How much self-defense do you think you really need?

[JadecloudAlchemist]

How much self defense do I think I need?
As much as I can have and use.

 

[chinto]

How much self defense do I think I need?
As much as I can have and use.

yep.. and maybe a bit more.. for its better to be tried by 12 then to be carried by 6!!

 

[Darth F.Takeda]

How much SD do you need? I think the answer to this question depends on "what 'battle' you're training to fight." To paraphrase a statement from a member on another forum: "Most schools/instructors/systems are great at preparing someone for a "low-level" attacker, some are able to prepare you for an "average" attacker, very very few are able to prepare you for the worst case scenario."
I often ask my students "who are you training to beat?" I try gear my training for the true monsters, the kind of recidivist criminals who just got through doing hard time in one of our gladiator academies--I mean prisons--and as a result are even more warped than when they went in and are also able to bench twice their body weight because they've done nothing but work out for the last X-number of years. With that kind of opponent in mind, I would say the training requirement is pretty darn high.

Can I carry a weapon without fear? Sure, but why would I limit my options? I don't carry a pistol, knives, etc. because I'm "afraid," I do it because by doing so I have the ability to deal with more situations than I might be able to deal with if all I had was my empty hands (e.g. the aforementioned monsters). As Brian said, it's prepared, not paranoid.

I don't should really be a determining factor. Sure, some areas are much more "dangerous" than others; however, violence happens everywhere. Just because you live in the "good" part of town and don't venture into the "hood" doesn't mean you are exempt from being targeted.

We are alot alike.
I tell my studensts they need to picture the meanest, biggest, evilist, ex con psycho they ever met or saw on a prison doc and train to kill him.

Bad things happen in nice areas as wel as in bad. Not as much but they still can and do. Some criminals have the brains and the balls to go where the money is.
The addition of the Virginaia Railway Express, from Fred. to DC, with a station by my nice hood, has brought some people into it at times you knew did not belong and where up to no good, so I watch out and so does my lady.

How much do you need? Thats a personal decision.
I think everyone should learn some basics and refresh periodically.
Are school is very SD orientated, but also is about preserving the art.
You can still have a good time and be good people while trainintg top kill or maim the wicked, I never saw the point in McDojo recreation, if your going to train in a fighting art, train in a serious school or take up Yoga.

Shugyo!

 

[Darth F.Takeda]

Through proper training and guidence one can become very proficient in self defence and will not lose his / her sense of humanity. In the martial arts one is taught balance in every thing physical and mental, this includes,
* if you are taught to destroy then you should be taught to create,
* if you are taught to injure than you should learn to heal,
* to understanding what evil is one should understand what humanity is,
By knowing / understanding the extreme opposite ends of something you will have the two bench marks needed in order to understand where you really are.
Many of today's assault victum's live in the very quiet area's. Because one lives in such an area does not mean that their guard should be down. They should instead keep their relaxed awareness on.
:asian:

Balance pretains.

You make a great point.
7 years back I had hopes of getting into the Military (I got asthma, long story) and I took a year to train myself mentally and physically, to not only suppress my condition but to be better trained than the average enlistee (When your Sempai is SF, it rubs oof and he encouraged my approach. Also growing up around vets and hearing stories of being undertrained for Vietnam made an impression, real warriors train more than the standard.).
One problem arouse though, I became more aggressive than I was as a teen. Not a bully or sticking my nose into stuff, but I was more aggressive when confronted. Arguments with my lady became very heated, I adopted a win at all cost, dont back down mentallity for awhile.
When it became clear that there was no hope in being able to enlist for combat arms, I knew I had to re center myself.
Started getting in touch with my "softer" side, started to meditate, explore my religeous/spirtitual beliefs and stopped playing first person shooter games for awhile (If you play them with a mind of training for tactics and the stimules/response of engageing and dropping targets and being ruthless, they do effect you.) and got back inot listening to music more than watching TV (especially the news).
I do see why many MA's have a spiritual side. Sure sometimes it's esoteric BS and overboard cult like new age stuff, but I do see why warriors explored that side more and more as they aged.
I have warned my Kohai to watch out for becomeing to aggressive and to fixated on piossable threats.

 

[Darth F.Takeda]

Another thing to think about (but not all the time, or you might find yourself living in the woods with nutcases.) is that you cant rely on society and civillization staying as it is. History is full of radical changes, collapses, wars, natural desasters and such. Nothing is certian but death.

My buddy used to half joke that it's a "Mad Max Future!"

I saw a little bit of that durring Hurricane Andrew first hand.
Look at New Orleans durring Katrina, the Overtown riots of 89, the LA riots, where the violence spread out of the slums and into nicer areas.

