die because of lag.

I'm still operating under the assumption that there's something in the rules that you missed is why your score didn't count.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Help me understand this comment in light of my previous explanation of my mindset, reaction and motives?

You stated that your view of the judging in a tournament contributed to leaving the art. Which doesn't seem to fit very well with your statement that you don't care about winning.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I think the idea is that you said you don't care about winning, but yet the fact you didn't win seemed to push you to another art means that winning does matter.

Pretty much.

I think I get your point, though. It's like in video games. It's one thing to die because you made a mistake. It's another thing to die because of lag.

Not really. That's only if you care. Doesn't bother me in the slightest either way.

 

[Jared Traveler]

You stated that your view of the judging in a tournament contributed to leaving the art. Which doesn't seem to fit very well with your statement that you don't care about winning.

Ah. I see why you might be make that statement, let me reiterate and explain further. As stated when I left, I went to submission grappling arts. To do that as a black belt in Hapkido and a brown belt in TKD takes a lot of humility. Because day 1 you tap out to judo/jujitsu yellow belts.

And you continue to get twisted, thrown, slammed, stretched, pinned, and choked repeatedly for years before you start winning. That wasn't a problem, I was happy to lose. Because I was truly being beaten and I was learning to fight.

So no it wasn't the losing that bothered me. Competition was never the event for me, just training for the real event.