Before 9-11, new a number of aquantences and even friends who looked at me as a bit off, for training MA with the slant that I do, firearms training and bringing up the above subject when asked why I train and think like I do.
Right after 9-11 they all were asking me about training and I even got the "I thought you were a parinoid survivalist, but now I realize you just took your head out of the ground before most of us."

 

[jamz]

Take some time and really think about how much threat you really have in daily life and ask yourself what your daily needs are.

Thanks.

You don't need it at all, until you need it.

 

[geezer]

This is something I asked myself a few months ago... well it's something I've asked myself all the time and I finally did something about it.

I'm a 38 yo white male computer programmer living a fairly upper-middle income lifestyle. The odds are in my favor that nothing un-toward will happen to me.

I was in a school that was all self-defense. And I took it deadly seriously, probably too seriously. I found myself simultaneously realizing that I was spending an awful lot of time and focus training for something that, realistically, odds were good would never happen. I mean, maybe some day it would happen, but 18-20 hours a week in class is a lot of time to be spending on something that unlikely. Like spending 20 hours at the local batting cage just in case you get that call to the major leagues.... you need a bit of a sense of perspective. Worse off, I was getting into a mentality where I was *hoping* something would happen just to get a chance to use everything I was practicing. It's one thing to be aware of your surroundings when going to the grocery store...it's another to be secretly hoping someone in the parking lot would try something. I felt that that was a very unhealthy mental state to be in. So I realized I needed a slightly different approach and I ended up in a school that still takes MA seriously as self-defense, but also provides some sport opportunities and I find that helps my mindset immensely in providing an outlet or release for my mental state of wanting to do "something" with the time I spend in class.

Yeah, I think it's important to take your training seriously in what MA is intended to be about, but I think you need a rational perspective on what it means in your life as a whole. For some people, due to their jobs and situations, that's a lot more than others

Sorry to disagree with what a lot of folks have posted, but I think the "freep" has a good point. A lot of people get really deep into self-defense training, imagining themselves up against the baddest dude out there. Then, after investing hours upon hours, training the most ruthless techniques, a part of them secretly "hopes" something will happen. I call that a recipe for disaster. Better to train awareness and avoidance, and work at being the best martial artist you can be.

 

[tempus]

I believe I need as much as I can get. I train for the possibility that I may have to use that training someday. I work and live in nice areas. Do I go out into the workd everyday paranoid no, but I do make sure I am aware of what is going on around me. How many people were out for a walk in a nice mall with family friends when they take a bullet to the back? Anything can happen at any time.

My father also drilled into me that when I was older that I should have firearms in the house, which I do. If there is ever a national crisis the police will not be there for you. They have families to take care of as well. Plus a million people swarming from a city, some will be helpful and some will just want to take. It is a bad thing to think about, but "It is better to have it and not use it, then to need it and not have it".

-Gary

 

[Shuto]

How much self-defense do I need?

With my current lifestyle and habits I consider heart disease and slipping on ice a greater danger to my well being than physical violence directed towards me. It's a good thing that MA training helps me with all of these potential threats.

 

[MJS]

Take some time and really think about how much threat you really have in daily life and ask yourself what your daily needs are.

Some of us are in very dangerous areas and some of us are in the suburbs, some of us are out in public every single day, creatures of habit, others have more leisure opportunities than others ... there are many factors really.

But what I find interesting is while there is a *strong* need by some for some on this board, I have been pondering the Urban Warrior axiom and some knock-off questions like, can you be prepared and not lose your sense of humanity? and can you walk without fear AND without a weapon? and various other fever-induced questions over the last few days.

Thanks.

I think that many times, people feel that because they don't work, live or frequent 'bad' areas, that they don't need as much SD compared to someone who is the complete opposite. However, just because you may live in a low crime area, not frequent bad sections, etc., doesn't mean, IMO, that one should neglect training.

I live in a pretty crime free town. Sure, some minor things happen, compared to some of the larger cities, where shootings are an everyday thing, but just a few weeks ago, at a bar not far from where I live, there was a double shooting. I was shocked when I saw this on the news.

Personally, Id rather be over prepared, than under prepared.

 

[MJS]

This is something I asked myself a few months ago... well it's something I've asked myself all the time and I finally did something about it.

I'm a 38 yo white male computer programmer living a fairly upper-middle income lifestyle. The odds are in my favor that nothing un-toward will happen to me.

I was in a school that was all self-defense. And I took it deadly seriously, probably too seriously. I found myself simultaneously realizing that I was spending an awful lot of time and focus training for something that, realistically, odds were good would never happen. I mean, maybe some day it would happen, but 18-20 hours a week in class is a lot of time to be spending on something that unlikely. Like spending 20 hours at the local batting cage just in case you get that call to the major leagues.... you need a bit of a sense of perspective. Worse off, I was getting into a mentality where I was *hoping* something would happen just to get a chance to use everything I was practicing. It's one thing to be aware of your surroundings when going to the grocery store...it's another to be secretly hoping someone in the parking lot would try something. I felt that that was a very unhealthy mental state to be in. So I realized I needed a slightly different approach and I ended up in a school that still takes MA seriously as self-defense, but also provides some sport opportunities and I find that helps my mindset immensely in providing an outlet or release for my mental state of wanting to do "something" with the time I spend in class.

Yeah, I think it's important to take your training seriously in what MA is intended to be about, but I think you need a rational perspective on what it means in your life as a whole. For some people, due to their jobs and situations, that's a lot more than others

Sorry to disagree with what a lot of folks have posted, but I think the "freep" has a good point. A lot of people get really deep into self-defense training, imagining themselves up against the baddest dude out there. Then, after investing hours upon hours, training the most ruthless techniques, a part of them secretly "hopes" something will happen. I call that a recipe for disaster. Better to train awareness and avoidance, and work at being the best martial artist you can be.

For the most part, I agree with both posts. I don't think that we should constantly hope that something happens so we can test ourselves. I do think that its a mistake to assume that because we live or work in what seems to be a 'safe' area, that nothing will ever happen to us. Cheshire, CT. is a pretty upscale town, yet a while back, there was a home invasion, which resulted in one person getting badly beaten, and his wife and two daughters killed. This man was a highly respected doctor. I'm sure nobody ever dreamed something like that would happen, but it did.

Personally, I'd rather train for the worst and not need it, than to be too lax in my training and need something I never got.

Mike

 

[chinto]

For the most part, I agree with both posts. I don't think that we should constantly hope that something happens so we can test ourselves. I do think that its a mistake to assume that because we live or work in what seems to be a 'safe' area, that nothing will ever happen to us. Cheshire, CT. is a pretty upscale town, yet a while back, there was a home invasion, which resulted in one person getting badly beaten, and his wife and two daughters killed. This man was a highly respected doctor. I'm sure nobody ever dreamed something like that would happen, but it did.

Personally, I'd rather train for the worst and not need it, than to be too lax in my training and need something I never got.

Mike

I will put it this way, Katrina and the riots in LA and 911 and any other natural disaster will result in you being on your own for a bit. earth quake .. lots of things.. forest fire too.
At that point.. and even before as the cops do not have a duty to protect you or your family, you may have to do it your self! now no one who is half way intelligent wants to fight if they can avoid it, but if it goes that bad, you will not be able to avoid it!
so prepare for the worst, and be very aware and hope you never do have to use that training or the weapons I hope you own and know how to use too.

 

[sgtmac_46]

The question of how much self-defense you need is a lot like asking how much health or life insurance you need.....you don't need any if nothing bad happens....and if something bad DOES happen, what you bought never seems like enough.

More to the point, in order to be a fully independent and self-actualized human being, it necessitates that you be prepared for most conceivable eventualities....many folks buy first aid kits and a supply of food and water in case some event occurs where they are unable to receive immediate assistance....yet those same people feel paranoid in preparing for violence in that same situation.

'How much self-defense do you think you really need?' That question can only be answered if you KNEW what the future would hold. We seldom put just enough gas in our car to get us to our destination if we're capable of filling up the tank...why?

 

[Imua Kuntao]

The real question should be "How much self-defense should you know"? You should train with every size person short, big, skinniy, fat, tall, many opponents, with and without weapons, and of course females. There are many situations and you might not get to them all because they all take time, a lifetime.

 

[shesulsa]

This is all fine and well so far and great replies, folks. Keep them coming!

My major area of concern is there is a fervent desire for preparedness by many of us and I worry ... occasionally ... that this can be dissuading to others wanting to step foot in the world of self-defense, especially women. It would be easy to look at people like us and call us paranoid, living in fear.

Some of us are preparing (if not prepared already) for the worst case possible scenarios in life. We see this is sensible; others may view this as neurotic.

So are you preparing for guerrilla warfare? Are you preparing for religious persecution? Nuclear warfare?

 

[Xue Sheng]

My major area of concern is there is a fervent desire for preparedness by many of us and I worry ... occasionally ... that this can be dissuading to others wanting to step foot in the world of self-defense, especially women. It would be easy to look at people like us and call us paranoid, living in fear.

Some of us are preparing (if not prepared already) for the worst case possible scenarios in life. We see this is sensible; others may view this as neurotic.

I train martial arts because I enjoy it, because it is good for health and I can defend myself if necessary. I train to get more of an attitude like that of my sifus and past teachers to be comfortable in my own skin and aware of my surroundings so I likely do not need to fight at all. I do not consider myself paranoid or living in fear. As I previously stated I was in a situation that gave me the feeling that I was not going to win but I was not afraid or paranoid if that were in NYC (or any major US city) I would have been dead on in my feeling but I was more worried about those I was with I had resigned myself to the fact that I was at best going to give them time to get away. And that awareness I attribute to my MA training and Qigong training as well. Luckily I had misjudged the situation and nothing came of it hopefully I never find myself there again but if I do I hope to be better prepared that is all.

So are you preparing for guerrilla warfare? Are you preparing for religious persecution? Nuclear warfare?

Religious persecution!? Well my family history has it in it but none trained MA or fighting they basically got kicked out of a country (Ok there was a bit more than religious persecution there but it was part of it) and later snuck away in the night to avoid being killed in another country and that was hard core religious persecution.

As for the rest if I was I would not be training CMA or even Sanda for that matter I would be looking more to modern weapons for training although Sanda is modern Kung Fu for the military it is a last resort after guns and if I were training for any of what you mentioned I would be training more with Guns.

Except of course nuclear warfare then I would be training Duck and Cover :uhyeah:

 

[geezer]

I believe I need as much as I can get. I train for the possibility that I may have to use that training someday. I work and live in nice areas. Do I go out into the workd everyday paranoid no, but I do make sure I am aware of what is going on around me. How many people were out for a walk in a nice mall with family friends when they take a bullet to the back? Anything can happen at any time.

My father also drilled into me that when I was older that I should have firearms in the house, which I do. If there is ever a national crisis the police will not be there for you. They have families to take care of as well. Plus a million people swarming from a city, some will be helpful and some will just want to take. It is a bad thing to think about, but "It is better to have it and not use it, then to need it and not have it".

-Gary

OK, my problem with the super-survivalist state of mind is not that I don't believe that you should be prepared. I agree with that. It's just that if you expect the worst, you are likely to find it... or create it! It all really boils down to attitude. Many years ago I was assisting a friend who taught a self defense class. A student in the class confided in me that he would not continue after the end of the current session since he need to save his money to buy more guns. Why? To prepare for the invasion from Mexico. "Oh", I responded. "Why not do what I'm doing...take Spanish classes". El que a hierro mata, a hierro muere.

 

[Bodhisattva]

Take some time and really think about how much threat you really have in daily life and ask yourself what your daily needs are.

Some of us are in very dangerous areas and some of us are in the suburbs, some of us are out in public every single day, creatures of habit, others have more leisure opportunities than others ... there are many factors really.

But what I find interesting is while there is a *strong* need by some for some on this board, I have been pondering the Urban Warrior axiom and some knock-off questions like, can you be prepared and not lose your sense of humanity? and can you walk without fear AND without a weapon? and various other fever-induced questions over the last few days.

Thanks.

I don't think I'll ever be in a "fight" or a "defense" situation again in this lifetime.

The "awareness" stage is the most important stage of self-defense and that has kept me safe for the past 12 years without a single altercation.

However, I do train in martial arts for reasons of utility - I train as if I might someday have to defend myself. That doesn't mean I promote a grim spirit at our studio - quite the opposite. But we train for utility - for functional self-defense.

We just do it with a smile and a lot of fun and play.

So, while I don't live my life paranoid that I "need to defend myself" I do still train for effectiveness / utility.

But mostly because its fun.

 

[arnisador]

More to the point, in order to be a fully independent and self-actualized human being, it necessitates that you be prepared for most conceivable eventualities....many folks buy first aid kits and a supply of food and water in case some event occurs where they are unable to receive immediate assistance....yet those same people feel paranoid in preparing for violence in that same situation.

Well...one can only go so far in preparing and still have good quality of life. In addition, there are trade-offs. Do I put all my time in CQC training in case of attack, or in amassing wealth so I'll be likely to be able to stay away from problem areas? If I'm worried about nuclear attacks I should move to the far countryside, but if I'm worried about heart attacks I shouldn't be so far from a hospital.

The real question should be "How much self-defense should you know"?

I think that's a fair question.

The fact that so few martial artists own and learn how to use firearms is evidence to my mind that self-defense/self-preservation is not their primary goal. (And that's OK.) Earthquakes? Riots? Choose a shotgun over a side kick.

 

[kidswarrior]

Except of course nuclear warfare then I would be training Duck and Cover :uhyeah:

Any old timers here remember the 50s when the air raid sirens went off for the once-a-month drill in every city, and we grade schoolers had to duck and cover. Yeah, those little student desks would be great protection for a nuclear attack. But the other possibilities, yeah I guess those are part of why I train.

This says it best:

I train martial arts because I enjoy it, because it is good for health and I can defend myself if necessary. I train to get more of an attitude like that of my sifus and past teachers to be comfortable in my own skin and aware of my surroundings so I likely do not need to fight at all.